Toronto Time and Space Condos | 101.8m | 29s | Pemberton | Wallman Architects

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I think some members need to get off their high horse and allow others to have an opinion. Or maybe perhaps find a hobby. Not targeted at anyone in particular, just saying.

If you read my whole post you would note that it said "Though I think it could have been a FAR better building and still provided good homes and profit, it is your right to think it's perfect the way it is but if you like the building you really need to give us reasons. (Amazing spandrel, fantastic airy POPS, enhances the neighbourhood?)" I was trying (unsuccessfully so far) to get MORE opinions and. maybe more importantly, reasons for them. Just saying you 'love' something, or 'hate' something, is really not useful.

 

[WeirdFishes]

Knowing how this project, and many others of its eras were priced. You should know that all buildings in this area that sold during that period opened at around $650/SF. With the current market price approaching $1200/SF, all the buyers have not only almost doubled the value of their properties, but have mostly made a profit of than 5x their investment in deposits.

Even the later phase buyers who paid a lot more have seen their property value increase 50%.

If I were a buyer, I’d be pretty happy and the only desperation I’d have would be in trying to hold back my apparent satisfaction.

What does this have to do with urban planning, development or architecture? I think you missed the brief when you started to engage in this thread and your responses are clearly bias and now borderline trolling.

And if you really want to go there, I can give you a million reasons why this building is a bad investment (aside from the major issues with the build and overall design). But we'd have to shift this discussion to the 'Real Estate' thread, where this type of discussion belongs. Not here.

 

[interchange42]

Public warning here, for members in general.

It's not trolling to post "loving how this is turning out" following someone else simply posting a photo update.

If you disagree about their statement, fine, feel free to disagree in a follow-up post, but don't stoop to "are you being paid to say X?" You cannot gain anything from a question like that. In the unlikely event that it's true (the chance of it being true is very small) the member will never admit it, while in the infinitely more likely event that the member simply has an opposing viewpoint, you'll have offended them, and no surprise when they don't take the rest of your post seriously.

Let's try to keep disagreements civil please. Argue the points of the projects, not the qualities of the other members. It is helpful to post why you like something if the current is running the other way, but for those in the majority, remember that there is no rule that everyone must agree whether any project is getting a thumbs up or a thumbs down. You get your opinion, but others get theirs too.

42

 

[Riseth]

November 18, 2021

 

[Blixtein]

Effing monster.

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

Public warning here, for members in general.

It's not trolling to post "loving how this is turning out" following someone else simply posting a photo update.

If you disagree about their statement, fine, feel free to disagree in a follow-up post, but don't stoop to "are you being paid to say X?" You cannot gain anything from a question like that. In the unlikely event that it's true (the chance of it being true is very small) the member will never admit it, while in the infinitely more likely event that the member simply has an opposing viewpoint, you'll have offended them, and no surprise when they don't take the rest of your post seriously.

Let's try to keep disagreements civil please. Argue the points of the projects, not the qualities of the other members. It is helpful to post why you like something if the current is running the other way, but for those in the majority, remember that there is no rule that everyone must agree whether any project is getting a thumbs up or a thumbs down. You get your opinion, but others get theirs too.

42

Yeah...that really gets into the pointless "Stop liking what I don't like!" narrative when they do that. So don't do that folks! >.<

 

[DSC]

Yeah...that really gets into the pointless "Stop liking what I don't like!" narrative when they do that. So don't do that folks! >.<

Yes, simply saying "I luv it" or "POS" really adds nothing to the conversation about this, or any, building and is going to change no minds. One may think either 'basic' opinion (Love vs Hate) is wrong but it's impossible to actually discuss it unless we have reasons. One can disagree with 'reasons' by offering better ones or better comparisons or even reasons why something is necessary even if it is not aesthetically pleasing (that, of course, is very subjective!). Some UTers like this particular building because it provides housing; I doubt many disagree on that score but, in my opinion, that is not enough. If one likes a building only because it provides housing we may as well all stop coming here and just fill our City with rectangular boxes with nail salons on the street level. If you object to height or massing, if you love the contrasts between the black and the white spandrel etc etc. we can discuss and offer comparisons. UT is (I think) a DISCUSSION Forum - time to get back to discussing!

 

[TheSix]

Yes, simply saying "I luv it" or "POS" really adds nothing to the conversation about this, or any, building and is going to change no minds. One may think either 'basic' opinion (Love vs Hate) is wrong but it's impossible to actually discuss it unless we have reasons. One can disagree with 'reasons' by offering better ones or better comparisons or even reasons why something is necessary even if it is not aesthetically pleasing (that, of course, is very subjective!). Some UTers like this particular building because it provides housing; I doubt many disagree on that score but, in my opinion, that is not enough. If one likes a building only because it provides housing we may as well all stop coming here and just fill our City with rectangular boxes with nail salons on the street level. If you object to height or massing, if you love the contrasts between the black and the white spandrel etc etc. we can discuss and offer comparisons. UT is (I think) a DISCUSSION Forum - time to get back to discussing!

Great point.

And on that note:

1. The project massing is too heavy for this area – I think mostly because of the massive floor plate.
2. The street level feels overbearing and lacks personality – almost distracting you from everything that's amazing about this area.
3. The cladding is messy and very cheap looking – It lacks uniformity and the use of spandrel feels excessive.
4. The colour doesn't fit well in the neighbourhood – black and white spandrel feels out of place and really disrupts the flow of the brown brick style that surrounds it. I wouldn't be as opposed to this if the building actually brought something positive to the area.
5. The project lacks any architectural qualities – it is an overwhelming box that does the opposite of elevating a neighbourhood.

I don't find anything positive about this project. But maybe I'm wrong?

 

[GTAConstruction]

Yes, simply saying "I luv it" or "POS" really adds nothing to the conversation about this, or any, building and is going to change no minds. One may think either 'basic' opinion (Love vs Hate) is wrong but it's impossible to actually discuss it unless we have reasons. One can disagree with 'reasons' by offering better ones or better comparisons or even reasons why something is necessary even if it is not aesthetically pleasing (that, of course, is very subjective!). Some UTers like this particular building because it provides housing; I doubt many disagree on that score but, in my opinion, that is not enough. If one likes a building only because it provides housing we may as well all stop coming here and just fill our City with rectangular boxes with nail salons on the street level. If you object to height or massing, if you love the contrasts between the black and the white spandrel etc etc. we can discuss and offer comparisons. UT is (I think) a DISCUSSION Forum - time to get back to discussing!

It is extremely difficult for a new member to respond to a SUPERSTAR! lol
But I'm not sure that repeating one negative thing over and over will help the discussion either.

 

[DSC]

It is extremely difficult for a new member to respond to a SUPERSTAR! lol
But I'm not sure that repeating one negative thing over and over will help the discussion either.

Don't be fooled by Superstars! Some of us may be 'burning up'. Everyone's OPINION is worth hearing but I am REALLY tired of people making 'statements' - they may represent their view but to actually discuss it (and maybe 'convert' them) one needs REASONS!

 

[Obsidian]

loving how this is turning out

 

[Riseth]

Great point.

And on that note:

1. The project massing is too heavy for this area – I think mostly because of the massive floor plate.
2. The street level feels overbearing and lacks personality – almost distracting you from everything that's amazing about this area.

I definitely see your points there. When I was walking by today this project just came off as a hulking mass. Walking south of it feels fine but as soon as you go along Lower Sherbourne it begins to feel really overbearing and massive and it's not even topped out yet!

I don't share the same detest for this project as many others on here do but I can still understand the criticisms.

 

[featherfactory]

i've been following this thread since i will be moving in kitty corner once 158 front is complete. i mean, geez, we get it. it's not the nicest looking building and is going to be a bit of an eyesore... but how many times must this be repeated????

folks who are contributing with photos and whatnot, i appreciate it b/c it helps me see what progress looks like and what i can expect to be looking at in my near future. please keep doing it! this is why i'm following and am always disappointed when i click to see the notification of a new post and it's more of the same, "it's ugly" -> 'it's fine and it'll house people' -> 'no it's ugly'

 

[argus]

Yes, simply saying "I luv it" or "POS" really adds nothing to the conversation about this, or any, building and is going to change no minds. One may think either 'basic' opinion (Love vs Hate) is wrong but it's impossible to actually discuss it unless we have reasons. One can disagree with 'reasons' by offering better ones or better comparisons or even reasons why something is necessary even if it is not aesthetically pleasing (that, of course, is very subjective!). Some UTers like this particular building because it provides housing; I doubt many disagree on that score but, in my opinion, that is not enough. If one likes a building only because it provides housing we may as well all stop coming here and just fill our City with rectangular boxes with nail salons on the street level. If you object to height or massing, if you love the contrasts between the black and the white spandrel etc etc. we can discuss and offer comparisons. UT is (I think) a DISCUSSION Forum - time to get back to discussing!

And for certain members saying they like,or love something is adding to the conversation.

At least someone will be getting some enjoyment out of this development.

 

[Blixtein]