Toronto Sherway Gardens Expansion | ?m | 2s | Cadillac Fairview | DIALOG

[mustangjay]

Sherway in decline?

Personally, I have my doubts about the necessity to expand this mall. Historically it's never been a super busy mall relative to Square One, Yorkdale, or Eaton Centre. Also, in talking with people who work on the retail side, there seems to be a consensus that the so-called "high end" clientele that frequent Sherway is more myth than fact. The disruptions from the renovations (which seem to be going at a snail's pace) have only compounded these problems and many stores seeing major drops in traffic/sales. Will be interesting to see if Sherway can get it's mojo back after the construction activity subsides.

 

[sub-URBAN]

Well, is this not the reason for renovating the mall in the first place? A decline in traffic/sales, so they decide to spruce up the place to attract new tenants and shoppers? And btw I've been to Sherway Gardens several times and it's almost always busy. I'm sure once all is said and done, this mall will be a destination for shoppers once again.

 

[Edllguy]

I'm glad to see the new mall trend, especially the Sherway expansion, towards higher ceilings and the feeling of more spaciousness. If only Sherway was built originally with higher ceilings it would sure help make the upgrades easier to do. You can only do so much with low ceilings.

However, I'm sure with this expansion it will not be an issue. The new Sherway food court has high ceilings with a nice view of the local neighbourhood. Can't wait for my new hang out in the upgraded Sherway.

 

[mustangjay]

Well, is this not the reason for renovating the mall in the first place? A decline in traffic/sales, so they decide to spruce up the place to attract new tenants and shoppers? And btw I've been to Sherway Gardens several times and it's almost always busy. I'm sure once all is said and done, this mall will be a destination for shoppers once again.

I disagree; Bramalea City Centre embarked on a major reno/expansion 5 years ago to combat a declining productivity. To date, many of the anticipated retailers have not come and the mall still struggles to fill much of the new space and has resorted to leasing to non-traditional tenants and low-brow establishments like Dollarama. Sherway's problems are more complicated because, historically, the mall was a very productive, upscale type of shopping centre. However, the establishment of Yorkdale as the preferred go-to destination for Toronto's well-heeled shoppers seems to have put a major dent in Sherway's business. Even a city as big as Toronto can only realistically sustain one or two upscale retail areas, them being Yorkdale and Bloor Street. Even with much of westward shift in wealth across Toronto, Yorkdale continues to be the dominant luxury proprietor. Sherway also has the unfortunate experience of being situated in a part of the city that is, for all intents and purposes, not growing in population and is demographically much older than most of the GTA. Most of the traffic on any given day in the mall is people in the 50+ bracket who typically are not there to seek the latest fashions from Holt's or J. Crew. To say nothing of the disruptions from Sherway's ongoing construction and parking chaos, the mall management would do well to try and attract more moderate priced retailers like H&M, Zara, and Urban Behaviour instead of trying to cater only to expensive stores. The busiest store in that mall by far is Forever 21!! There's a reason why Holt Renfrew opted to bail on Sherway and head down the road to Square One; something Nordstrom (if they ever open!!) and Saks will likely find out. In my judgement, Sherway is on it's way to becoming a more moderate retail destination like Erin Mills or Scarborough Town Centre and the continued resistance of it's mgt team to bring in the right retail mix will only alienate shoppers who can't afford $700 Stuart Weitzman shoes!

 

[Translude15]

I disagree; Bramalea City Centre embarked on a major reno/expansion 5 years ago to combat a declining productivity. To date, many of the anticipated retailers have not come and the mall still struggles to fill much of the new space and has resorted to leasing to non-traditional tenants and low-brow establishments like Dollarama. Sherway's problems are more complicated because, historically, the mall was a very productive, upscale type of shopping centre. However, the establishment of Yorkdale as the preferred go-to destination for Toronto's well-heeled shoppers seems to have put a major dent in Sherway's business. Even a city as big as Toronto can only realistically sustain one or two upscale retail areas, them being Yorkdale and Bloor Street. Even with much of westward shift in wealth across Toronto, Yorkdale continues to be the dominant luxury proprietor. Sherway also has the unfortunate experience of being situated in a part of the city that is, for all intents and purposes, not growing in population and is demographically much older than most of the GTA. Most of the traffic on any given day in the mall is people in the 50+ bracket who typically are not there to seek the latest fashions from Holt's or J. Crew. To say nothing of the disruptions from Sherway's ongoing construction and parking chaos, the mall management would do well to try and attract more moderate priced retailers like H&M, Zara, and Urban Behaviour instead of trying to cater only to expensive stores. The busiest store in that mall by far is Forever 21!! There's a reason why Holt Renfrew opted to bail on Sherway and head down the road to Square One; something Nordstrom (if they ever open!!) and Saks will likely find out. In my judgement, Sherway is on it's way to becoming a more moderate retail destination like Erin Mills or Scarborough Town Centre and the continued resistance of it's mgt team to bring in the right retail mix will only alienate shoppers who can't afford $700 Stuart Weitzman shoes!

Are you nuts? Most shoppers from southern Mississauga/Oakville tend to prefer Sherway due to its (relatively) close proximity and highway access. Yorkdale is quite a trip from these locales. The main gripes with the Holt Renfrew at Sherway wasn't a lack of customers per se but that it was too small and lacked as extensive a selection as the flagship or Yorkdale locations.

You can't compare Sherway to Bramalea as you're talking about two malls in different regions serving two distinct types of clientele. Sherway has always been perceived as the upscale shopping destination for the western GTA relative to Square One and these upgrades are certainly indicative of ownership continuing that trend.

 

[Edllguy]

They have just opened up access to the 3rd level of the parking garage or parkade etc. Drove up there today and had a great view of the remaining construction work that needs to be completted. One thing that caught my attention was the direct access bridges to the Hudson Bay from P2 and P3 parkade level and to the new addition of the mall from P2 parking. Cool!

It would be great if somone could post/download pictures, if they had time, from the new parkade P3 views. It would really bring together how well thought out this expansion was. Also, it really is accessible and should generate a good amount of people traffic when the new addition opens. I always thought it would be a traffic and parking nightmare, however, when I walked arount the P3 parking level addition, my biases have really changed and I now see that this design layout can work.

 

[Filip]

I disagree; Bramalea City Centre embarked on a major reno/expansion 5 years ago to combat a declining productivity. To date, many of the anticipated retailers have not come and the mall still struggles to fill much of the new space and has resorted to leasing to non-traditional tenants and low-brow establishments like Dollarama. Sherway's problems are more complicated because, historically, the mall was a very productive, upscale type of shopping centre. However, the establishment of Yorkdale as the preferred go-to destination for Toronto's well-heeled shoppers seems to have put a major dent in Sherway's business. Even a city as big as Toronto can only realistically sustain one or two upscale retail areas, them being Yorkdale and Bloor Street. Even with much of westward shift in wealth across Toronto, Yorkdale continues to be the dominant luxury proprietor. Sherway also has the unfortunate experience of being situated in a part of the city that is, for all intents and purposes, not growing in population and is demographically much older than most of the GTA. Most of the traffic on any given day in the mall is people in the 50+ bracket who typically are not there to seek the latest fashions from Holt's or J. Crew. To say nothing of the disruptions from Sherway's ongoing construction and parking chaos, the mall management would do well to try and attract more moderate priced retailers like H&M, Zara, and Urban Behaviour instead of trying to cater only to expensive stores. The busiest store in that mall by far is Forever 21!! There's a reason why Holt Renfrew opted to bail on Sherway and head down the road to Square One; something Nordstrom (if they ever open!!) and Saks will likely find out. In my judgement, Sherway is on it's way to becoming a more moderate retail destination like Erin Mills or Scarborough Town Centre and the continued resistance of it's mgt team to bring in the right retail mix will only alienate shoppers who can't afford $700 Stuart Weitzman shoes!

I'm not quite sure you understand what you're talking about...

Sherway has consistently (and continues to be) one of the best performing malls psf sales in North America.

I agree, Sherway has not taken the competition from Yorkdale seriously. Until this expansion, the last one was completed in the late 1980s! For a mall that is a thousand years without change!
Yorkdale has continuously expanded since the late 90s. They show no signs of slowing down either. Sherway's problem is its limited size. The mall is not very big, and even after the expansion it'll just peak over 1.2 million sqf.

I'm also not sure what you mean by no leases being signed... The new extension is almost entirely spoken for. Aside from new luxury shops (Louis Vuitton, Burberry, etc) there will be a massive new H&M, a Zara, a Zara Home, etc... The mall's previous minute size prevented normal mid-market anchors to take shape. Also keep in mind that turnover in the leases were rare. Shops would literally stay in the same place for 20, 30 years.

Holt Renfrew's decision to abandon Sherway makes sense... You can't have that many luxury anchors in a mall (not even Yorkdale has that). If Holt Renfrew stayed, they'd go under as I'm certain they can't compete with a massive Nordstrom and a massive new Saks Fifth Avenue (that will be larger than the flagship downtown). Holt Renfrew's decision to move to SQ1 makes sense from a geographic perspective, but the brand will take a hit. You can't have a luxury anchor alongside a Target and a Wal Mart. Retail analysts are already laughing about this one.

Anyway, read up on Retail Insider to get a better flavour for the retail business. Sherway is an absolute hit with analysts and one of the gems in CF's portfolio.

 

[Jasonzed]

 

[kram74]

2016 ? !!!!... wow.. a condo can be built faster
then opening a new store

 

[Student99]

The new Sherway food court has high ceilings with a nice view of the local neighbourhood. Can't wait for my new hang out in the upgraded Sherway.

(1) ... I don't think you can beat the high ceilings of the current food court.

(2) What do you mean a "nice view of the local neighbourhood"? You get views of endless parking lots and the 6-lane Queensway.

Personally, I think it's sad that they're moving the food court... I love sitting under the tent relaxing and enjoying a meal. It's so open and airy... and back in the day (still, to some extent), really gave the feeling of the "gardens" of Sherway Gardens. There used to be tons of plantings, and there are still birds flying about that got in the building somehow...
Re-purposing this space for retail shops seems like a waste of such a beautiful space.

 

[officedweller]

Pics here:

Sneak Peek: Sherway Gardens' $500M Expansion
http://www.bisnow.com/commercial-real-estate/toronto/2986-sneak-peek-sherway-gardens-500m-expansion/

http://www.bisnow.com/commercial-real-estate/toronto/2986-sneak-peek-sherway-gardens-500m-expansion/

http://www.bisnow.com/commercial-real-estate/toronto/2986-sneak-peek-sherway-gardens-500m-expansion/

 

[kram74]

 

[interchange42]

They're really taking their time with this one.

One restaurant going on on one side of the parking garage entrance, one pad not going in yet. Do restaurant patrons really want to eat where they can watch cars coming and going to and from the garage?

Good bicycle infrastructure!

Reflective undersides to the pedestrian bridges… which is nice.

Not exactly gorgeous exterior for the new wing.

Holt's exterior looks dreadful beside the new wing. Closing the day that Sq One opens maybe? Hopefully this will be torn down and redeveloped quickly thereafter, as that blank wall beside it is terrible too (even with different tones on it).

I wasn't aware there was something else new going on the north side. This is the small entrance near the mall offices.

Saks at the east end not far along yet…

…unless it's not getting a new exterior.

42

 

[officedweller]

Thanks!

That Hudson's Bay sign needs to be raised a couple feet for visibility.

The Saks exterior reno could just be superficial.

Your last shot looks like a similar corner shown in the rendering below.
So it looks like some lattice added over the concrete.

WRT the Saks signage - I think all their recent stores have the same style of signage.
The wording looks a bit raised above the background.

The Sarasota and San Juan stores shown here looks a lot like the Sherways Gardens store.
Incidentally, designed by the same architects as Holt Renfrew's new stores - Janson Goldstein.

Sherway Gardens:

http://www.saksfifthavenue.com/main...anada_en#7e52e3cf-4f93-4b1e-b241-45ba802f324d

Sarasota, Florida, 2014:

http://www.jansongoldstein.com/projects/349-saks-fifth-avenue-Sarasota

San Juan, Puerto Rico, 2014:

http://www.jansongoldstein.com/projects/351-saks-fifth-avenue-san-juan

 

[junctionist]

Bicycle parking should be located primarily at entrances, like at Yorkdale.