Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

[drum118]

Why has TPAP completion been pushed back a year?

That what shows on the schedule.

 

[Forgotten]

There's no existing/planned rapid transit near Yonge like there is two blocks from King (RER). Plus Jarvis is a lot farther from the heart of the financial district than Queen St is - almost double the distance from King and Bay (700 m vs 380 m). The whole Jarvis thing is a red herring.

What exactly is a planning supporter? Are we talking about sports teams now? Maybe we should debate the issues on their own merits instead of trying to assign everybody to some sort of faction.



Henchmen? You must be confused. Rob Ford isn't mayor anymore.

I don't know why you're talking about detours. You mention College - if someone on College wants to go east or west they will be able to choose between going north to the Bloor subway or south to the Queen subway. It's a long walk, but doable. People will take whatever route makes sense, no detours required.

Look, if there were any possibility of two new east-west subways through the downtown area (and I have no doubt that they'd be successful), I might agree with you. But that's not going to happen in any of our lifetimes. This new line is indeed a jack of all trades, because that's exactly what it has to be.

You're the one that says Queen St might even serve people on College so you brought it up. People won't do as you speculate because it's a waste of time for short 2-4km trips across downtown that becomes transfer city when the major line is on an axis that avoids the major destinations in the core.

With RER/Smarttrack stations at Liberty Village and Unilever, a King subway would duplicate much of the market for RER, which will have subway-like service where the lines converge downtown. Queen avoids that duplication along with expanding the rapid transit network to more of downtown and making rapid transit walkable to most of the core, including the financial district. College and the employment cluster in that area will still be a bit of a stretch to either subway line, but less so than if the new line goes along King.

Still believing the Tory SmartTrack lie... The report commissioned by the city actually says the opposite of what you say here. Note I mean the report with the numbers in it, not the fluff Powerpoints the TTC and planners present at public events.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Comparing the Prince Edward Viaduct (Line 2)

with the Leaside bridge

I don't feel much safety in adding a Relief Line subway to the Leaside Bridge itself. Better to add a new bridge for the Relief Line, with bicycle lanes and pedestrian crossings over it.

The current Leaside Bridge has pedestrians and bicycles only as a second thought.

 

[ottbike]

Here is what the DRL could look like on the subway map. Might be able to make it line 3 if the SSE went ahead.

 

[Adjei]

they are putting up the money for the DRL? Is that what you are trying to say? Where did you dream that up,. The give $150M and you equate that with paying for the line!

The province has put up 150 million. How much money has the city put? I'm waiting...

 

[Hopkins123]

If the NIMBYs want the Relief Line to use Carlaw instead of Pape south of Gerrard, then we'll expect a subway jog with turns (and noise) bigger than the jog between College and Wellesley Stations.

Be careful what you wish for, you might get it.

They could always do this:

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As you can see, fewer homeowners would be affected via this alignment. And Carlaw is already zoned for higher-order development, Pape is single family homes with no development potential.

 

[salsa]

They could always do this:

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As you can see, fewer homeowners would be affected via this alignment. And Carlaw is already zoned for higher-order development, Pape is single family homes with no development potential.

I was told at the meetings that the sharp curves required are not preferred since it would affect train speeds and add to the cost.

 

[nfitz]

As you can see, fewer homeowners would be affected via this alignment. And Carlaw is already zoned for higher-order development, Pape is single family homes with no development potential.

Looks like that alignment goes under even more homes.

Doesn't really matter if Pape has no development potential. The stations are at Queen and Gerrard Square. There's certainly more development potential at Gerrard/Pape than Gerrard/Carlaw. And I don't see much difference at Queen.

 

[MisterF]

You're the one that says Queen St might even serve people on College so you brought it up. People won't do as you speculate because it's a waste of time for short 2-4km trips across downtown that becomes transfer city when the major line is on an axis that avoids the major destinations in the core.

Yes, as I said, College is pretty much the outer limit of the area that a Queen line would serve. And beyond the area that King would serve. People on College would be just as likely to use the Queen line as they are to use Bloor. As for Queen avoiding major destinations in the core, it's 380 m from King and Bay and there's no shortage of high density homes, offices and shopping on Queen Street. It's within easy walking distance of most of the downtown core, including all kinds of major destinations north and south of the line.

Still believing the Tory SmartTrack lie... The report commissioned by the city actually says the opposite of what you say here. Note I mean the report with the numbers in it, not the fluff Powerpoints the TTC and planners present at public events.

Are you saying that significant numbers of people won't use RER? Or are you saying that Metrolinx's projections for massive ridership growth were part of the Smarttrack lie years before Smarttrack was even dreamed up?

 

[TransitBart]

Here is what the DRL could look like on the subway map. Might be able to make it line 3 if the SSE went ahead.
View attachment 78301

Actually - I think that re-cycling line 3 is very likely for this. By the time this is real though, the Finch West LRT will be there, and probably Crosstown West to Airport and East to University of Toronto Scarborough. I am not the artist you are. What might that look like? Also - just keep extending that red line vertically to Science Centre and then to Don Mills. With Metrolinx involvement, the likelihood of that is probably high.

I know we're all exhausted by the wait. But something has changed and that is that we are choking in traffic. This time if nothing happens, the quality of life in the GTA will become much worse. That will be bad for a place we all love to live and work and study in.

 

[salsa]

Actually - I think that re-cycling line 3 is very likely for this. By the time this is real though, the Finch West LRT will be there, and probably Crosstown West to Airport and East to University of Toronto Scarborough. I am not the artist you are. What might that look like? Also - just keep extending that red line vertically to Science Centre and then to Don Mills. With Metrolinx involvement, the likelihood of that is probably high.

Lines are numbered in the order that they were built. Based on this policy, I don't expect line 3 to be reused for anything else.

 

[andrewpmk]

Lines are numbered in the order that they were built. Based on this policy, I don't expect line 3 to be reused for anything else.

This can easily be changed.

Also I would suggest numbering every LRT line except Eglinton with the "T" prefix (it seems that the TTC wants to pretend that the Eglinton LRT is a subway for numbering purposes and call it line 5). So Finch LRT = T1, Hurontario LRT = T2, Crosstown East = T3, Hamilton = T4, Kitchener = T5 or something like that. (Assume Crosstown East is a separate line).

 

[pstogios]

Why has TPAP completion been pushed back a year?

Because Toronto.

 

[44 North]

Based on the latests info, construction will not happen until 2025.

Aw, c'mon. No construction til 2025!?! That's ridiculous.

They could always do this:

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As you can see, fewer homeowners would be affected via this alignment. And Carlaw is already zoned for higher-order development, Pape is single family homes with no development potential.

Exactly. Wider ROW, zoned as mixed use and developable, and anyone transferring on the 72 (which will undoubtedly see growing use with the evolution of the South of Eastern + Port Lands area) wouldn't have to walk 200m.

Though I'd imagine a smoother curve, and the line following below the rail corridor in the central section of the 'S'. Granted this would make the Gerrard station placement difficult, and the norther portion of the platform would probably have to terminate somewhere south of Carlaw/Gerrard to allow the curve.

 

[jcam]

Remember that Everden Rd. leading up to Eglinton West (Cedarvale) is a pretty narrow ROW, and it doesn't seem to have suffered in the 38 years since the line opened. Not to say it didn't raise alarms at the time, although people may have just been happy that the highway wasn't necessitating knocking down their home.

Google streetview here.