Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

[TheTigerMaster]

At this point, I have every expectation that this proposal will die at the RFP stage. Especially in light of Metrolinx's and IO's performance with the GO Electrification and the Hamilton LRT procurements.

The province is going to ask to private sector to take on the risk of building this vaguely defined project, and with none of the risks known. If anyone even bothers taking this thing seriously, the P3's are going to come forth with proposals that look dramatically different than what we've seen to date. And costs will be 2x or 3x higher than the government budgeted, to account for the extreme amount of risk the P3 will be taking on. The Ontario Line will then die a quiet death.

Frankly, even if the Ontario Line were a well architected proposal, even in the best case scenario, $7 Billion was always a totally unworkable budget. That's what... a billion and a half dollars more than the Crosstown LRT? Give me a break

This whole thing is just a massive waste of our time.

 

[Northern Light]

A 4 year construction timetable?

Northern Light, did you happen to catch a whiff of snake oil?

@TheTigerMaster has said it quite well above;

This whole thing is just a massive waste of our time.

The project is not completely infeasible; but as currently outlined it has multiple serious flaws, and its budget and schedule are in no way in accordance with my understanding of how this project could be built, or should be built.

 

[salsa]

To say the affair was a disappointment and a waste of my time is to over rate it by 1/2

For me, the only thing I took away from this meeting (after making the effort to cycle there), is that I'm out of shape. So aside from getting a bit of exercise, it was a waste of time.

 

[officedweller]

Pay attention to the phrasing here. Ontario Line will likely use a mix of below-grade, at-grade and above-grade structures. Key word there being, "likely".

My guess is that any wording with certainty would imply that a choice was made prior to the consultation, which would invalidate the consultation. A consultation has to have the possibility of having a meaningful effect.

So, platform screen doors and 3m wide trains - that sounds good (ie high floor heavy rail LRT, not streetcar LRT).

 

[Steve X]

Just waiting for the industry to propose SkyTrains modified for 3m wide

 

[NoahB]

Frankly, even if the Ontario Line were a well architected proposal, even in the best case scenario, $7 Billion was always a totally unworkable budget. That's what... a billion and a half dollars more than the Crosstown LRT? Give me a break

The Ontario Gov 'committed' 11.2B. You are thinking of the estimated Relief Line South's 7B budget.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/doug-ford-toronto-subway-upload-gta-transit-plan-1.5090394

 

[YIMBY519]

Is it worth going to the Leslieville one? I always have such high hopes for these things and they always disappoint.

Did they discuss anything about TOD and adding density around the new stations? Station integration?

 

[Tuscani01]

For me, the only thing I took away from this meeting (after making the effort to cycle there), is that I'm out of shape. So aside from getting a bit of exercise, it was a waste of time.

I was sad that I forgot about it - but then saw the presentation boards posted on Twitter and was glad I missed it.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

As skeptical as I am of the feasibility of these project timelines, I actually don't doubt the sincerity of the Ford government here in wanting to pursue those timelines.

The real question is if the private sector will bite with so many variables and risks left unknown.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

As skeptical as I am of the feasibility of these project timelines, I actually don't doubt the sincerity of the Ford government here in wanting to pursue those timelines.

The real question is if the private sector will bite with so many variables and risks left unknown.

Oh, I’m sure Ford wants to pursue the timelines. The question for me is:

A) Internally, are the engineers and technical staff at Metrolinx even taking this thing seriously, or are they just appearing treading water to keep the boss happy?

B) As you mentioned, will the private sector even be interested in this? Apparantly Metrolinx had trouble garnering private sector interest in GO Electrification and Hamilton LRT, due to the absurd amounts of risk they wanted the P3s to take on. The OL is a far more complicated and riskier project.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

A) Internally, are the engineers and technical staff at Metrolinx even taking this thing seriously, or are they just appearing treading water to keep the boss happy?

They've received their marching orders I am sure. At the end of the day, it's just work and I doubt Metrolinx employees are going to half-ass their end just because they personally might believe this to all be political folly.

 

[tiffer24]

Doug Ford at QP today: “If it was up to me I would try to bury every subway under the ground, but sometimes it's not realistic or not feasible.”

 

[salsa]

Doug Ford at QP today: “If it was up to me I would try to bury every subway under the ground, but sometimes it's not realistic or not feasible.”

Some people deserve subways. Some people don't. Nothing I can do. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Doug Ford at QP today: “If it was up to me I would try to bury every subway under the ground, but sometimes it's not realistic or not feasible.”

Considering he directed the government to upend all of the transit plans because they weren't subways buried underground, his sudden declaration of impotence on this matter is rather strange.

AoD

 

[Tuscani01]

Considering he directed the government to upend all of the transit plans because they weren't subways buried underground, his sudden declaration of impotence on this matter is rather strange.

AoD

Meh, he knows his followers are sheep and will go with whatever he says. I'll take this aboutface as a win for transit in the GTA.