Toronto Lower Don Lands Redevelopment | ?m | ?s | Waterfront Toronto

Worth noting that combustion of hydrogen still results in pollution, so utilizing hydrogen in a fuel cell is preferable.
 
hawc said:
Dumb question....

My stove burns natural gas inside. It doesn't pollute the house. So why would Portlands Energy Centre which runs on natural gas be a polluter?

(And if you're going to say, "Actually your stove is polluting your house you just don't realize it...." You're missing my point. I mean it's not polluting my house the way running my car in my kitchen would kill me in minutes or the way a coal fire in the kitchen with no chimney would suffocated everyone.)
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Natural gas stoves do not release natural gas into your home, as this would be extremely dangerous.
This is how they work.
The stove draws natural gas from the gas line. When you turn on a burner and ignite it, the gas mixes with oxygen from the air and burns. This combustion produces heat, water vapour, carbon dioxide, and other by-products.

So yes, it does “pollute” your home, as it emits carbon dioxide, which is a greenhouse gas, but the amount produced is relatively small and typically not harmful to humans in well-ventilated areas. However, inadequate ventilation can lead to elevated levels of carbon dioxide, which can cause drowsiness and discomfort. It’s a good idea to use carbon dioxide detectors to monitor levels in your home, especially in tightly sealed spaces.

If there’s a natural gas leak, it’s important to take action, as fast as possible. Natural gas leaks can be dangerous because natural gas is highly flammable and can displace oxygen in confined spaces, leading to asphyxiation. If this does happen, ventilate the area, turn off the gas supply at the source (if it’s safe to do so), and evacuate immediately.
Unlike a car, a stove doesn’t store natural gas inside it; gas flows from the supply line only when a burner is in use. Basically instead of a car having a gas tank, it is stationary and sits next to a gas station, getting refuelled whenever you need to drive.

Remember, good ventilation is essential not only for carbon dioxide but also for other pollutants that can be produced during cooking, such as volatile organic compounds (VOCs). Keeping your kitchen well-ventilated reduces the risk of exposure to these substances.

The reason why Portlands Energy Centre does pollute, it’s because it actually burns natural gas. It generates electricity by burning natural gas, emitting pollutants such carbon dioxide (CO2), Methane (CH4), Nitrogen oxides (NOx), including nitrogen dioxide (NO2) and nitric oxide (NO), Sulfur dioxide (SO2), Particulate matter (PM), including fine particulate matter (PM2.5) and coarse particulate matter (PM10), Volatile organic compounds (VOCs), Carbon monoxide (CO), Hazardous air pollutants (HAPs), such as benzene, formaldehyde, and toluene, Mercury (Hg), Lead (Pb), Ozone (O3) (produced through chemical reactions involving NOx and VOCs)

These can be dangerous if you live by the plant. As the air quality can suffer. Take a look at industrial cities, the air quality there is horrible.
 
reinventingthewheel said:
For the record, Portlands EC has combined cycle generation with steam turbines using waste heat from the gas turbines.
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Kind of like using waste heat, (taking advantage of electricity produced, to produce heat.)

The Enwave Pearl Street Energy Centre in downtown Toronto mainly generates heat for downtown office buildings. It does this by generating electricity, which is used to produce heat through a process known as cogeneration. In addition to providing heat, the plant also supplies some downtown buildings with electricity. This facility operates as a cogeneration plant, producing both heat and electricity, with a power output capacity of 4 megawatts.
 
Bibi L said:
Natural gas stoves do not release natural gas into your home, as this would be extremely dangerous.
This is how they work.
The stove draws natural gas from the gas line. When you turn on a burner and ignite it, the gas mixes with oxygen from the air and burns. This combustion produces heat, water vapour, carbon dioxide, and other by-products.

So yes, it does “pollute” your home, as it emits carbon dioxide, which is a greenhouse gas, but the amount produced is relatively small and typically not harmful to humans in well-ventilated areas. However, inadequate ventilation can lead to elevated levels of carbon dioxide, which can cause drowsiness and discomfort. It’s a good idea to use carbon dioxide detectors to monitor levels in your home, especially in tightly sealed spaces.

If there’s a natural gas leak, it’s important to take action, as fast as possible. Natural gas leaks can be dangerous because natural gas is highly flammable and can displace oxygen in confined spaces, leading to asphyxiation. If this does happen, ventilate the area, turn off the gas supply at the source (if it’s safe to do so), and evacuate immediately.
Unlike a car, a stove doesn’t store natural gas inside it; gas flows from the supply line only when a burner is in use. Basically instead of a car having a gas tank, it is stationary and sits next to a gas station, getting refuelled whenever you need to drive.

Remember, good ventilation is essential not only for carbon dioxide but also for other pollutants that can be produced during cooking, such as volatile organic compounds (VOCs). Keeping your kitchen well-ventilated reduces the risk of exposure to these substances.

The reason why Portlands Energy Centre does pollute, it’s because it actually burns natural gas. It generates electricity by burning natural gas, emitting pollutants such carbon dioxide (CO2), Methane (CH4), Nitrogen oxides (NOx), including nitrogen dioxide (NO2) and nitric oxide (NO), Sulfur dioxide (SO2), Particulate matter (PM), including fine particulate matter (PM2.5) and coarse particulate matter (PM10), Volatile organic compounds (VOCs), Carbon monoxide (CO), Hazardous air pollutants (HAPs), such as benzene, formaldehyde, and toluene, Mercury (Hg), Lead (Pb), Ozone (O3) (produced through chemical reactions involving NOx and VOCs)

These can be dangerous if you live by the plant. As the air quality can suffer. Take a look at industrial cities, the air quality there is horrible.
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So a stove in the home, which actually burns natural gas to produce heat releases "water vapour, carbon dioxide and other by-products", but a generation plant, which actually burns natural gas to produce heat, emits a whole list of pollutants (including Carbon Dioxide, which is now a pollutant apparently). Hmmmm.
 
lenaitch said:
So a stove in the home, which actually burns natural gas to produce heat releases "water vapour, carbon dioxide and other by-products", but a generation plant, which actually burns natural gas to produce heat, emits a whole list of pollutants (including Carbon Dioxide, which is now a pollutant apparently). Hmmmm.
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It’s because of the size difference. Stoves are much smaller compared to power plants. Power plants are continuously burning natural gas to produce electricity, 24/7, meanwhile, with stoves, you are probably not cooking 24/7. Stoves also will not burn as much natural gas compared to a power plant, power plants will burn huge amounts of natural gas, as they need to power thousands to millions of homes. Compared to a stove, it’s just an appliance in one home. Also in power plants “Incomplete combustion can lead to higher emissions of pollutants like carbon monoxide (CO), volatile organic compounds (VOCs), and particulate matter (PM).

I don’t like natural gas stoves, as the risk for natural gas leaks is much higher, plus the health implications of the “pollutants” emitted. As it could be bad for your health in unventilated places.
 
Bibi L said:
I just copied a list, yeah, CO2 is not a pollutant…
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CO2 is a "greenhouse" gas (it is pumped into real greenhouses, so the, so called, "green" plants grow faster.. ergo: the more CO2 in the atmosphere - the greener is our planet! Now, let's call it a "pollutant" + charge quadrizzillion dollars in new taxes to stop this greening! Keep the planet cold and populace poor.. brilliant!
 
cogito ergo said:
CO2 is a "greenhouse" gas (it is pumped into real greenhouses, so the, so called, "green" plants grow faster.. ergo: the more CO2 in the atmosphere - the greener is our planet! Now, let's call it a "pollutant" + charge quadrizzillion dollars in new taxes to stop this greening! Keep the planet cold and populace poor.. brilliant!
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Time to get back to Lower Don talk!!
 
cogito ergo said:
CO2 is a "greenhouse" gas (it is pumped into real greenhouses, so the, so called, "green" plants grow faster.. ergo: the more CO2 in the atmosphere - the greener is our planet! Now, let's call it a "pollutant" + charge quadrizzillion dollars in new taxes to stop this greening! Keep the planet cold and populace poor.. brilliant!
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Most animals survive on oxygen, most plants survive on carbon dioxide. We breathe in oxygen, and breathe out carbon dioxide. Plants breathe in carbon dioxide, and breathe out oxygen. It’s a cycle!

Plants need carbon dioxide! Let’s save the plants, and pump more CO2!!!
 
Bibi L said:
Most animals survive on oxygen, most plants survive on carbon dioxide. We breathe in oxygen, and breathe out carbon dioxide. Plants breathe in carbon dioxide, and breathe out oxygen. It’s a cycle!

Plants need carbon dioxide! Let’s save the plants, and pump more CO2!!!
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Time to give this a break - this is the Lower Don thread not the 'we know all about C02' one!
 
DSC said:
Time to give this a break - this is the Lower Don thread not the 'we know all about C02' one!
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It started off as just sharing the history of the three big smokestacks in the area. And quickly turned into pollution talk, due to the nature of those big structures. Anyway, back to Lower Don Lands talk.


Quibbles:
What is C02?
And it’s Hearn, not Hearne!
 
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