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Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

Voltz said:
Seriously?

There would have been plenty of time to fix the design between Don Mills and Laird before the line needed to go to tender, if they had not had to waste so much time with that ridiculous all underground LRT connected with the SLRT for $2 Billon more.
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According to the MOU between Ford and McGuinty, the line could be elevated near the Don Valley - which is a 4 km long stretch. The problem is that they actually spent no time trying to design the connected ECLRT/SRT. They just looked at ways of sabotaging Ford.
For the Leslie stop, it was Metrolinx who said that the portal in its current location was not possible. Again, it was their politicking that led to the wrong things being explored.
Voltz said:
And I have clearly told you this several times before, just how long will it be before things finally sink in? The choice WAS NOT between building the Scarborough Subway with the current Eglinton LRT design or the all underground Eglinton LRT. It was between building the Finch, Sheppard, Eglinton and RT extension LRT's or wasting all that money on just the All underground Eglinton LRT connected to the SRT. Cancelling those three lines and putting all that money into a $2 Billion hole in the ground on Eglinton that would have saved maybe four minutes in travel time from Kennedy to Don Mills was not a better value as you obsessively keep claiming.
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The choice was for Council or the Provincial Liberals to explore ways of improving transit. It's not my fault that the politics turned to "defeat Ford at all costs", instead of "how can we work with the most pro-subway Mayor in Toronto history to build more rapid transit". Ford, and then Tory, actually secured additional money, but it was the planning that went horribly awry and prevented the right things from being done.
 
BurlOak said:
According to the MOU between Ford and McGuinty, the line could be elevated near the Don Valley - which is a 4 km long stretch. The problem is that they actually spent no time trying to design the connected ECLRT/SRT. They just looked at ways of sabotaging Ford.
For the Leslie stop, it was Metrolinx who said that the portal in its current location was not possible. Again, it was their politicking that led to the wrong things being explored.

The choice was for Council or the Provincial Liberals to explore ways of improving transit. It's not my fault that the politics turned to "defeat Ford at all costs", instead of "how can we work with the most pro-subway Mayor in Toronto history to build more rapid transit". Ford, and then Tory, actually secured additional money, but it was the planning that went horribly awry and prevented the right things from being done.
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Go find the MOU and point out where it states the line could have been partly elevated.

Time was spent designing the connected ECLRT and SLRT, I even saw crews out on Eglinton doing boreholes to analyse the soil.

It was stopped because it was a shitty plan, not because Ford pushing for it. He was not pro subways. transit or anything, he was an idiot who only knew how to say the word subways three times in a row. Someone needs to have the intellectual capacity to actually understand and accomplish something to be in favour of it.
 
EastYorkTTCFan said:
[QUDoes anyone know if it's been discussed how it will operate like will trains run the entire length of it or will some only serve the above ground sections and you will have to transfer at Laird
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IF they had a loopback for service, it would be the other way around, some trains would only serve the underground sections. Ridership is lower on the above ground, it would make no sense to run more trains there.

Also, the TTC is going to have a hell of a time with train spacing/bunching and scheduling on this line. Trains will fly through the underground portion, to only be met with traffic lights, closer station spacing and other obstacles above ground. No amount of traffic signal priority will fix this.

I think it was a BIG mistake to not have a loopback at Laird, and this will be the biggest issue of the line.

What will probably happen is that the TTC will decide to switch to 3 car trains at less headways to stop the bunching problem.
 
robmausser said:
IF they had a loopback for service, it would be the other way around, some trains would only serve the underground sections. Ridership is lower on the above ground, it would make no sense to run more trains there.

Also, the TTC is going to have a hell of a time with train spacing/bunching and scheduling on this line. Trains will fly through the underground portion, to only be met with traffic lights, closer station spacing and other obstacles above ground. No amount of traffic signal priority will fix this.

I think it was a BIG mistake to not have a loopback at Laird, and this will be the biggest issue of the line.

What will probably happen is that the TTC will decide to switch to 3 car trains at less headways to stop the bunching problem.
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What do you mean? There will be underground storage and crossover tracks at Laird.
 
micheal_can said:
How is it bad? It is close to the demand point, right?
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The major demand point will be at Don Mills, even without the DRL reaching Eglinton, this is beyond where full service would operate with half the trains turning back at Laird.

Partially to blame are the locals, who got a local community group to take up the cause of having a stop at Leslie, so it would help their property values.
 
Voltz said:
Go find the MOU and point out where it states the line could have been partly elevated.

Time was spent designing the connected ECLRT and SLRT, I even saw crews out on Eglinton doing boreholes to analyse the soil.

It was stopped because it was a shitty plan, not because Ford pushing for it. He was not pro subways. transit or anything, he was an idiot who only knew how to say the word subways three times in a row. Someone needs to have the intellectual capacity to actually understand and accomplish something to be in favour of it.
Click to expand...
The MOU (released March 31, 2011) said Eglinton Crosstown was in a tunnel, "except short sections in the area of Don Valley, and potentially near the Jane Street / Black Creek and Kennedy Stations" and along SRT ROW. This was a 25km transit line, so the "short" sections are the 3km at Don Valley, 2km at Jane/Black Creek and approach to Kennedy (potentially re-using the existing station).
Read in conjunction with news reports of elevated transit being considered (which Ford never objected to), I was fully expecting more details of an elevated plan to be released in late 2011. I am sure Ford as well was expecting that Stintz and Metrolinx were working on an elevated option (so that more savings could be funneled into the Sheppard Subway that Ford so desperately wanted). The more elevation, the more savings that could be put into Sheppard - and I'm sure that elevating the remaining 3.5km section from Don Valley to Kennedy would have been acceptable to Ford. I was quite shocked in early 2012 when it became apparent that Stintz and Metrolinx had actually been actively working to sabotage the Ford plan (just to help the Stintz planned mayoralty run and to knock Ford down a few steps as he was controlling the Provincial governments agenda on transit). Once Ford was stabbed in the back, it no longer became about transit and he was trying to play catch-up in the political games that were started by the others.
 
Ford is always the victim. He was a victim when he got kicked out of the Leaf game for drinking. He was a victim when he never got arrested for anything but was followed by the police. Ford was a victim when someone filmed him doing recreational drugs. He was a victim in Politics because people hated that he had his own money. He was a victim when the city didnt sell him the piece of park land beside him. He was a victim when they accused him of campaigning before he was allowed to. He was a victim when they wouldnt let him build his ferris wheel. He was a victim when they wouldnt let him into the states. He was a victim when he left work to go coach football on work hours. He was always a victim. But dont worry Help is on its way. Doug is here to complete his brothers legacy.
 
Toronto1834 said:
I'm not sure I agree with that. It is my understanding that Don Mills (Science Centre) Station was built underground in an at-grade section of line specifically to ease transfers between the DRL and ECLRT.
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While it was implied that RLN would travel along don mills, new studies are considering options on Leslie and particularly Victoria Park. Victoria Park is the real issue.
 
It was a mistake not to grade-separate the Eglinton line between Laird and Don Mills. But, let's not overrate the impact of that mistake. Most likely, the line will still work fine.

Only if the demand greatly exceeds the current forecast, the inability to run more frequent service between Yonge and Don Mills will be felt.

DRL Long, if anything, would somewhat mitigate the said mistake. A large group of riders would transfer from the westbound ECLRT to DRL, reducing the demand west of Don Mills.

Line 1 has very uneven stop spacing, varying from ~ 400 m south of Dundas to 2 km (or more) north of St Clair. That, by itself, doesn't cause delays. Where the stop spacing is wider, trains run at a higher average speed and there is greater distance between trains. In the downtown section, trains run at lower speed and closer to each other. The number of trains per hour passing through every station is same (if we discount short-turning, that doesn't normally occur in the PM peak).

Likewise, the Eglinton trains will run at higher speed and more widely spaced in the tunnel section, having a lower speed and being closer to each other in the street section.
 
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