Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

[unimaginative2]

Elevated rapid transit is definitely the way to go for the Golden Mile portion of Eglinton, not to mention lots of other spots like the VCC extension and any potential DRL route up Don Mills. Here's an idea of the kind of thing you can build around an elevated line:

http://marinegateway.ca/proposal.html

 

[BurlOak]

But elevated where though? Above the street or on the side somewhere...

One option is to have one direction on each side of the street. This would mean stations plus the train would require a width of at least 8m , which may not fit very well at all stops where required. At least the East bound and West bound tracks are not tied together so 1 station could be shifted independant of the other. The down side is that it requires twice the construction - even though each construction area and scope is a bit smaller.

Above the middle of the street would probably be better for the line - the piers would take up about 2m of the roadway. The problem is the stations would have to span across the entire roadway - at or near an intersection where the entire street is an extra 2 lanes wide. This would result in a station spanning about 40m (it would not all be station, but may appear that way to the driver below) across the road (with a centre pier also) and about 100m in length (for 3 - 31m long LRT car trains). This may be too massive of a station visually.

It may be possible to go in the median and then make an "S" curve to the side of road for the stations. This curve would have to be pretty tight (close to 25m) so that an extra pier is not needed in the middle of the traffic lanes. This adds passenger discomfort and slows the speeds.

All in all, I think side of road may be easier to build.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

Elevated rapid transit is definitely the way to go for the Golden Mile portion of Eglinton, not to mention lots of other spots like the VCC extension and any potential DRL route up Don Mills. Here's an idea of the kind of thing you can build around an elevated line:

http://marinegateway.ca/proposal.html

Oh, for f*ck's sake. There's plenty of land, no issue with deleting car lanes, and cheaper to build at grade. Just do it, for chrissakes.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Oh, for f*ck's sake. There's plenty of land, no issue with deleting car lanes, and cheaper to build at grade. Just do it, for chrissakes.

RRR, you need to sell that to those just east of you in scarborough. The notion the golden mile needs underground transit is laughable.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

RRR, you need to sell that to those just east of you in scarborough. The notion the golden mile needs underground transit is laughable.

I have a friend who lives in West Hill. Anyone who drives from O'Conner to West Hill on Eg (ONCE) and has two brain cells would be in hysterics that someone would feel the need to spend billions of dollars to bury ANYTHING along that superhighway to the 'burbs. Luckily, the Fords only have one brain cell between them, so they can keep this very interesting argument going.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I have a friend who lives in West Hill. Anyone who drives from O'Conner to West Hill on Eg (ONCE) and has two brain cells would be in hysterics that someone would feel the need to spend billions of dollars to bury ANYTHING along that superhighway to the 'burbs. Luckily, the Fords only have one brain cell between them, so they can keep this very interesting argument going.

I agree 100%. That is a money loser from the get go. This is why I don't consider The Sun and readers conservatives. They just want to spend money on ridiculous stuff because downtown has it!!!(sarc)

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Not necessarily a bad idea to elevate that stretch of Eglinton, especially if the intent is to connect and replace SRT. I am curious what the cost of that would be, vis-a-vis putting it underground.

AoD

 

[M II A II R II K]

Even better to elevate it on the side of the road and trench it in some places.

 

[sixrings]

I definitely agree with the richview corridor for a trench. However for most of the lrt lines I was OK with it in median. But if the information is correct and a eglinton in median lrt won't be able to run frequent enough to interline with the the srt then the danforth line would have to be extended or another stupid transfer will remain.

If the eglinton lrt runs in median price with the same stop spacing as the proposed underground line and has traffic light priority will it be able to run frequent enough to interline with the lrt?

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Oh, for f*ck's sake. There's plenty of land, no issue with deleting car lanes, and cheaper to build at grade. Just do it, for chrissakes.

What are the marginal cost increases in going from an in-median ROW with cross streets vs a fully grade separated elevated line?

 

[gweed123]

What are the marginal cost increases in going from an in-median ROW with cross streets vs a fully grade separated elevated line?

We'll find out very shortly when Ottawa recommends a trench in the Richmond-Byron corridor for the western extension of the OLRT.

Very similar to Richview in a lot of respects. It'll provide a very good case study.

 

[BurlOak]

What are the marginal cost increases in going from an in-median ROW with cross streets vs a fully grade separated elevated line?

Based on the cost of elevated lines in Vancouver, I would say $100M to 125M / km for elevated.

I think median construction for Transit City was based on $50M / km.

It is maybe 7 to 9 km from Black Creek to YYZ (depending on whether which route you take and whether you are going to meet up with Mississauga MiWay or the airport itself. Total Extra cost is about $500M.

I am not sure if Transit City actually determined details as to how it would get to the airport, but I am certain portions of the line would have been elevated near the end anyways, so the cost is probably somewhat less than above.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

What are the marginal cost increases in going from an in-median ROW with cross streets vs a fully grade separated elevated line?

Why does it matter? Why does it kill everyone to support the thing that will cause LRT to be built in the shortest time at the lowest cost, using a plan that has been approved and funded?

 

[Rainforest]

Why does it matter? Why does it kill everyone to support the thing that will cause LRT to be built in the shortest time at the lowest cost, using a plan that has been approved and funded?

No, at grade vs elevated is a legitimate debate. First of all, the first section to be built is Black Creek to Yonge, almost entirely underground anyway. Eglinton East is funded but the construction will happen later, and if it can be done elevated for a small premium over at-grade, then why not? it won't delay the whole project.

Even more so for the western segment (Jane to the airport) that is not even funded at this time. Plenty of time to evaluate all options (at grade / elevated / trenched in certain sections).

 

[gweed123]

Why does it matter? Why does it kill everyone to support the thing that will cause LRT to be built in the shortest time at the lowest cost, using a plan that has been approved and funded?

It's not funded though. It was cut back in 2009. The design of this line is still very much up in the air.

As a result, I want to see it designed right. I'm willing to accept some design inefficiencies on Eglinton East, because it's much further along (although I think there are some minor changes that we can still lobby for). But Eglinton West is still wide open, so a more fundamental design debate is definitely still in the cards.