Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

[Admiral Beez]

If you want results, you have to pay more for someone who actually gives a damn. You wouldn't be getting 260 quality control issues if the project was being delivered by people who in any way cared.

Caring and capability are not linked. You can easily have a project with hundreds of quality control issues being delivered by some of the most caring, dedicated people available.... since they can still be morons.

Not everyone screws up because they don't GAF, often they don't have the skillset or ability to do the job properly. And that can apply no matter the budget, billion $ firms can hire idiots just as easily as lowballers.

 

[Steve X]

I wonder if some is these issues are rather design flaws than build flaws.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Officials say Eglinton Crosstown has 260 deficiencies and still no firm completion timeline​

From link.

Days after CityNews reported construction crews were ripping up Sloane station on the yet-to-be-opened Eglinton Crosstown LRT, provincial officials have confirmed there are approximately 260 deficiencies to be dealt with along the line.

During an unrelated announcement at the Toronto Transit Commission’s headquarters Thursday morning about furthering procurement work on the Yonge North subway extension, Transportation Minister Caroline Mulroney and Metrolinx CEO Phil Verster faced several questions about the state of the Eglinton Crosstown LRT line.

“I am fully responsible for the opening of the system, but we’ve seen in Ottawa what happens when politicians push subway systems or transit systems to open before they’re ready … and we don’t want that to happen here,” Mulroney said.

Premier Doug Ford said he told Verster and Mulroney the Crosstown shouldn’t open until it is 100 per cent safe.

“I’m not going to pull a Mayor (Jim) Watson in Ottawa, pushing it forward, derailing the LRT in Ottawa, making a total mess of it,” he said at an unrelated press conference.

Ottawa’s LRT has been plagued with repeated closures and operating problems since the 12.5-kilometre line opened with 13 stations in 2019.

A public inquiry revealed a litany of issues including doors that wouldn’t close properly, wheels that became flat after use, and a frustrating inconsistency operating in winter weather. The inquiry also revealed a lack of transparency and accountability about the problems.

Mulroney and Verster blamed the contractor, Crosslinx Transit Solutions (CTS), for the delay while also citing disrupted supply chains during the COVID-19 pandemic.

“We are working closely with Metrolinx to get CTS, who’s delivering the project for us, to provide a credible schedule so that we can then let the people of Ontario know when we’ll be able to open the system,” Mulroney said.

The biggest problem, Verster said, is the track, which was completed in 2021.

“It’s outside of specification, though, and it needs to be rectified,” Verster said. “And despite our urging and our guidance, it’s only being rectified now.”

Verster said many issues have arisen with the project, including the track, which was completed in 2021.

“Despite our urging and our guidance, it’s only being rectified now and it will have a two-month impact at least on the completion date,” he said.

“If you have track, which was literally millimeters out of specification … the risk you have is that a train runs and actually climbs up on the track and derails. So the degree of accuracy that we’re talking about are literally millimeters, that must be done right.”

Verster added testing and commissioning is behind schedule, as is the phase in which CTS engineers certify documentation that work has been done to specification.

“We’re spending an inordinate amount actively managing and guiding CTS in their delivery. And yes, we want this, we want this project completed. But I gotta say my biggest concern is that the quality is right. And that we get a safe transit system. We are building infrastructure for the next 100 to 150 years. And we’ve got to get it right.”

The project also started behind schedule, Verster said, with initial design work between nine and 18 months delayed.

“Losing 18 months at the beginning of a project is never really recovered thereafter,” he said.

Verster said one lesson learned is to break contracts into smaller parts because if one entity is responsible for the entire project, there is a greater likelihood of it not succeeding because of the scale, Verster said. Mulroney added the government is approaching the construction of the Ontario Line transit project in that way.

CityNews contacted CTS on Thursday to ask for comment made during the news conference, but a spokesperson for the company didn’t respond.

The line was originally set to open in 2020, but its deadline was pushed back multiple times and in the latter part of 2022 an indefinite delay was announced. CityNews reported earlier in 2023 how political staff rejected efforts by Metrolinx staff to tell the public more about issues plaguing the line.

The latest visible hiccup came on Thursday when a CityNews crew visited Sloane station, located between the Don Valley Parkway and Victoria Park Avenue, and saw a jackhammer being used to dig up the platform along with crews bringing out large chunks of concrete in a wheelbarrow, dumping the items into a Bobcat machine and then the discarded items being put into a dumpster.

In a notice posted online the following day as CityNews began to ask about the work happening, it said work is underway to repair “an uneven layer of concrete” and that the work, which is scheduled to take place over the course of a month, “requires chipping of the platform and placing new concrete.” Sources familiar with the work being done told CityNews the original grading of the concrete caused issues with water ponding on the platform.

CityNews asked Metrolinx on Friday what specifically was wrong with the station, what inspection and quality control measures were in place when the platform was built years ago, how the problem got missed, and what’s the cost to fix the issues. In a two-sentence statement, Metrolinx staff didn’t elaborate on the background but noted the matter was identified proactively.

“Crews are currently working on the Sloane platform to perform repairs on a section of concrete that was identified through our strict quality control and inspection process,” the statement said.

“There are no costs to the taxpayer as this work is part of the existing project contract requirements.”

Joel Harden, the NDP MPP for Ottawa Centre and the party’s transit critic, slammed the Ford government hours after the revelations were made.

“It’s clear to be the government has lost control of this project,” he told CityNews.

“The public deserves to know what is wrong with the Eglinton Crosstown LRT. The public deserves to know why the costs of this project ballooned from $5 billion to $13 billion. The public deserves to know why it’s two years late. We need a lot more detail.”

Matti Siemiatycki, the director of the University of Toronto’s Infrastructure Institute and a geography professor, echoed the need for more information.

“In that information vortex you’re seeing public concern around the construction and just frustration building, trust eroded,” he said during an interview with CityNews.

When asked how the Eglinton Crosstown compares with other major infrastructure projects, he said it isn’t unique anymore.

“These big projects will always have deficiencies, the question is how quickly they’re caught and how quickly they’re fixed,” he said.

If the tracks were completed in 2021, why weren't they corrected in 2021, or 2022. Why now?

 

[Bordercollie]

How in hell do you lay nearly 30 km of dual track and not see that it’s out of spec? Haven’t we been running the LRT on test for several months now?

I believe there was a derailment on the above ground section in Scarborough. Maybe that's how they figured it out.

 

[Admiral Beez]

This project seems to be riddled with QA and safety issues.

Crane collapse brings new scrutiny to Crosstown LRT construction problems

The delayed Crosstown project has seen three notable accidents in a little over a month: a worker’s serious injury in a fall, a landslide and now the collapse of a mobile crane into a sinkhole.

www.thestar.com

Investigations continues into incident that left Eglinton LRT worker dead - Toronto | Globalnews.ca

Crosslinx said a worker at the Cedarvale Station site died after being hit by a cement truck.

globalnews.ca

Investigation continues into collapse that injured seven at Eglinton LRT site - Daily Commercial News

Top Ministry of Labour officials expressed sympathy and regret after a wall undergoing demolition collapsed at the site of a future Metrolinx Eglinton Crosstown LRT station in Toronto on Monday, April 18, sending seven people to hospital.

canada.constructconnect.com

Tragic death spurs action at Yonge and Eglinton

Locals push for more safety measures in busy construction zone

streetsoftoronto.com

This Eglinton LRT stop is being ripped up before it has even opened. Here’s why

Construction crews are back at Sloane stop — one that sits on the much-awaited Eglinton Crosstown LRT line — digging up the new platform for repairs even before it ever

www.toronto.com

 

[Richard White]

I believe there was a derailment on the above ground section in Scarborough. Maybe that's how they figured it out.

That's the first I am hearing of it. Ionview or Kennedy?

 

[Admiral Beez]

How long into their service will it be before major issues are found with the rolling stock?

All of Toronto's Crosstown vehicles are ready to go as the line actually nears completion

It's long, long, overdue, but commuters will likely be riding the new Eglinton Crosstown light rail transit (LRT) in 2023, ending a more than-decad...

www.blogto.com

I assume cracks, premature corrosion, faulty brakes or electronics will be in the news in 2025.

Contrary to impressions, I hate thinking this way. I want us to be proud of our transit city and how out city works.

 

[SashaLemon]

Total side track, but I wonder if soon after the LRT opens they'll start discussing plans to convert the underground portion to "light metro" and split the line in 2 segments. idk why but this seems inevitable at some point if demand grows enough.

That would only work if they actually connect the "Eglington East" to the current line, otherwise you would have three lines in a row and that would be... silly. I've said before the line should be split at Science Centre if they can eliminate that one crossing at Sunnybrook Park.

 

[WillTo]

Remember the good old days when we were worried the rolling stock wouldn't arrive on time?

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

And yet people are ok with Metrolinx leading the Ontario/Downtown Relief Line.

Also, this is going to kill the case for LRT in the GTHA going forward. It will be subways, streetcars proper, or BRT.

 

[crs1026]

I can imagine that as a slogan at some engineering school.

Actually, the factors that cause success/failure in megaprojects have received a lot of study by business schools.

The percent of megaprojects that "succeed" (in the sense of meeting budget and time targets) is very low.

- Paul

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Sigh. We should have just built a 28km long Toronto Rocket subway from Renforth/Eglinton to Kennedy, fully underground, using TR rolling stock, high level platforms and signal systems we're already familiar with. At a total distance of 28,000 meters, if we'd starting tunnel boring in 2014 at a rate of 20 meters per day or 7,300 meters per year (40-50 meters per day is a more usual peak) we'd likely be in service by now.

This is the obvious answer. And with that being a subway, no debate about subways in Scarborough.

 

[T3G]

Caring and capability are not linked. You can easily have a project with hundreds of quality control issues being delivered by some of the most caring, dedicated people available.... since they can still be morons.

Not everyone screws up because they don't GAF, often they don't have the skillset or ability to do the job properly. And that can apply no matter the budget, billion $ firms can hire idiots just as easily as lowballers.

"Caring" doesn't just apply to the workers on the ground. If you have incompetent, bumbling management, or management that's in it for the money or because they get off on power tripping, it doesn't matter one bit how competent the workers on the ground are.

Yes, shit can happen anywhere, any time, but do you dispute that our insistence on giving contracts to the lowest qualifying bidder doesn't factor into this in some capacity? Good work doesn't happen when you pay the absolute bare minimum.

I assume cracks, premature corrosion, faulty brakes or electronics will be in the news in 2025.

Good thing the same vehicles have already been in service with the TTC for 10 years and nothing of the sort has occurred.

Also, this is going to kill the case for LRT in the GTHA going forward. It will be subways, streetcars proper, or BRT.

As long as it's Metrolinx behind the helm, it doesn't matter one bit whether it's subways, BRT, rickshaws, or magnetically suspended monorails from Mars. Anyone who thinks is some kind of gotcha against LRT, or that things would have magically been different if we built the Crosstown as a subway, should be firmly ignored.

 

[Sunnyside]

And yet people are ok with Metrolinx building the Ontario/Downtown Relief Line.

Also, this is going to kill the case for LRT in the GTHA going forward. It will be subways, streetcars proper, or BRT.

Doubt it. Finch and Hurontario are the standard template and are proceeding just fine. If anything, they are exactly what we want our LRTs to be.

Eglinton is a mish-mash of ideas and transit philosophies, ranging from the upgrading of a bus corridor and becoming a development stimulator (ala Finch/Hurontario) to a capacity-conscious semi-subway in the trunk section. We can “save” Eglinton by maximizing the infrastructure and using the tunnel as a trunk for more feeder surface LRTs someday. But for the time being, Eglinton is a testament to doing things in a vacuum with too many specifics/peculiarities. It will be fine once open, but could have been better.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Good thing the same vehicles have already been in service with the TTC for 10 years and nothing of the sort has occurred.

Do you mean the Flexcity streetcars? When they first entered service they were beset with issues. This required units to be sent back to the factory for repairs and rework. Choosing the lowest bidder here was not the best move.

TTC ticked by Flexity issues - Railway Age

The Toronto Transit Commission (TTC) has been experiencing significant in-service reliability issues with its fleet of new Bombardier-built Flexity Outlook LRVs.

www.railwayage.com

Welding problems impact TTC streetcar deliveries - Railway Age

The Toronto Transit Commission (TTC) recently suffered another setback in the delivery of its much-delayed 204-unit Flexity Outlook LRV order. Carbuilder Bombardier Transportation has advised the TTC that 67 of the LRVs have frames that were improperly welded at the company’s Sahagun, Mexico...

www.railwayage.com

I just hope any issues with the Crosstown cars will be discovered whilst they're sitting idle for another year in the yard, and not after they enter service. Looking at the below, I hope staff are assigned to keep roll them around - you can't leave rolling stock just sitting outside, not moving for a year or more.