urbanfan89
Active Member
Yes, it's true that much of what we have is totally unacceptable and should not be allowed anywhere in the world. It's also true that every country that has developed to date has gone through a period of tough and cruel industrialization, something that is often ignored by the self-righteous in the west.If I would have said industrialized would that make you feel better? I mean come on... And nowhere did I say send Chinese workers back to any farm. I'm saying lift them up by pressuring China to increase worker standards! You're making a false argument without even considering what I'm saying. If all you are going to do is ignore what I say, and speak on my behalf and force words in my mouth, so be it.
The reality is that I support trade, and without it think this world would be a sad place. We need to intermingle, share cultures, and trade goods and services. Our world is simply better off with exchanges of all kinds.
But the laws we have on the books right now need to be highly edited and greatly altered. We can lift people up in the 3rd world, in developing nations like China as well, and also continue trade at the same time. There doesn't have to be this fake choice between no trade and totally corporate controlled trade laws that are really anything but free.
Besides, I hope that we have learnt from GWB that you simply can't unilaterally take action and hope everyone else will do as you say. Treat them as partners instead of enemies, and perhaps then they will listen. Just a thought.
So do you have any objection to the fact that Arab countries fix their currencies in order to make fuel cheaper for YOU?I mean we're talking about dealing with fixed currencies, highly questionable product quality, etc. I think the least we can do if a nation is going to fix its currency is to apply a fair tariff on any import to match the currency fixing. Free trade isn't free when one nation fixes its currency and the others are on a market that adjusts fairly.
Or perhaps western governments should stop coddling the agriculture sector which already makes billions in profits (and hence allow it to undersell local farmers in developing countries and contribute to much more serious starvation), before complaining about other countries building up their industrial sector.
Maybe the fact that before WW1 and between WW2 and the oil shock all the world's market economies pegged their currencies (first through gold/silver and then through the USD) will give some perspective.
Anyways, currency pegs lose their relevance once the lack of idle resources in those countries provokes inflation. Wages are rising at double digit rates in China, and workers are now much harder to find. What's there not to like?
None of the manufacturing-dependent Asian countries peg their currencies to anything else.I think revenue via tariffs for products coming from currency-fixed states is a great way for government to get much needed revenue, balance trade, and avoid taxing consumers incomes so strongly.
Ah, yes. Back in 1900, when the state was very small (and hence required very few taxes) and didn't care about public health care or social benefits or free schools or clean drinking water, when child labour and cartels were rampant, wages were low, and workplaces were dangerous. Back in the days...Many, many years ago governments around the world received more revenue from tariffs than any other method, and there used to be virtually no income tax on many people. Today we're pro-corporate and anti-individual.
The average Chinese/Indian/Brazilian/Indonesian/etc has far better human rights than, say, 30 years ago. What with massively reduced poverty and hunger levels. By opening up their economies, they have started an unstoppable and accelerating train.I'd like to see us place some emphasis on human rights for a change.
So what exactly is this better way? Demand that China impose a minimum wage of $8/hour? Send cash to Africa and find it in a secret Zürich bank account? The responsibility for the problems in trade policy lies squarely with the developed world with its double standards.I don't agree with the false argument that we have to choose to abuse developing nation's workers or not trade at all. There's a better way that doesn't fit into this box the extreme corporate traders have created. The debate has other points of view to be considered, and its obvious you're not someone who is willing to consider another totally valid viewpoint.