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The Toronto Tree Thread

@s00f

I did as I promised above........and here is what I heard back.

"Pin Oaks are dying in Toronto, and very few are making it to anything close to maturity. I would not plant one on a go-forward basis" ; " The reason for this is that they prefer acidic soils and Toronto is principally alkaline soil; it doesn't instantly kill Pin Oaks, but they can only deal w/it for so long"

"The alkaline soil interferes w/the trees ability to absorb Iron, this is refereed to as Iron Sclerosis"


From the above:

View attachment 448571
I suspected it might be something like this. Although the climate of Ontario hasn't changed that much thus far from what I've been able to determine, with Toronto specifically it seems like the urban heat island effects should be able to significantly reduce cold stress. However, if being an urban tree brings along additional stresses, like salt or drainage issues (due to pavement) that could mean that in combination with the moderate but otherwise tolerable cold stress, they can't grow here. In this case, that additional stress seems to be alkalinity. It seems like the parts of Southern Ontario that it is native to are less alkaline, especially Essex County. I think Niagara is still not really acidic but maybe still less alkaline/more neutral than, say, Wellington County. I think some parts of the GTA should be neutral-ish, where it's mostly sandy shoreline deposits such as here along the Oakville lakeshore. But most of Toronto is somewhat alkaline, I agree.
 
I didn't say it was a conifer, just an evergreen (non-deciduous) magnolia. I took a couple more pictures on Jan 2 but was kind of shy about walking right up to it to take pictures since it's on private property. It can basically only be Sweet Bay or Southern Magnolia at this point imo, and I'm leaning towards Southern Magnolia due to the way the leaves look (especially the brownish colouration on some of the undersides). Which is kind of neat since I think it might be the furthest north occurrence of a Southern Magnolia east of the Rockies?

The bottom half of the tree is obscured by rhododendron which have somewhat smaller leaves.
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I have actually seen one relatively large southern magnolia planted right up against a house in Forest Hill; when available I will share a picture here.
 
Here it is on Google Maps; when I'm in the area I'll check on how it's handling the winter, as the last time I saw it was in May.
Looks like it was planted after the extreme cold of February 2015 so it hasn't quite been tested for the worst Toronto had to offer - the house shows up under construction on streetview in 2016 with the tree not present. It does look quite healthy though. Do you remember if you're seen it flower yet?
 
Just as an aside, our daughter's former house near North Bay had a Magnolia bush. I know not which type.

That love is for the turn-of-phrase.

Straight out of Shakespeare, but legible in today's English.

Goes to show, @lenaitch is man of letters and eloquence, notwithstanding his relatability.
 
Just as an aside, our daughter's former house near North Bay had a Magnolia bush. I know not which type.
Quite unlikely that it's a Southern Magnolia given that those are hardy to zone 6 and North Bay is zone 4. It's most like one of the deciduous varieties of magnolia such as Star Magnolia or Saucer Magnolia which are hardy up to zone 4 and quite commonly growth throughout southern and central Ontario. Does the magnolia at your daughters old house lose its leaves in the fall? Southern Magnolia (hardy to zone 6) and Sweet Bay Magnolia (hardy to zone 5) are the only varieties that don't lose their leaves in the winter.
 
Quite unlikely that it's a Southern Magnolia given that those are hardy to zone 6 and North Bay is zone 4. It's most like one of the deciduous varieties of magnolia such as Star Magnolia or Saucer Magnolia which are hardy up to zone 4 and quite commonly growth throughout southern and central Ontario. Does the magnolia at your daughters old house lose its leaves in the fall? Southern Magnolia (hardy to zone 6) and Sweet Bay Magnolia (hardy to zone 5) are the only varieties that don't lose their leaves in the winter.
I asked her last night and it was not evergreen. When they bought the house they were warned by the previous owners to bank up leaves and mulch against the base in the Fall - which they did. The person they sold the house to has done virtually no yard work (much to her chagrin since she put a lot of effort into the property) and as best as she can tell, the Magnolia is dead.
 
Looks like it was planted after the extreme cold of February 2015 so it hasn't quite been tested for the worst Toronto had to offer - the house shows up under construction on streetview in 2016 with the tree not present. It does look quite healthy though. Do you remember if you're seen it flower yet?
I assume it would flower in mid to late summer? I've never seen the tree at that time of year, so I can't say whether or not it has bloomed.
 
I asked her last night and it was not evergreen. When they bought the house they were warned by the previous owners to bank up leaves and mulch against the base in the Fall - which they did. The person they sold the house to has done virtually no yard work (much to her chagrin since she put a lot of effort into the property) and as best as she can tell, the Magnolia is dead.
I don't have experience with growing deciduous magnolias in Zone 4, but I think generally if a plant species is hardy to your zone but not the zone below it, that means a colder than average winter could kill it. So growing something hardy to zone 4-9 in zone 4 will require some care/babying. USDA Zone 4 = hardy down to -30F (-34.5C). TBH although Environment Canada has North Bay at 4b, looking at the past few years, it's more of a 3b since the temperature has reach -34.5C or colder (though usually not much colder) in 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2018, 2019, 2020 and 2022... So yeah, you'd definitely want to be careful with the Saucer and Star magnolias there to try to protect them from the cold.

Here in the GTA, which is 6b in Downtown and near the lake, and 5b-6a in the northern suburbs, you don't really have to worry about magnolias. Where I live near the lake no-one does anything to protect their deciduous magnolias and they don't take any damage. But the record cold temperatures here are -30C or so, and even in the Feb 2015 polar vortex break down it only got down to -27C. So there's little concern about getting the types of -35C temperatures that would damage deciduous magnolias.

Sweet Bay magnolias are the hardiest of the two deciduous magnolias, and they're hardy to zone 5, which means they could take damage from -30C temperatures, so they should still grow pretty fuss free in Toronto.

And then Southern Magnolias are quite delicate, and their native range only extends up to about New Bern, NC. However, some hardier varieties have been bred to survive further north. I think the wild varieties are only hardy down to about -20C, while the hardier ones can handle up to -25C or so? -25C can happen in Toronto in a cold winter, maybe a few days per decade (unlike -30C which is almost unheard of in the past few decades). So that means the Golden Horseshoe is really borderline for Southern Magnolias and pushing it as far north as it can go, but perhaps in a sheltered location, thanks to lake moderation and the urban heat island, it can manage.
 
I assume it would flower in mid to late summer? I've never seen the tree at that time of year, so I can't say whether or not it has bloomed.
Online, I've seen people say May-June, maybe into July, but that seems to be for its native range, in the southern US. The same source also says late February to late April for deciduous magnolias, and in Toronto I don't think those would ever bloom any earlier than mid April, more typically late April/early May. So I'd guess late June to late July for the Southern Magnolias? However, I think they often only begin blooming once the tree is mature and well established, maybe after being in the ground for 10-15 years?
 
Online, I've seen people say May-June, maybe into July, but that seems to be for its native range, in the southern US. The same source also says late February to late April for deciduous magnolias, and in Toronto I don't think those would ever bloom any earlier than mid April, more typically late April/early May. So I'd guess late June to late July for the Southern Magnolias? However, I think they often only begin blooming once the tree is mature and well established, maybe after being in the ground for 10-15 years?

Your assumption on timing is correct:


Also worth noting:

 
Oh oh............

Another major tree killer has arrived in our area, now confirmed in Hamilton:


Hemlock woolly adelgid is an invasive pest that's been working its way up here from the U.S. south, its a major threat to Hemlock trees.

Toronto has relatively few of that very lovely species (though still in the many, many thousands). This could be a serious threat to a lovely section of Rouge Park (that first big hill one climbs north of the Glen Rouge Campground has a very large number of Hemlocks.

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Image from the link.
 

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