Standard vs TTC gauge; An LRT Standard in Ontario?

[doady]

If the TTC is not willing to convert the exisitng system, then probably it would make sense for the rest of the GTA to use TTC gauge as well, so that there can be combined orders and save money for everyone due to economies of scale.

Not only would it make the LRT lines more compatible with the existing streetcar system, but should any of these lines ever be converted to subway (e.g. Eglinton) it would be more compatible with the exisitng subway system too. Sticking with TTC gauge would be cheaper and provided more flexibility in the long run, so I say the TTC gauge should be standard for the GTA.

 

[nfitz]

... then probably it would make sense for the rest of the GTA to use TTC gauge as well, so that there can be combined orders and save money for everyone due to economies of scale.

Good grief - how many times do we have to do this! For the same reason, that it won't cost Toronto more to order streetcars with their gauge, compared to regular gauge, it's not going to cost any more if Kitchener decided to use standard gauge, and there 10 (or whatever) vehicles had that gauge. It's a very minor item - no more significant that seat materials or colours - which will also differ.

 

[doady]

Good grief - how many times do we have to do this! For the same reason, that it won't cost Toronto more to order streetcars with their gauge, compared to regular gauge, it's not going to cost any more if Kitchener decided to use standard gauge, and there 10 (or whatever) vehicles had that gauge. It's a very minor item - no more significant that seat materials or colours - which will also differ.

Good grief - I never said it would cost more.

 

[waterloowarrior]

 

[nfitz]

Good grief - I never said it would cost more.

You said everyone should use the same gauge to combine order, and save money due to economies of scale. Surely the implication then, is using a different gauge would cost more. Surely orders can be combined, with slight variations between vehicles - or is Kitchener going to have to take LRTs painted in Toronto's colours ...

 

[DavidH]

I think the more useful advantage of a common gauge is to allow short-term equipment loans between operators without having to regauge for that purpose, and where line connections exist, to allow interrouting (e.g. between Hurontario and Dundas LRTs).

Given that whatever is picked by a given municipality will have virtually no cost impact, we may as well adopt TTC gauge as the standard. It can't do harm, and it might - just might - do some good.

 

[nfitz]

I can't think of any benefit for NOT adopting the TTC gauge - at least for the GTA systems. Obviously it doesn't make much difference what Ottawa or Montreal do; and it's hard to think that there would ever be LRT running as far as Cambridge/Kitchener/Guelph ... even if it once did.

 

[DavidH]

I can't think of any benefit for NOT adopting the TTC gauge - at least for the GTA systems. Obviously it doesn't make much difference what Ottawa or Montreal do; and it's hard to think that there would ever be LRT running as far as Cambridge/Kitchener/Guelph ... even if it once did.

I'll agree that it's hard to see a benefit of the other systems running TTC gauge, but in the absence of a clear benefit to the contrary, it's a case of "you might as well".

 

[Tranplanner]

Ottawa is not considering TTC gauge at all.

 

[jks]

^^There would be no point. However, the TTC gauge should be a standard for at least all of the GTHA, simply because it wouldn't do any harm, and it just might help, with equipment loans, and at least some interlining, such as Mississauga & Brampton on Hurontario, Dundas in Miss and Toronto, Eglinton, extensions of Don Mills and Jane that York Regions keeps on talking about, etc.
Hey, in that case, I might actually change my mind about Jane, as it might go to Wonderland =P.
And then there's subway conversions...

 

[Hipster Duck]

Just like how large subway systems like New York, Paris, London and Berlin have different divisions with incompatible equipment, I think that we should just build standard gauge equipment on everything other than the legacy streetcar and subway networks. The exception to this would be waterfront "LRT" lines, which merely being extensions and adaptations of the 509/510/501 routes would have to use the same tech as the legacy network to begin with.

There's more than the TTC gauge at stake here. Isn't TC supposed to be wired for pantograph running, for example?

 

[jks]

That's much less dificult to change. Fleet Street, as well as St Clair have been/are beeing retrofitted so that they work with trolley poles as well as pantograph.

 

[nfitz]

Haven't they been converting the system? They were working all along upper Gerrard a few months ago, even though they did the rebuild there only a couple of years ago.

 

[confusion]

I vote TTC. If other municipalities use anything else, we can forget about crossing TTC boundaries. I don't know if it needs to be a province wide standard but it certainly should be a GTHA standard.

Best answer and best reason.

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

There's more than the TTC gauge at stake here. Isn't TC supposed to be wired for pantograph running, for example?

what does pantograph have to do with track gauge? i don't see one interfering with the other.