Sheppard Line 4 Subway Extension (Proposed)

[Northern Light]

Tweets like this are why I’m super skeptical about the next tranche of transit projects coming to fruition any time soon. It’s gonna be a transit desert for a long while after next year.

I would point out that very similar things were said, when an anti-tram, pro-highway, anti 'war on the car' PC leader was running for Premier of Ontario............. his name is Doug Ford. He of Ontario Line fame, the Eglinton West LRT, the Yonge North subway and more; along with ongoing support for GO expansion.

Now, don't get me wrong, I won't be supporting Doug's party in the next election, his time in office has been marked by many policy decisions with which I disagree, including moving ahead with highway expansion, a gas tax holiday, freezing social assistance rates and nixing paid sick days to name but a few.....

At the same time....... I wouldn't presume that 'red meat for the base' for fundraising purposes and/or to motivate volunteers etc. will form the basis of real public policy in 15 months time.

Its self-defeating to decide you've lost before the battle has even been fought.

 

[drum118]

Ford has only been good for Transit as something are in the ground compared to the past when very little was taking place. If it wasn't for the Ford's, the Sheppard LRT would be up and running by now with a miss start up date because of BBD trying to fill too many orders at the same time and not enough cars to start running service on Sheppard. The last of TTC 203 LRV's most likely arrived late last year or still be on going if cars were going to the SRT LRT line as well. Maybe there would be 2-3 firms building LRV's for the GTA to get the lines in service as plan.

With election a year away, it will be interesting to see what Ford is going to add to the transit system for reelection at great cost for the future generation will have to pay for as someone has to pay for the interest on today debit that is climbing. Then we could be going to the polls in the fall if Ford calls a snap election that been talked about.

He talks only subway, GO Transit and highway as the car is his style of travel as it is below him to ride a bus or a streetcar.

It is funny how I can my tune for a subway on Sheppard back in 2006 when I did a master transit plan for the GTA when ML was been born to we don't need one a few years later after doing a major review of the plan as well travel a lot of those High Order Systems I was calling for. A lot HO routes were down graded to express buses or removed all together with a few being upgraded. This was before I found out some of my ideas have been around since the 80's and 90's and sadly, we are waiting for some of them to be built.

Be careful what you wish for when the second shoes drops at election time and only have to look at 1995 second foot shoe dropping that we are still paying for today.

 

[micheal_can]

Which itself was surprising. When he was a councilor, he was very much a right-wing and pro-car blow-hard.

Me too.He has turned into a Premier that isn't that horrible. I was worried at how bad thing would be, but he seems to be able to walk that very fin line that his party is named after.

Ford has only been good for Transit as something are in the ground compared to the past when very little was taking place. If it wasn't for the Ford's, the Sheppard LRT would be up and running by now with a miss start up date because of BBD trying to fill too many orders at the same time and not enough cars to start running service on Sheppard. The last of TTC 203 LRV's most likely arrived late last year or still be on going if cars were going to the SRT LRT line as well. Maybe there would be 2-3 firms building LRV's for the GTA to get the lines in service as plan.

With election a year away, it will be interesting to see what Ford is going to add to the transit system for reelection at great cost for the future generation will have to pay for as someone has to pay for the interest on today debit that is climbing. Then we could be going to the polls in the fall if Ford calls a snap election that been talked about.

He talks only subway, GO Transit and highway as the car is his style of travel as it is below him to ride a bus or a streetcar.

It is funny how I can my tune for a subway on Sheppard back in 2006 when I did a master transit plan for the GTA when ML was been born to we don't need one a few years later after doing a major review of the plan as well travel a lot of those High Order Systems I was calling for. A lot HO routes were down graded to express buses or removed all together with a few being upgraded. This was before I found out some of my ideas have been around since the 80's and 90's and sadly, we are waiting for some of them to be built.

Be careful what you wish for when the second shoes drops at election time and only have to look at 1995 second foot shoe dropping that we are still paying for today.

He ran on "Subways, subways, subways" and if it is a subway, he has approved it. So, my thinking is politically, the EELRT along Sheppard is dead in his eyes.

 

[PL1]

He has turned into a Premier that isn't that horrible.

...unless you like public healthcare or public education

 

[micheal_can]

...unless you like public healthcare or public education

Isn't horrible is a long way from good or even decent. He could have done much worse.Harris is the worst that I know of.

 

[chrisw]

Metrolinx is looking for your feedback on concepts for extending rapid transit along Sheppard Avenue through a second round of public consultations. After these consultations, concepts will be fine-tuned and evaluated based on the community input provided.

Each concept proposes rapid transit that extends from the TTC’s existing Sheppard Subway Line (Line 4). Each concept is unique, and these consultations will document public feedback and reactions to the various proposals.

Input and feedback received from community members during consultation will be an important component of the next phase of planning for the project, the Initial Business Case.

We'll have multiple different concepts to fantasize about.

 

[asey20]

...unless you like public healthcare or public education

His government is helping fund a major critical care tower expansion at the hospital I work at. This comes after decades of liberal government (since early 2000s) not touching or funding hospitals like the one I work at. So it appears my hospital's leadership was quite pleased with this development a few years back.

Ontario Newsroom

news.ontario.ca

 

[PL1]

His government is helping fund a major critical care tower expansion at the hospital I work at. This comes after decades of liberal government (since early 2000s) not touching or funding hospitals like the one I work at. So it appears my hospital's leadership was quite pleased with this development a few years back.

Ontario Newsroom

news.ontario.ca

So we both work at Sunnybrook. This is (internally) a long term (10 years) maybe tower, to be built where the M wing parking lot is).

Ford is funding private clinic ORs, when ours are shuttered 12-14h a day (I work in pathology, and support the ORs). Why not fund Sunnybrook so we can run our ORs for longer?

 

[asey20]

So we both work at Sunnybrook. This is (internally) a long term (10 years) maybe tower, to be built where the M wing parking lot is).

Ford is funding private clinic ORs, when ours are shuttered 12-14h a day (I work in pathology, and support the ORs). Why not fund Sunnybrook so we can run our ORs for longer?

Well aware on the timeline of it. That is mostly a hospital planning thing and does not have to do with the provincial government.

The ORs is a bit of a different story. I will pm you.

Anyways don't want to get too off topic but I wouldn't consider the situation so cut and dry. There wasn't much funding for decades prior and this is fact. So no rush for me to go to a leadership that was structured as the prior government either.

 

[picard102]

This comes after decades of liberal government (since early 2000s) not touching or funding hospitals like the one I work at.

This is untrue, even if we're restricting this to just Sunnybrook.

 

[GenerationW]

Here a thought that will not please some.

What happens if ML goes back to the original idea of building the subway to Victoria Park and it becomes an LRT to the east??

I'd say the chances of this happening under Ford are zero. Probably close to zero under any provincial government.

 

[allengeorge]

Ford is funding private clinic ORs, when ours are shuttered 12-14h a day (I work in pathology, and support the ORs). Why not fund Sunnybrook so we can run our ORs for longer?

Reducing the power of unions.

Health care is the biggest line item in the province’s budget, has historically required above inflation budget increases (regardless of what the government actually provides) and the biggest line item and driver of cost within that budget are wages. Ideologically and practically, this government does not like or want to negotiate with unions, so…increasing delivery of services using private providers.

Personally, I don’t think this is going to fix our cost problem (probably makes it worse - see staffing from nursing agencies, for example). Our cost problem is driven by structural issues and significant bureaucratic inefficiencies brought about by the government, the OMA and unions (I have relatives in the healthcare sector, and there’s a lot that could be done better.)

 

[Northern Light]

@asey20 and @PL1 ; I think the tangent discussion by you two is an interesting one, perhaps you could take that discussion to the thread I created for the Critical Care Tower project back in 2022; it can be found here:

Sunnybrook Hospital Critical Care Tower (?, ?, ?s)

A last minute pre-election announcement brings us news of a future critical care tower at Sunnybrook Hospital: https://news.ontario.ca/en/release/1002142/ontario-building-state-of-the-art-critical-care-tower-at-sunnybrook Today's announcement is just 5M for planning, though clearly the idea...

urbantoronto.ca

 

[mikey7767]

Changing from subways to LRT is bad, but changing from subway to buses is okay?

I would say yes, because the LRT would have a large cost to build, but the bus wouldn't, roads are already there. And the benefit that the LRT would provide compared to having a bus lane with less stops is marginal at best, so yeah, I'd say changing from subway to buses is okay in the case of Sheppard. Though, I'd prefer a subway extension to McCowan or STC.

 

[jje1000]

While there's a lot of debate about changing from subway to LRT, I wonder if swapping to the narrower Ontario Line trains could be an option?

I would imagine that the big cost issues here would be regauging the tracks + existing signalling/electronics (is it compatible with automated trains) + the need for a new yard vs just extending the line with the current TTC trains.