Rob Ford's Toronto

[Peepers]

"In the end, the judges decision was not only a victory for Rob Ford, it was a victory for free-speech, and with it, democracy, and ultimately, Freedom itself!"

>> AG, here, read it again. This has a Ayn Rand-like over exuberance, wouldn't you say? That's not saying something 'good' about Ford, it's saying his successfully defending himself against a libel claim is a 'victory for Freedom itself!' His capitalization, his exclamation point. And, I'd be happy if Peepers will weigh in on my other comment -- why is this judge so intelligent, and the other crooked as a walking stick?

I wasn't "trolling" or over-the-top with my comments about free speech. In fact in an interview with the Toronto SUN Ford's Lawyer, Gavin Tighe, echoed my sentiments:

Tighe said while this was a victory for Ford, it was also a win for free speech.

“These types of lawsuits place a chill on debate of public issues,” he said. “It’s important for every citizen to know where their politicians stand on issues, even if the stand is controversial.”

Without free speech you cannot have Freedom itself. I would like to see anyone argue otherwise. Unfortunately freedom of speech and freedom of expression are under attack almost daily in this country. For example yesterday a 13 y/o boy in Mississauga was arrested at school (put in handcuffs) by police after he uploaded a video of a fight between two classmates to his Facebook account. And the crime that he was charged with? According to Police he is being charged with "interfering with the victim’s reasonable use and enjoyment of Facebook" . A few weeks before that a Toronto man was arrested by Toronto police and thrown in jail for the crime of "misusing" a twitter hash-tag which caused annoyance for a group of local feminists (who called the cops on him!). Every day in Canada we are becoming more like the old Soviet Union and I find it ironic that the "progressives" seem to be the most blind to this fact!

As for why the judge in the Libel case is so intelligent whereas the judge in the conflict-of-interest case, Judge Hackland, is a "walking stick" I have actually read, in full, the decisions by the judges in both these two cases. In the first case, Hacklands decision is riddled with four major errors that make it almost certain that it will be overturned on appeal ( I addressed these errors in more detail in early posts). In the libel case the judge's decision is bullet-proof. For example, the judge points out that Ford stated "I can't accuse anyone.. I cannot pinpoint anyone". With this statement Ford made it clear that he was simply expressing an opinion only and was not stating as fact that the plaintiff was corrupt. Opinions are protected free speech. You can say "I think this person is corrupt" and you have not committed libel. It is only when you say "I know this person is corrupt" that you are in the area of libel (if you cannot prove your assertion).

 

[voxpopulicosmicum]

Not to mention the appalling apostrophe abuse

 

[nfitz]

I wasn't "trolling" or over-the-top with my comments about free speech. In fact in an interview with the Toronto SUN Ford's Lawyer, Gavin Tighe, echoed my sentiments:

And you think what Ford's lawyer told The Toronto Sun is non-biased? Did he talk to any newspapers?

 

[Electrify]

While this is a victory for Ford, I don't think the judge should make Foulidis pay his legal bills. While I agree Ford did not commit libel, he did flirt with it. If someone is running for public office and is in the public spotlight, they need to be careful about how they wish to frame accusations. Ford enjoys twisting words to best suit his agenda (ex: LRT = streetcars to him), so being stuck paying his own legal bills might teach him to think before he speaks.

 

[Peepers]

While this is a victory for Ford, I don't think the judge should make Foulidis pay his legal bills. While I agree Ford did not commit libel, he did flirt with it. If someone is running for public office and is in the public spotlight, they need to be careful about how they wish to frame accusations. Ford enjoys twisting words to best suit his agenda (ex: LRT = streetcars to him), so being stuck paying his own legal bills might teach him to think before he speaks.

Why should this cost Rob Ford anything? It was not his idea to go to court and in the end he was completely vindicated. Ford said nothing wrong. Ford was exercising his free speech and for this he should be stuck with Lawyer bills in the six-figures?

The fact is there is no way that Foulidis can avoid paying some Ford's legal fees - it is only a question of how much he will be ordered to pay. The judge can order partial costs or full costs. Ford's Lawyers indicate that they are going for the full costs. It doesn't happen but in cases like this I think the defendant should also be awarded substantial damages on top of costs for all the hell that they are put through.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

As for why the judge in the Libel case is so intelligent whereas the judge in the conflict-of-interest case, Judge Hackland, is a "walking stick" I have actually read, in full, the decisions by the judges in both these two cases. In the first case, Hacklands decision is riddled with four major errors that make it almost certain that it will be overturned on appeal ( I addressed these errors in more detail in early posts). In the libel case the judge's decision is bullet-proof. For example, the judge points out that Ford stated "I can't accuse anyone.. I cannot pinpoint anyone". With this statement Ford made it clear that he was simply expressing an opinion only and was not stating as fact that the plaintiff was corrupt. Opinions are protected free speech. You can say "I think this person is corrupt" and you have not committed libel. It is only when you say "I know this person is corrupt" that you are in the area of libel (if you cannot prove your assertion).

Peepers - unless you are a retired judge 'dumbing it down' for my benefit, I'm going to continue to believe that you have less legal knowledge than BOTH judges. The fact that a Canadian court heard a libel case and rendered a fair judgement speaks highly of our society. So does the fact a Canadian court heard a conflict of interest case and rendered a fair judgement. What you seem to wilfully misunderstand is that when a case goes against you, it doesn't mean the judge is incompetent.

I'll leave it there as the rest of your examples are pulled from too much internet reading and irrelevant to the subject at hand.

 

[spider]

Not to mention the appalling apostrophe abuse

The uppercase "N" leads me to believe that this statement is meant to be a sentence, should it not end with a period?

picky picky

 

[voxpopulicosmicum]

The uppercase "N" leads me to believe that this statement is meant to be a sentence, should it not end with a period?

picky picky

Your incorrect comma usage negates your point.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

Your incorrect comma usage negates your point.

OK, children, play nice. The only grammatical/punctuation error to get truly irritated about is the incorrect usage of complement and compliment. Otherwise, no need to get your undies in a bunch/panties in a twist.

 

[Electrify]

Why should this cost Rob Ford anything? It was not his idea to go to court and in the end he was completely vindicated. Ford said nothing wrong. Ford was exercising his free speech and for this he should be stuck with Lawyer bills in the six-figures?

The fact is there is no way that Foulidis can avoid paying some Ford's legal fees - it is only a question of how much he will be ordered to pay. The judge can order partial costs or full costs. Ford's Lawyers indicate that they are going for the full costs. It doesn't happen but in cases like this I think the defendant should also be awarded substantial damages on top of costs for all the hell that they are put through.

The more I think about it, the more I can punch holes in my reasoning, or should have phrased it better.

That said, hopefully Ford will have learned something about implying accusations without evidence to back it up.

 

[adma]

OK, children, play nice. The only grammatical/punctuation error to get truly irritated about is the incorrect usage of complement and compliment. Otherwise, no need to get your undies in a bunch/panties in a twist.

Then again, anyone who capitalizes "Freedom" is guilty of unabashed kitsch in the name of, uh, freedom.

 

[MetroMan]

Chatter inside City Hall suggests that a by-election will not be called. An appointment from within Council is likely.
Almost everybody is convinced that an election would be a wasteful excercise given the remaning time in this term and until the 2014 campaigning and on Ford's side that he doesn't have the popular support to pull off another win.

As the media has mentioned, Ford's preference is to be appointed and allowed to finish his term. What's interesting is that Ford's brother can try to sneak him back in without an opportunity for anybody else to campaign. All it takes is for one councillor to nominate Rob Ford immediately at the meeting where the by-election vs nomination is decided and a simple majority to appoint him. The Left/Centre is already putting together a strategy that will deny Ford this opportunity.

If nobody else were nominated right away, Ford would win by acclamation. A willing nominee needs to be in place for that meeting and discussions are ongoing for exactly that. This is really a Hail Mary for Rob because this vote will take place not under first past the post but ranked ballots. If a reputable candidate such as a centrist councillor (or even a right winger) is on the ballot, I can't see Rob Ford being on more than a few councillor's first choice list. Ford would have to get a majority of Council on the final ballot (if he makes it that far). He cannot escape being at the mercy of all those with whom he burned bridges with -- a majority of Council.

On an unrelated note of interest, I spotted Denzil Minan-Wong at Century 21 in New York yesterday. I was just having lunch with an old friend from David Miller's administration and chatted about what Miller was setting up for the Gardiner when I hopped over to do some shopping and spotted Minan-Wong. I was going to engage him in a discussion about the Gardiner but he was on vacation and seemed rushed so instead I snapped some proof of this unlikely coincidence.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

Over the holidays it's been something of a re-education learning how popular Ford still is among Toronto Sun reading suburbanites. As I had suspected, and stated as much on this thread, these folks dip their toes into local political headlines and really don't have anything close to an understanding of what this fool is all about. Interestingly everyone seems to have a beef here and there with him but the bottom line is people like his "Mayor Every-Guy" approach to running the city, he garners sympathy from being barraged by the media ("the Toronto Star is out to get him") and they eat up his "doing it for the taxpayer" line. It's going to take a very strong challenger to take him on next election and one who runs a very aggressive and smart campaign.

 

[Gavin]

Over the holidays it's been something of a re-education learning how popular Ford still is among Toronto Sun reading suburbanites. As I had suspected, and stated as much on this thread, these folks dip their toes into local political headlines and really don't have anything close to an understanding of what this fool is all about. Interestingly everyone seems to have a beef here and there with him but the bottom line is people like his "Mayor Every-Guy" approach to running the city, he garners sympathy from being barraged by the media ("the Toronto Star is out to get him") and they eat up his "doing it for the taxpayer" line. It's going to take a very strong challenger to take him on next election and one who runs a very aggressive and smart campaign.

Were you hanging out with my mum over the holidays?

 

[cdr108]

Over the holidays it's been something of a re-education learning how popular Ford still is among Toronto Sun reading suburbanites. As I had suspected, and stated as much on this thread, these folks dip their toes into local political headlines and really don't have anything close to an understanding of what this fool is all about. Interestingly everyone seems to have a beef here and there with him but the bottom line is people like his "Mayor Every-Guy" approach to running the city, he garners sympathy from being barraged by the media ("the Toronto Star is out to get him") and they eat up his "doing it for the taxpayer" line. It's going to take a very strong challenger to take him on next election and one who runs a very aggressive and smart campaign.

no kidding !

to hear them cheer the removal of the $60 annual vehicle registration tax is ridiculous.
throughout the year, they probably spend more than that idling their cars in the drive-thru at timmies.

i even heard one guy said he voted for RF but knew nothing of his policies, history, experience, etc.
however, he did acknowledge that RF is an embarrassment and he would never vote for him again.