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Rob Ford's Toronto

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MetroMan said:
Things I learned today:

- Anthony Smith was a revenge killing, not associated with the video, though the same actors are involved which has led to justified speculation.
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Was it ever known if he and Ford knew each other beyond the photo, and who the tipster who called City Hall might have been?
 
mrtinfoilsocket said:
Fair enough and I admit I don't know how it works in Canada (or even in real life). However, on TV the US District Attorneys work with police in discussing what a person can/can not or should/should not be arrested for given the evidence at hand So I can see a scenario where the Crown and Blair sit down and to discuss the situation (a criminal investigation of a sitting mayor) and the the Crown saying "Yeah this investigation is larger than possession let this one slide".

Is that completely not realistic?
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I just can't see a scenario like this. The hypothesis is police didn't arrest Ford for lesser offenses because they were working on something bigger and to stop him for a DUI (for instance) would result in tipping Ford off. There are reports that police had already stopped Ford on occasion when he was driving drunk and had driven him home:


Lisa Kirbie ‏@LisaKirbie 11 Sep
Was a certain chief magistrate stopped by 14 Div last night for drunk driving? If so, why drive him home instead of arresting him? #topoli


Enzo DiMatteo
‏@enzodimatteo
@LisaKirbie Not he first time that's happened. He used to have a personal detail, till some guy name Price was hired. Cops seeing too much?
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Lisa Kirbie is Warren Kinsella's partner and Enzo DiMatteor writes for NOW

We also know that police confronted Ford at the Grand Hotel so this notion that they did not arrest Ford for suspected lesser offense for fear it would tip him off just does not hold water. Police seem to have had direct interaction with the Mayor over the summer and Fall. Also if Bill Blair is to be believe ( I trust him as far as I can throw him) these type of decisions were made at lower levels.
 
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Peepers said:
I am convinced that the STAR and Toronto Police are working very closely together. With reference to the DiManno story that was pulled off the site only to reappear a few hours later with edits - I kept a copy of the original article and in it reference is made to the effect that Toronto Police had vetted an earlier story on Rob Ford's wife and that the Toronto Star editors agreed with police that they should not release the story (at that time). When the DiManno story was re-posted a few hours later the reference to the Star editors "agreeing with Police" was deleted!

I suspect that that was the reason why the original story was spiked. Someone at Police HQ probably saw reference to Police vetting Toronto Star story's on Rob Ford and the shit hit the fan!
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Yes, I said not withstanding those events.

I'm suggesting the reason for the collaboration is because the Star told the cops they had the whole story. The cops then negotiated/coerced/appealed to the Star not to report certain things until predetermined events transpired.

I can't think of another reason they'd be working together. I am open to suggestions, other than 'they be out to gettum!'

----

evvabeing

also... a revenge killing for what? what had smith done and to whom?
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Agreed.

How does a revenge killing square with a fight breaking out at loki, spilling on to the street where Smith is the aggressor.

We also know poor Hashimi wasn't fully responsible for his actions because he was angry, drunk, and high on cough syrup.

So as a result he's only going to be in jail for 4 years.

Not sure how 'revenge killing' fits with any of that.
 
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Peepers said:
I posted the original article a few pages back: http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/14268-Mayor-Rob-Ford-s-Toronto?p=788384#post788384

DiManno added some additional paragraphs at the end. Some other details were changed for instance in this updated version it notes that the bruises and cuts appeared to be a few days old. Also in this version they have deleted reference to their management "agreeing with police" that Fords wife's problems should not be aired in public. Here is the original paragraph:



I suppose that the Star didn't want their readers to learn just how closely they were working with Toronto Police in their coverage of Mayor Ford. If the Star was vetting information with police you can bet that as part of a quid pro quo Toronto Police were feeding the Star confidential information on Ford! I suspect that when the original article was published someone down at police headquarters saw the reference to police vetting a story on Ford and an order was given to spike the article.
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since this...

The Star obtained the incident report from this episode many months ago. The details were also confirmed with police sources.
Senior management at this paper decided not to publish a story about the matter. Editors agreed with police that Mrs. Ford, though the mayor’s spouse, was not someone in the public eye and was therefore entitled to privacy. Nobody here had any stomach for expanding the scandal engulfing Toronto’s mayor to encompass his family, thereby causing harm, particularly to the couple’s two young children.
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became this...

The Star obtained the incident report from this episode many months ago. The details were also confirmed with senior police sources.

Management at this paper decided not to publish a story about the matter. Editors agreed that Mrs. Ford, though the mayor’s spouse, was not someone who is in the public eye and was therefore entitled to privacy. Nobody here had any stomach for expanding the scandal engulfing Toronto’s mayor to encompass his family, thereby causing harm, particularly to the couple’s two young children.
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could it just mean the senior management / editors at the star were agreeing with their senior police sources? if that's the case, it's not really working closely with each other per se.
 
evvabeing said:
since this...



became this...



could it just mean the senior management / editors at the star were agreeing with their senior police sources? if that's the case, it's not really working closely with each other per se.
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The reference to "editors agreeing with police" suggests to me that police were vetting some of the Ford stories. Perhaps I overstated things by saying they were working closely but I would not be surprised if the Star editors ran many stories past the police first to make sure that they were not negatively impacting the police investigation. In consideration for this I suspect that the police reciprocated by feeding the Star exclusive information so in a sense they were cooperating with each other.
 
are we learning that police sometimes lie to try to not compromise investigations?

at first we were told...

Monday May 21
A man was shot on the 17th floor of 320 Dixon Road. The same detectives who were reportedly tipped off by Mayor Ford’s staff about other illegal activities on the building’s 17th floor were dispatched to investigate, but police sources have since stated there is no link between the alleged video and the May 21 shooting.
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http://condomadness.info/YCC42-shooting.html

but now...

Concerns that the probe could be compromised were only heightened three days later, on May 21, when one of the Project Traveller accused, Abdullahi Harun, was shot in the leg on the 17th floor of a Dixon Rd. highrise. Harun, a man police believe to be one of two men trying to sell the "crack video," was shot just down the hall from unit 1703. Sources have told the Star that Ford blurted out that unit number as a possible location of the video this spring.

(It's unclear why Harun was shot. Neighbourhood sources say his shooting was an accident. A resident on the floor, who was peering through a peephole that night, told police that he saw a half-dozen young men arguing before hearing two to three shots.)
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http://www.thespec.com/news-story/4234107-rob-ford-the-inside-story-of-the-police-investigation/

a slightly clearer picture emerges when tied to the following...

At a morning news conference on Friday, police revealed that Project Traveller led to a previous arrest in Mr. Smith’s slaying and promised more arrests against the now-depleted Dixon City Bloods.

The gang is based along the Dixon Road corridor, but its tentacles stretch from U.S. border crossings in Windsor all the way to Alberta, said Staff Supt. James Ramer, standing next to a display of 40 sub-machine guns, hand-guns, sawed-off shotguns and other firearms seized in the operation. “This is not a low-level street gang,†he said. “They are extremely well organized and extremely violent.â€

Among the 300 charges laid on Thursday, two were for attempted murder. Ayanle Omar, who faces a total of 19 charges, is accused of stabbing James Antoine Bedford on May 19. Two days later on May 21, police allege Arafat Mousa tried to shoot and kill Ahmed Siad.

The precise locations of the attempted murders are not listed in the court documents.
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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...harged-in-massive-gang-sweep/article12585546/

but still a lot is murky.

did arafat mousa tried to shoot ahmed siad but shot abdullahi harun instead? and if harun is believed to be one of two people trying to sell the video, was the other mohamed siad? and were they both working through that broker?

what about ibrahim ahmed? (http://www.oyetimes.com/news/canada/42624-toronto-police-search-for-missing-man-ibrahim-ahmed) how does he fit in all of this?

who's james antoine bedford? can anyone find info about his stabbing?

and those promised additional arrests... have they happened?
 
MetroMan said:
Smith and co. staged a theft of guns from the perps.
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What did authorities learn from the plea deal with Nisar Hashimi, who was charged with first-degree murder in the death of Anthony Smith?

In June, Nisar Hashimi pleaded guilty to a lesser charge of manslaughter in the shooting death of Smith. The plea deal came more than two months after Hashimi turned himself in to police.

The prosecutor told the court that Toronto police completed a competent investigation and that based on a review of the evidence, a manslaughter conviction "properly" addressed Hashimi's legal culpability.

During the court proceedings, the Crown revealed police believed Smith and his associates were members of the Dixon City Bloods gang, and that Smith was taking instructions from them.

It's believed by some friends of Smith that he may have had the purported video of Ford smoking a crack pipe stored on his cellphone.
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http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/rob-ford-crack-scandal-the-lingering-questions-1.2416903
A single-page agreed statement of facts entered in court Thursday revealed that Hashimi, who had been drinking alcohol and cough syrup on the night of March 27, encountered the victims inside the downtown Loki Lounge. “Ongoing animosity” between the victims and Hashimi’s crew spilled over outside the nightclub shortly before 3 a.m., when Mr. Smith and Mr. Khattak instigated a physical fight, the court heard.

“In the ensuing melee, Mr. Hashimi pulled out a handgun and fired several shots in rapid succession,” Crown attorney Mary Misener said.

The bullets fatally struck Mr. Smith in the head and thigh and sent Mr. Khattak to hospital with a shoulder wound. However, Hashimi “says, and we accept, that he did not intend to kill or to cause grievous bodily harm,” Ms. Misener said, noting drugs and alcohol compromised the accused’s ability to assess the required force “to protect himself and his associates.”
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http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...y-smith-pictured-in-notorious-rob-ford-photo/

At Hashimi’s plea hearing in June, court heard police considered Smith and Khattak to be members of the Dixon City Bloods, a street gang operating in the northwest part of Toronto.

Prosecutor Mary Misener told court that Smith and Khattak initiated a fight with a member of Hashimi’s group, prompting Hashimi to pull out a handgun and fire several shots, striking Smith in the head and thigh and Khattak in the shoulder area. Hashimi fled the scene in a car the Crown alleges was driven by Mohamed.
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http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...anthony_smith_case_against_hanad_mohamed.html

So, when it suits Blair he says his job is to collect evidence and leave the charges up to the crown.

Ok. Then who in the crown, looking at the evidence, decided to press 1st degree murder charges?

I understand overcharging for a plea. But this plea so quickly, without any public disclosure of evidence stinks.

"It happens virtually daily that you get somebody to say something that's of material importance," says John Struthers, a leading Toronto defence lawyer.
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2009/02/27/video_of_killing_reveals_no_secrets.html
http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2010/05/05/street_gangs_still_thriving_despite_big_busts.html
http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2010/04/06/dimanno_nothings_wrong_with_rounding_up_bad_guys.html
John Struthers is a defence lawyer for whom I have a great deal of professional respect. I consider him an honourable man in what I occasionally forget is an honourable profession. Struthers is representing several of the men arrested this week, just as he ably represented — and got off on a 2003 murder charge — one of the three men now charged over 72 kilograms of cocaine seized at the Panama end of Project Corral.
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Hashimi seems to have had a great lawyer. I'm interested to know how he afforded such a high profile guy, but maybe he's pro bono?

Either way DiManno likes him.

I want this guys phone number handy if I ever find myself with tons of money and/or questionable evidence in my next revenge killing.
 
Peepers said:
The reference to "editors agreeing with police" suggests to me that police were vetting some of the Ford stories. Perhaps I overstated things by saying they were working closely but I would not be surprised if the Star editors ran many stories past the police first to make sure that they were not negatively impacting the police investigation. In consideration for this I suspect that the police reciprocated by feeding the Star exclusive information so in a sense they were cooperating with each other.
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wouldn't the media be checking with lawyers, not the police, when seeing what it was they could publish?

this is a pretty good read (even though it's not a canadian source) about the relationship between reporters and police...

http://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2011/sep/21/theguardian-police

also...

2013 Law and the Media Workshop

"Major crimes and mega trials: reporting on police, criminals and the courts in the 21st century"

The 2013 workshop was held May 29 at the Law Society building in Vancouver. The workshop examined a fictional scenario involving an alleged gang leader and underling charged with murder. From the first press release announcing the arrests, to the trial of the accused, the workshop instructed journalists how to navigate a complex, developing story both inside and outside the courtroom. The seminar explored the legal pitfalls of newsgathering and reporting, including how best to deal with confidential information, anonymous sources and publication bans.
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https://www.lawsociety.bc.ca/page.cfm?cid=471

[video=youtube;KjkTLbUun0I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjkTLbUun0I[/video]
 
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evvabeing said:
wouldn't the media be checking with lawyers, not the police, when seeing what it was they could publish?

this is a pretty good read (even though it's not a canadian source) about the relationship between reporters and police...

http://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2011/sep/21/theguardian-police

also...



https://www.lawsociety.bc.ca/page.cfm?cid=471

[video=youtube;KjkTLbUun0I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjkTLbUun0I[/video]
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Certainly the media run everything past their lawyers (if it is the least bit controversial) to make sure that they are not opening the company to libel lawsuits. I think the relationship between police and the media as described in the Guardian article is very similar here in Canada. Most of the local reporters who cover the crime beat are reliant on having the police spoon feed them information. As an example if you read Chris Doucette who reports on crime for the SUN his reports seem to be lifted right out of police press releases with little added value. If you follow these reporters on twitter you will see that they keep up a friendly banter with their TPS social media counterparts. This is why it is very rare to see critical reporting of our police. The reporters and the companies that they work for don't want to get frozen out of the inside information.
 
fordmcmurry said:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/rob-ford-crack-scandal-the-lingering-questions-1.2416903

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...y-smith-pictured-in-notorious-rob-ford-photo/


http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...anthony_smith_case_against_hanad_mohamed.html

So, when it suits Blair he says his job is to collect evidence and leave the charges up to the crown.

Ok. Then who in the crown, looking at the evidence, decided to press 1st degree murder charges?

I understand overcharging for a plea. But this plea so quickly, without any public disclosure of evidence stinks.

"It happens virtually daily that you get somebody to say something that's of material importance," says John Struthers, a leading Toronto defence lawyer.
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2009/02/27/video_of_killing_reveals_no_secrets.html
http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2010/05/05/street_gangs_still_thriving_despite_big_busts.html
http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2010/04/06/dimanno_nothings_wrong_with_rounding_up_bad_guys.html


Hashimi seems to have had a great lawyer. I'm interested to know how he afforded such a high profile guy, but maybe he's pro bono?

Either way DiManno likes him.

I want this guys phone number handy if I ever find myself with tons of money and/or questionable evidence in my next revenge killing.
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and what's up with this?

During a recent visit to the Toronto jail, a reporter was told by Hashimi he had never heard of or seen Smith until he was charged in his murder.

“I’m innocent,†he said. “I don’t know these guys. . . . I don’t know why I’m here.â€

Hashimi said all he knows about Smith is what he has read in the newspaper since the drug allegations about Ford have surfaced.
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http://www.thestar.com/news/city_ha...ctured_with_mayor_hurt_in_fatal_shooting.html
 
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