Roads: Ontario/GTA Highways Discussion

[nfitz]

That's not how engineering works though. You can't over design everything because it would be too expensive. Governments can't afford it. There are diminishing returns by spending more money.

As an engineer - that is how engineering works. You design the heck out of it, and then add a huge (often 50%) safety factor. It IS expensive. We are a long way down the diminishing returns track already! Which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

 

[darth_freeman]

As an engineer - that is how engineering works. You design the heck out of it, and then add a huge (often 50%) safety factor. It IS expensive. We are a long way down the diminishing returns track already! Which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

What he's proposing though is more like a 99.9% safety factor.

The barrier on 407ETR is already 1.05m high. Constructing a 2m tall barrier along every 400 series highway would be a waste of hundreds of millions of dollars.

 

[nfitz]

What he's proposing though is more like a 99.9% safety factor.

The barrier on 407ETR is already 1.05m high. Constructing a 2m tall barrier along every 400 series highway would be a waste of hundreds of millions of dollars.

So not much $ then. The question really is how many lives does it save?

My gut feel was that it was overkill, but you can do every 400 series highway for only hundreds of millions rather than billions, then perhaps it's worth it!

 

[lenaitch]

Until the truck is stopped but the load goes over, then it needs to be 5m high.

 

[muller877]

So not much $ then. The question really is how many lives does it save?

My gut feel was that it was overkill, but you can do every 400 series highway for only hundreds of millions rather than billions, then perhaps it's worth it!

This accident may have been hurt or helped with a taller barrier. It may have just caused similar damage but on a different side of the road. We will never know. You can always look at the damage it caused but you also have to look at the damage it might have caused if a different scenario occurred.

There are much more dangerous areas where the money needs to be spent first. Such as actually placing a barrier along some parts of the highway.

 

[rbt]

My gut feel was that it was overkill, but you can do every 400 series highway for only hundreds of millions rather than billions, then perhaps it's worth it!

Rebuilding the median (barrier + asphalt adjacent to it) on Highway 400 along a 30km stretch (Highway 89 to Highway 11) is priced at about $140M. So, barrier is roughly $4.6M/km in 2017 without any roadway reconfiguration. I expect setting up the site for worker safety and overnight work is a non-trivial part of that.

Wiki says there are 1,971.8km of 400 series highway, so replacement barriers system wide is $9B±50%, without considering reconfiguration work such as filling an existing ditches, waterflow management, or roadway widening.

 

[KevinT]

Does building a taller barrier if you're already building/re-building a barrier really cost all that much more though? The slip form is bigger but likely dragged along at the same speed by the same machine, the footing may be dug a little deeper and a little wider, but mostly I'd expect it's just extra concrete trucks.

 

[raptor]

Request for Proposals Closed for The Highway 401 Expansion Project
November 06, 2018
The request for proposals stage has closed for teams to submit their bids to design build and finance the Highway 401 Expansion project.
Following a fair, open and transparent request for qualifications process, three teams - Blackbird Infrastructure Group, LINK401 and West Corridor Constructors - were prequalified and invited to respond to a request for proposals in March 2018. All three teams have submitted their proposals by today's deadline.
Over the next several months, submissions will be evaluated and the outcome is expected to be announced in 2019. A fairness monitor is overseeing the entire procurement process.
Visit here to learn more about the Highway 401 Expansion project.

 

[Allandale25]

Apparently the HOV lanes on the 410 opened today.

 

[TOareaFan]

Apparently the HOV lanes on the 410 opened today.

Southbound yes.....still closed northbound.

 

[toaster29]

And not a single vehicle was using it when I was driving the 410 today.. But I do drive against traffic. 410 is one of the only remaining that is pretty strictly one direction during rush hours.

 

[innsertnamehere]

There isn't a lot of employment in North Brampton, that's why. Not many people work up near Mayfield Road or in Caledon.

 

[Leo_Chan]

And not a single vehicle was using it when I was driving the 410 today.. But I do drive against traffic. 410 is one of the only remaining that is pretty strictly one direction during rush hours.

Probably people who that go in that direction take another route as they know the ramp doesn’t exist. Maybe add a sign at the most common bypass route to say a new ramp exists?

 

[Student99]

what "ramp"??? user was talking about the southbound HOV lane on the 410...

It's pretty visible that it's open. The black coverings were taken off of signage. Pylons were removed, so there is no longer anything blocking the lane.

 

[timio]

Even highways aren't immune: https://www.therecord.com/news-stor...een-waterloo-region-and-guelph-delayed-again/