lenaitch
Senior Member
I suspect Putin, Xi and Un are like most Americans and would have trouble finding Canada on a map
Direct connection to the 401 vs chugging along a city street with multiple traffic lights. Hmmm.
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Roads: Ambassador & Gordie Howe Bridges
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
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innsertnamehere
Superstar
Ambassador will have Duty-Free and cheap gas still, which Gordie won't, so I suspect that will drive traffic..
Similar to Niagara as well, the border wait time will matter more than a few traffic lights as well. Rainbow Bridge ultimately does good business despite no direct highway access because people just go to the bridge with the shortest wait.
Similar to Niagara as well, the border wait time will matter more than a few traffic lights as well. Rainbow Bridge ultimately does good business despite no direct highway access because people just go to the bridge with the shortest wait.
crs1026
Superstar
I haven't gone looking for an official source, but I suspect the volume and pattern of truck traffic outweighs the volume and pattern of autos.
The new bridge is likely to be the better choice for truckers. Hence the sensitivity to the trade issue.
Personally, I stop and gas up at Tilbury and try to blow through the border without a rest stop. But others with stronger bladders may make it to the bridge before stopping.
- Paul
The new bridge is likely to be the better choice for truckers. Hence the sensitivity to the trade issue.
Personally, I stop and gas up at Tilbury and try to blow through the border without a rest stop. But others with stronger bladders may make it to the bridge before stopping.
- Paul
innsertnamehere
Superstar
Truckers still like cheap gas. The cheap gas is only available Canada-bound though, so I suspect US-bound traffic will suffer a worse fate.
As a whole the Ambassador's traffic is going to suffer terribly, especially if they don't adjust their pricing structure. It just won't be a 100% decline.
Edit: Looking at the Ambassador's website, they will finally be accepting EZ-Pass soon. One small silver lining. I hope Gordie Howe does as well - I have an NY EZ-pass as I drive on I90 a few times a year typically and there are no account fees for it.
nfitz
Superstar
Those all sound pretty cheap to me, compared to my 407 bills.
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Haljackey
Active Member
No duty free at Gordie Howe? Very disappointing I was expecting a massive store with great selection. It's my favorite part of crossing the border - getting a nice Whisky or whatever for cheap.
The one at the 405 (Queenston) has the best selection IMO. My shopping there takes longer than whatever girls I am traveling with. Stereotype I know, but only 1L can be duty free, so it's always a tough choice which one to ultimately decide on.
lenaitch
Senior Member
Depending on which study you source, 5-6000 Canadians cross the border for employment daily. I couldn't find any data for US citizens working on our side. Not huge but I suspect most would still use the Ambassador crossing.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
nope.
The big money in border crossing is commercial traffic, which will almost universally go to the Gordie.
Passenger traffic is a lot lower (far more passenger traffic crosses in Niagara than Michigan) - but still significant, and I suspect much of that will go to Gordie as well, particularly if tolls are cheaper.
The Canadian side of the border crossing has 50% more customs lanes for cars too (12 vs 8 at the Ambassador), so it will have far more capacity (and shorter resulting wait times).
Haljackey
Active Member
That suckkkkks
Guess I'll keep using the tunnel for the Duty Free shop there (I steer clear of Ambassador). Probably a lot less crowded once this thing opens anyway.
How many billions did they spend on this thing? 6? And not a penny for a money making duty free store? Stupid.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
Last I heard they were looking at building one potentially, just not for opening day. I'm equally surprised.
Honestly half the time I don't even use the duty free so it doesn't bother me that much. I prefer the Blue Water duty free as well (ambassador duty free sucks in terms of pricing comparatively) and usually go up via Sarnia if I want duty free anyway.
Honestly half the time I don't even use the duty free so it doesn't bother me that much. I prefer the Blue Water duty free as well (ambassador duty free sucks in terms of pricing comparatively) and usually go up via Sarnia if I want duty free anyway.
Haljackey
Active Member
Ya Duty free isn't really that good unless you want a specific item. Some of the Scotch there is 40-50%+ cheaper than the LCBO for example, and sell 'Duty Free Exclusives' you cannot buy elsewhere.
It's also a good place for a bathroom break, especially if you're expecting a long wait at customs.
It's also a good place for a bathroom break, especially if you're expecting a long wait at customs.
just east of the creek
Active Member
The Morouns get to keep the existing bridge as long as it meets safety standards, as they own the structure. And they can replace it if they also then take down the older bridge. I believe that was an option extended to them previously. Not sure I have heard anything recently on their plans.
They also own much land in Windsor in and around the existing bridge, and the lack of upkeep of those properties has been a sore point with Windsorites for some time. Again, I am not sure we have heard any new content on the future of these lands.
I think you have to wonder what the longer term future of the Ambassador Bridge will be. Hard to believe that the Morouns will spend much on an asset not returning on investment.
And I think it is fair to ask what becomes of Huron Church Road once the intense amount of truck traffic moves to the Gordie? Not sure of Windsors plans for this route either.
They also own much land in Windsor in and around the existing bridge, and the lack of upkeep of those properties has been a sore point with Windsorites for some time. Again, I am not sure we have heard any new content on the future of these lands.
I think you have to wonder what the longer term future of the Ambassador Bridge will be. Hard to believe that the Morouns will spend much on an asset not returning on investment.
And I think it is fair to ask what becomes of Huron Church Road once the intense amount of truck traffic moves to the Gordie? Not sure of Windsors plans for this route either.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
My bet is that the Morouns run the Ambassador into the ground until it basically collapses.
At one point they had planned a new bridge right next door, which is why they bought up a bunch of land in Windsor to make space for it (they have since demolished all the houses they purchased, making it vacant land) - but that is dead now as it isn't practical with the Gordie. I can't imagine it will be anywhere close to the money maker it used to be, so my assumption is that they will run it until it needs major capital spending that they can't finance any longer and then will fold and let it become a government liability.
At one point they had planned a new bridge right next door, which is why they bought up a bunch of land in Windsor to make space for it (they have since demolished all the houses they purchased, making it vacant land) - but that is dead now as it isn't practical with the Gordie. I can't imagine it will be anywhere close to the money maker it used to be, so my assumption is that they will run it until it needs major capital spending that they can't finance any longer and then will fold and let it become a government liability.
Haljackey
Active Member
Ya they planned a new 6 lane bridge and actually built a approach ramp for it during the Detroit side interchange reconstructions in the 2000s. That ended up being all for show and a stall tactic they used to propagate Gordie wasn't needed as they were going to build a new span.
Around 2020 or so Canada gave them clearance to build a new bridge to the side if they wanted to. Not sure what the US stance is but judging that approach is there they should be good to go?
They'll probably do nothing until maybe a year or two after Gordie Howe opens. Then it comes time, based on the traffic/revenue levels, to decide to build a replacement span. Either tear down the old bridge and building a new one, or build one parallel. They could also just choose to refurbish the current span (easier to do with less traffic) or just simply run it into the ground, performing as little basic maintenance as possible.
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You can see the (possible future) bridge connection on the US side:
Around 2020 or so Canada gave them clearance to build a new bridge to the side if they wanted to. Not sure what the US stance is but judging that approach is there they should be good to go?
They'll probably do nothing until maybe a year or two after Gordie Howe opens. Then it comes time, based on the traffic/revenue levels, to decide to build a replacement span. Either tear down the old bridge and building a new one, or build one parallel. They could also just choose to refurbish the current span (easier to do with less traffic) or just simply run it into the ground, performing as little basic maintenance as possible.
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You can see the (possible future) bridge connection on the US side:
ShonTron
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Ya they planned a new 6 lane bridge and actually built a approach ramp for it during the Detroit side interchange reconstructions in the 2000s. That ended up being all for show and a stall tactic they used to propagate Gordie wasn't needed as they were going to build a new span.
Around 2020 or so Canada gave them clearance to build a new bridge to the side if they wanted to. Not sure what the US stance is but judging that approach is there they should be good to go?
They'll probably do nothing until maybe a year or two after Gordie Howe opens. Then it comes time, based on the traffic/revenue levels, to decide to build a replacement span. Either tear down the old bridge and building a new one, or build one parallel. They could also just choose to refurbish the current span (easier to do with less traffic) or just simply run it into the ground, performing as little basic maintenance as possible.
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You can see the (possible future) bridge connection on the US side:
There’s also an empty ramp leading to an expansion of the customs plaza on the Canadian side as well.
Agreed it was all for show. I drove across for the first time in years (having made a point of boycotting the bridge) as I figured it’d be the last time I’d ever do so and I remember it being a rough drive, with one lane seemingly permanently out of commission.