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Premier Doug Ford's Ontario

I'm not sure if this should go in the Mississauga Hospital thread, but I think it has some relevance here.

I subscribed to my local councillors' emails, and here is an excerpt:

As many of you have noticed, demolition is underway at Mississauga Hospital to make way for a major expansion. The goal is to transform the site into a new 950-bed Regional Hospital, which will serve not only the residents of Mississauga but also people across the broader region.

While a modernized hospital is welcome news for our growing community, there’s a critical question at stake: Who should bear the cost? Hospitals are traditionally funded by the provincial government, and the Ontario government has agreed to cover the construction expenses. However, they’re asking the City of Mississauga to contribute approximately $450 million toward this project—an amount the government suggests we raise through an increase in property taxes.
Click to expand...

So my question is since when are municipalities expected to contribute half a billion dollars through municipal taxes to fund a hospital? Healthcare is clearly a provincial responsibility. The Ford government is sending out cheques totalling $3 billion but wants Mississauga taxpayers to contribute to funding a hospital through their municipal taxes? Has this ever happened before?
 
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Dan416 said:
I'm not sure if this should go in the Mississauga Hospital thread, but I think it has some relevance here.

I subscribed to my local councillors' emails, and here is an excerpt:



So my question is since when are municipalities expected to contribute half a billion dollars through municipal taxes to fund a hospital? Healthcare is clearly a provincial responsibility. The Ford government is sending out cheques totalling $3 billion but wants Mississauga taxpayers to contribute to funding a hospital through their municipal taxes? Has this ever happened before?
Click to expand...
Yes, Provinces are always whining when the Feds 'do something within Provincial responsibilities" (except they want the $$, just not the reporting back!). The Provinces (and I think Ontario is the worst) then interfere incessantly in the areas best handled by cities - the ridiculously specific Bill on cycle tracks is just the latest example. Yes, Provinces should probably set basic standards and norms but ... Requiring a City to contribute to a hospital does seem over-reach to me.
 
evandyk said:
That sounds off to me. Does the project require reconfiguring some roads that the province expects the city to do? Or are they building a large parking garage that would support more than the hospital?

Edit to add: It seems not. It's just for the hospital. Good discussion of the issue here: https://thepointer.com/article/2024-10-30/council-declines-mississauga-city-hall-contribution-for-new-hospital-trillium-will-have-to-cover-1-5b-local-share#:~:text=Trillium, the hospital network responsible,Province for the transformation of
Click to expand...
Thanks for the link. So the province says this is a normal thing. But City of Toronto has never been asked to do these kind of contributions? Seems like a double standard.
 
Dan416 said:
So my question is since when are municipalities expected to contribute half a billion dollars through municipal taxes to fund a hospital?
Click to expand...

This amount in question would be a new high, for sure, but the idea of municipal contributions to hospital expansion is not.

For clarity, I disagree with the current and long-time funding model, but that's a separate discussion.

This is the manual for major Hospital Capital Projects for Ontario:


The relevant text is below, from p.47

1731427956758.png


In general, local share is understood to be 10% of project cost.

Dan416 said:
The Ford government is sending out cheques totalling $3 billion but wants Mississauga taxpayers to contribute to funding a hospital through their municipal taxes? Has this ever happened before?
Click to expand...

Yes, it has happened lots. Again, the scale of this project is enormous, so the number is that much bigger.

But here's a story from last year on local government pushing back against a more than 200M ask for hospitals in Bracebridge and Huntsville:

www.baytoday.ca

Almaguin communities balk at hospital funding formula

'This is a troubling aspect of the local share funding formula and we're going to keep fighting it. This is an example of an urban formula that doesn't work in a rural setting'
www.baytoday.ca www.baytoday.ca

In 2022, it was the City of Ottawa balking at being asked for 150M

 
Northern Light said:
This amount in question would be a new high, for sure, but the idea of municipal contributions to hospital expansion is not.

For clarity, I disagree with the current and long-time funding model, but that's a separate discussion.

This is the manual for major Hospital Capital Projects for Ontario:


The relevant text is below, from p.47

View attachment 611466

In general, local share is understood to be 10% of project cost.



Yes, it has happened lots. Again, the scale of this project is enormous, so the number is that much bigger.

But here's a story from last year on local government pushing back against a more than 200M ask for hospitals in Bracebridge and Huntsville:

www.baytoday.ca

Almaguin communities balk at hospital funding formula

'This is a troubling aspect of the local share funding formula and we're going to keep fighting it. This is an example of an urban formula that doesn't work in a rural setting'
www.baytoday.ca www.baytoday.ca

In 2022, it was the City of Ottawa balking at being asked for 150M

Click to expand...
Thanks for that.

Interesting that the total cost of the project is unknown so we can’t say for sure if this ask is in line with other projects. But we can definitely say it’s the highest amount ever asked of any municipality.
 
But it does seem like the Trillium management charged forward with the plan to build the hospital, having promised to find its "local share" but it hadn't actually confirmed that Mississauga was prepared to put in $500M towards that local share? Seems like not great management. And why would the Ministry give the green light with such a large hole in the local share plan?
 
I’m no fan of Ford, and at least he didn’t cancel Eglinton, Finch or Hurontario and we started the Ontario line.

But there are just so many missteps:
  • Buying votes with this stupid rebate
  • Demolishing Ontario place
  • Abandoning the Science Centre
  • Greenbelt scandal
  • Highway 413
  • Stupid 401 tunnel idea
Did I miss any?
 
Dan416 said:
I’m no fan of Ford, and at least he didn’t cancel Eglinton, Finch or Hurontario and we started the Ontario line.

But there are just so many missteps:
  • Buying votes with this stupid rebate
  • Demolishing Ontario place
  • Abandoning the Science Centre
  • Greenbelt scandal
  • Highway 413
  • Stupid 401 tunnel idea
Did I miss any?
Click to expand...
Cancelling wind farms when he first came in. Fighting in court (and losing, repeatedly), e.g. fighting giving raises. Having the most bloated cabinet and group of Parliamentary Secretaries, ostensibly so he can trumpet that they are holding the line on MPP compensation.

It's a long list, these are but morsels
 
Dan416 said:
  • Buying votes with this stupid rebate
  • Demolishing Ontario place
  • Abandoning the Science Centre
  • Greenbelt scandal
  • Highway 413
  • Stupid 401 tunnel idea
Did I miss any?
Click to expand...
  • The license plate fiasco.
  • Cutting Toronto City Council during an election
  • Bothced COVID response (at some points during the pandemic)
 
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Dan416 said:
I’m no fan of Ford, and at least he didn’t cancel Eglinton, Finch or Hurontario and we started the Ontario line.

But there are just so many missteps:
  • Buying votes with this stupid rebate
  • Demolishing Ontario place
  • Abandoning the Science Centre
  • Greenbelt scandal
  • Highway 413
  • Stupid 401 tunnel idea
Did I miss any?
Click to expand...
Ford will survive because he's amoral and can turn on a dime if he feels like the political winds are blowing the wrong way. Compare that to the Mcguinty-Wynne Liberals who held onto their ill-fated Green Energy Act until it completely sunk their party.

Ford's also a perpetual campaigner so he's already working with popular name recognition (even for the wrong reasons), and with voters who will accept his flaws as long he communicates he can get something accomplished.
 
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jje1000 said:
Compare that to the Mcguinty-Wynne Liberals who held onto their ill-fated Green Energy Act until it completely sunk their party.
Click to expand...
This is untrue. The GEA was 2009. The Wynne's Liberals went from a minority to a majority in 2014.
Privatizing Hydro One in 2015 has far more to do with her loss than the GEA.
 
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