TheKingEast
Senior Member
Confronted my neighbour today who was blaring music this afternoon. She turned the music off. But tonight is another house party and I feel like I'm inside a club. Time to call security. Complete lack of respect.
|
|
|
Noisy Condo Tenants
- Thread starter PIX
- Start date
NikoS
Active Member
Good luck East! Hopefully they get and understand the message this time! Some people are just stupid!
moonbal
New Member
Sorry to resurrect a dead thread but I have a one helluva case of noise problem.
Here's the lowdown:
I'm in a condo and a group of 3 young guys moved in next door in July 2011. Started partying into late night from day 1. And this would repeat on every other weekends.
When I say late night, I mean past 2am. Sometimes in 4-6am.
I've reported noise to the concierge about 40 times since then. I should've logged every incident but haven't started doing that until last summer.
I went and talked to the management and they quieted down for about 4 months. Then they picked it up again.
I went to the management again. Manager gave them warning again. But they seems to have figured out that they can get away with a slap on the wrist and continue their late night partying.
I begged the manager to contact the condo lawyers but he keeps dodging that route. I asked for a meeting with the board but that too has been made difficult by him.
I've talked to the condo manager 7 times, reported noise over 40 times, yet he still only gives them (renters) and the owner warning letters.
Last weekend they partied from 5am to 6am and I called the cops. I've called cops before but they either quieted down as soon as I made the call or the cops didn't show up. Well, this time cops did show and they were still partying hard.
You know what happened?
Cops knocked on the door 3 times but the music was so loud that they couldn't possibly hear those 'polite' knocks. So the cops just left when nobody answered.
So what are my options here? I'm trying desperately to get a meeting with condo board because I don't think the manager made them aware of this situation.
I'm hoping they're more sympathetic to my plight than the manager.
:end rant
Here's the lowdown:
I'm in a condo and a group of 3 young guys moved in next door in July 2011. Started partying into late night from day 1. And this would repeat on every other weekends.
When I say late night, I mean past 2am. Sometimes in 4-6am.
I've reported noise to the concierge about 40 times since then. I should've logged every incident but haven't started doing that until last summer.
I went and talked to the management and they quieted down for about 4 months. Then they picked it up again.
I went to the management again. Manager gave them warning again. But they seems to have figured out that they can get away with a slap on the wrist and continue their late night partying.
I begged the manager to contact the condo lawyers but he keeps dodging that route. I asked for a meeting with the board but that too has been made difficult by him.
I've talked to the condo manager 7 times, reported noise over 40 times, yet he still only gives them (renters) and the owner warning letters.
Last weekend they partied from 5am to 6am and I called the cops. I've called cops before but they either quieted down as soon as I made the call or the cops didn't show up. Well, this time cops did show and they were still partying hard.
You know what happened?
Cops knocked on the door 3 times but the music was so loud that they couldn't possibly hear those 'polite' knocks. So the cops just left when nobody answered.
So what are my options here? I'm trying desperately to get a meeting with condo board because I don't think the manager made them aware of this situation.
I'm hoping they're more sympathetic to my plight than the manager.
:end rant
Do you have an email address for the board? If so, send your documentation regarding times, police calls, etc. along with your request for a meeting. If you don't have an email address, put it in a sealed envelope addressed to the board. Do you have an AGM or other owners' meeting coming up? If so, raise the issue there publicly. Do other neighbours have a problem with the noise? If yes, get them to also document and submit their concerns, or at least to sign off on yours.
rbt
Senior Member
I think your options are basically the same as if you had a neighbour hosting noisy backyard parties at the house next door; which is to say, you don't have many options.
I've had neighbours who liked to hold parties. Thankfully, they gave plenty of notice and either gave the option of joining them or leaving for the weekend. Also had neighbours who hated us so much that they eventually bankrupted themselves with lawsuits (their lawyer actually took their house to cover unpaid bills; they sued us, the police, and the city without success).
First off, are the neighbours tenants or owners? Call the landlord if they are tenants (land title office will give you ownership information for a small fee). Landlords hate calls about tenants. If they're disturbing the neighbours there is a good chance they're not taking care of the unit.
Secondly, in a condo building you rarely disturb a single unit. What do the other neighbours above/below/beside them think? Can you work together as a group when contacting management/police? Consider filing a group civil suit if you can collectively show damages.
Of course, if the other neighbours (above, below, beside, across the hall) don't see the noise as an issue then you might simply be in the wrong building (or floor; higher floors tend to be quieter) for the lifestyle you want.
Last edited:
moonbal
New Member
I don't have condo board member contact info. I tried to get it from the management office but they said they are not allowed. Is that a law?
And in my opinion, giving notice does not excuse them of this behaviour. I mean is it ok to blast music at 3 in the morning if they give your prior notice? Every other week at that?
Unfortunately, the unit above them and I are the only adjacent neighbours due to the layout of the building.
They're situated right next to the lobby, so a whole chunk of space next, below them is the lobby and guard area.
I had a talk with property manager this morning and emailed him again a while ago and he replied to let me know he will keep me posted with the board. Which is good because he never replies to my emails. Fingers crossed
And in my opinion, giving notice does not excuse them of this behaviour. I mean is it ok to blast music at 3 in the morning if they give your prior notice? Every other week at that?
Unfortunately, the unit above them and I are the only adjacent neighbours due to the layout of the building.
They're situated right next to the lobby, so a whole chunk of space next, below them is the lobby and guard area.
I had a talk with property manager this morning and emailed him again a while ago and he replied to let me know he will keep me posted with the board. Which is good because he never replies to my emails. Fingers crossed
TheKingEast
Senior Member
If you like holding a lot of loud parties then a condo is not for you. In addition, giving warning to neighbours is OK if it's once in a blue moon. If it's several times a month that's unreasonable. Some buildings really do a good job of enforcing noise rules. Others are downright useless. I still don't understand why these expensive condos aren't built with better soundproofing but that's another story.
I have read articles where noisy tenants were evicted. You just have to keep track of all of your complaints and make enough noise. 2 years, though? I would have moved by then. Your management office is pathetic.
3 guys? Is it a big place? Have you spoken with them? I had an issue at my last place with a noisy tenant who moved in. It was ridiculous. I contacted property management, they informed me that I was one of many complaints on this neighbor. The parties and music stopped. It's the management office's responsibility to ensure rules are adhered to. Might need to make some noise.
I have read articles where noisy tenants were evicted. You just have to keep track of all of your complaints and make enough noise. 2 years, though? I would have moved by then. Your management office is pathetic.
3 guys? Is it a big place? Have you spoken with them? I had an issue at my last place with a noisy tenant who moved in. It was ridiculous. I contacted property management, they informed me that I was one of many complaints on this neighbor. The parties and music stopped. It's the management office's responsibility to ensure rules are adhered to. Might need to make some noise.
Management will not give out contact info for board members because of privacy rules. However, there should be generic board contact info via a website, email, something! As an owner, you absolutely should be able to contact the board, at the very least by leaving a letter with security/management. Or check your latest AGM package -- if you had bios for prospective board members, they will often include contact info.
moonbal
New Member
Yeah, it's one of the bigger, corner unit. Big enough for a small family. Previous tenant was a young couple with a newborn. Didn't hear a peep out of them.
I've talked to them on 3 occasions, initially. Turns out first 2 times, they sent out their friends who didn't live there. That shows you how gutless they are. The 3rd time, I caught one of them talking to the guard after I reported noise. He had the gall to tell me to get back inside while he and the guard are settling the matter. I almost jumped him.
You know what his excuse was? That they've been good/quiet for a couple of months so they should be given a break. Yeah, next time a traffic cop stops you, tell them you've been good for years so you should get a free pass. Douche.
I'll try to find the public contact info for the board and get in touch with them for sure. Preparing documents as I type this.
I've talked to them on 3 occasions, initially. Turns out first 2 times, they sent out their friends who didn't live there. That shows you how gutless they are. The 3rd time, I caught one of them talking to the guard after I reported noise. He had the gall to tell me to get back inside while he and the guard are settling the matter. I almost jumped him.
You know what his excuse was? That they've been good/quiet for a couple of months so they should be given a break. Yeah, next time a traffic cop stops you, tell them you've been good for years so you should get a free pass. Douche.
I'll try to find the public contact info for the board and get in touch with them for sure. Preparing documents as I type this.
Bloor West Villager
Active Member
Makes me wonder if you can sue the property management company and/or board. All condos stipulate you have the right to quiet enjoyment and loud partying into the wee hours of the morning is a clear violation of that. Management isn't doing their job - is this not a breach of contract?
taal
Senior Member
Payback ? Blast loud music in their direction 24x7, of course when they're not having a party ?
Murishnikov
New Member
I've been through this and I can only offer the following:
- make copious notes about all the disturbances and capture some audio/video if you can do it and it's compelling (lots of evidence is your friend)
- stay on top of the board and your property management company - they have the obligation to help you out (that's what you're paying condo fees for)
- make sure to read your condo by-laws carefully and be sure to understand which ones apply (most by-laws include provisions about quiet enjoyment and not disturbing neighbours)
- keep calling the police every time they party late at night
- chase down the owner and make it known that this a problem - depending on the kind of person they are, they may or may not be aware what's going on
If you've reached your wits end, contact a lawyer and get him/her to prepare a statement of claim for nuisance and ask for an injunction to cease the nuisance behaviour - this is a legitimate claim under civil law and you can claim significant damages for loss of enjoyment and reduction in value to your home. In my case, I actually reached this stage and prepared a complaint against the owner and the tenant for more than $100,000. While my lawyer felt that I had a strong case, we never actually filed the complaint. I simply prepared it and sent it to the owner/tenant and told them that if they failed to stop the behaviour, I would file and pursue it. Technically, the owner is ultimately responsible, but it's good to include both parties on the complaint. I was prepared to file the complaint and pursue it if I had to (would have been expensive), but I didn't need to. The very threat of something like this got everyone's attention (I also provided a copy to the management company and the board) and things started to happen.
It's worth pointing out that litigation is definitely the "nuclear option", but in my case, I was pushed to the brink. It sounds like you may be in the same spot, so you might want to consider it. Getting the statement of claim prepared is not a complicated or expensive exercise, but it will cost you some money (unless you happen to know a litigation lawyer who owes you a favour).
Hope that helps. I feel your pain and frustration and I hope things get better.
- make copious notes about all the disturbances and capture some audio/video if you can do it and it's compelling (lots of evidence is your friend)
- stay on top of the board and your property management company - they have the obligation to help you out (that's what you're paying condo fees for)
- make sure to read your condo by-laws carefully and be sure to understand which ones apply (most by-laws include provisions about quiet enjoyment and not disturbing neighbours)
- keep calling the police every time they party late at night
- chase down the owner and make it known that this a problem - depending on the kind of person they are, they may or may not be aware what's going on
If you've reached your wits end, contact a lawyer and get him/her to prepare a statement of claim for nuisance and ask for an injunction to cease the nuisance behaviour - this is a legitimate claim under civil law and you can claim significant damages for loss of enjoyment and reduction in value to your home. In my case, I actually reached this stage and prepared a complaint against the owner and the tenant for more than $100,000. While my lawyer felt that I had a strong case, we never actually filed the complaint. I simply prepared it and sent it to the owner/tenant and told them that if they failed to stop the behaviour, I would file and pursue it. Technically, the owner is ultimately responsible, but it's good to include both parties on the complaint. I was prepared to file the complaint and pursue it if I had to (would have been expensive), but I didn't need to. The very threat of something like this got everyone's attention (I also provided a copy to the management company and the board) and things started to happen.
It's worth pointing out that litigation is definitely the "nuclear option", but in my case, I was pushed to the brink. It sounds like you may be in the same spot, so you might want to consider it. Getting the statement of claim prepared is not a complicated or expensive exercise, but it will cost you some money (unless you happen to know a litigation lawyer who owes you a favour).
Hope that helps. I feel your pain and frustration and I hope things get better.
DSC
Superstar
Member Bio
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2008
- Messages
- 18,996
- Reaction score
- 26,397
- Location
- St Lawrence Market Area
Bottom line is that the BOARD is in control (or should be) and the Management Company is their 'servant". Though you may not want the expense (ca $100) to get a Status Certificate these contain the names of all Directors and usually their Unit number. As noted above, this info will also appear in AGM info etc and it would be cheaper just to ask to see the last AGM minutes where all the Board should be identified. Boards have a LEGAL responsibility under the Act to enforce the Rules and the By-Laws of the Corporation and these normally have express statements about noise. You should remind the Board of their legal responsibilities and quote the Rule to them. If you do not have a copy of your condo's Rules you can look at them freely or get a copy, possibly for a reasonable cost, from the Property manager. My Condo's Rule reads "No noise caused by any instrument or other device or otherwise howsoever caused, including noise caused by any pet, which, in the opinion of the board or property manager disturbs the comfort or quiet enjoyment of the property by another owner, shall be permitted."
kalvinone
Active Member
+2 Thanks
Always wondered this if I were to ever run into this myself... thankfully no.. knock on concrete.
Always wondered this if I were to ever run into this myself... thankfully no.. knock on concrete.
moonbal
New Member
To give you an update, I wrote to the manager again, asking for board's contact info and he told me it's against the policy and that he will let the board know of this matter.
And it seems there's no law requiring the board members contact info be made public to the owners. WTF is up with the condo act? It's goddamn joke...
And it seems there's no law requiring the board members contact info be made public to the owners. WTF is up with the condo act? It's goddamn joke...