Metrolinx: Bombardier Flexity Freedom & Alstom Citadis Spirit LRVs

[EastYorkTTCFan]

Plus as I said when they actually came into use the people who use the TTC in Toronto will be used to having a presto reader at the door of the train and not having to look for one on the platform somewhere.

 

[Steve X]

I guess they must be more respectful then the people in Toronto who use the streetcar right of way cto criss cross the street. Plus if the way that streetcar platforms get crowded is any indication tapping into a reader at any part of the platform is going to be next to impossible. it really wouldn't surprise me at all if they do just put readers on the cars to avoid having problems with people saying I couldn't get to a machine so I figured I could ride for free.

Calgary has a pretty busy LRT system. Hong Kong has an even busier LRT system. We don't see things doing wrong there. Why can't Toronto be like other cities? Calgary uses a much older system where riders have to either purchase tickets ahead of time and punch them in the validatior or buy a fare at the vending machine. HK has a smart card system that requires tap on and off. No problem there will super busy platforms. The readers won't be located on the platforms itself but at the entrance of the platform before or after the train's stopping location. Riders would simply tap or purchase their fares and move onto the platform. TTC can place many readers at busy stops so it's no excuse for not tapping. It works all around the world so if Torontians can't figure out. Get educated. TTC should also update their website on how streetcar riders should pay their fares.

A few well placed signs should do the trick. On the Spadina streetcar, they should place signs saying "pay fare on streetcar" while the LRT would clearly label "fare paid zone, must have POP past the fare zone line". It should be made pretty obvious that if someone crosses that line drawn on the platform, they will be subject to a fine if unable to produce POP.

I expect fare gates would be installed at every underground station. People should be expected to go through fare gates transferring from the LRT to the subway and exit any underground station. If they didn't pay beforehand, they would be charge there if they're using presto. If they don't pay, they can't get out any underground stations and would be forced to head back to the surface stops. By then, one time tickets would have a RFID chip too to allow them to transfer. No one should be able to get a free ride beyond the surface LRT. It would make fare enforcement much easier too.

 

[crs1026]

All of these approaches work just fine. The problem is when the same system mixes them in together. I tap on board on Spadina but I don't on Eglinton? Fare gates at Dufferin but no fare gates at Cedarvale?
The system needs to be built with the user in mind - keep it simple and consistent.

- Paul

 

[KevinT]

WTF??? It looks like Grand Moff Tarkin should be standing there. I'd rebel if someone made me wear that.

Perhaps they went with grey as a neutral colour for the pilot vehicles, since they aren't allocated to (or branded for) any particular line.

 

[Allandale25]

From a railfan group late last night:

Tomorrow's [today's] CP 420 is the one to have the car apparently. Due anytime between 19:00 - 01:00 into Sudbury tonight [yesterday]. Someone I know caught her earlier today around the Chapleau area and saw the car unless he meant yesterday [late last night?] he saw him [the train with the LRV].

 

[nfitz]

From a railfan group late last night:

Way out of date. It arrived at Toronto Yard this morning.

 

[Allandale25]

Way out of date. It arrived at Toronto Yard this morning.

Well, I do the best I can to pass on information when I hear it. Fully appreciate the time lag and realize others might be able to provide more current information.

By Toronto Yard, is that Lambton or Agincourt?

 

[Allandale25]

Way out of date. It arrived at Toronto Yard this morning.

Any sense of how long it'll be there for and where it'll go next?

 

[Red October]

It's been stated before that fare payment will be at the surface stops, which are not pretty much just streetcar stops. Just put the presto readers near the end of the platform that riders enter from and they can easily tap at they pass by. Installing presto readers on on board would require 12 readers per LRV. rather than just maybe two per surface platform.

This is what I was thinking. Similar to what Istanbul does with their surface LRT:

(sorry for the stock photo, it was surprisingly difficult to find a picture that illustrated what I was thinking about)

 

[Voltz]

Well they won't have turnstiles here,

 

[drum118]

This is what I was thinking. Similar to what Istanbul does with their surface LRT:

(sorry for the stock photo, it was surprisingly difficult to find a picture that illustrated what I was thinking about)

Never saw that in any of the 25 cities in 12 countries I visited in 2012 for Europe. Thats why you had a hard time trying to find this.

What good is it when you can walk by the entrance and step up onto the platform??

 

[Steve X]

The LRT platforms are suppose to look different than the downtown streetcar ROW platform. The LRT platforms are much wider and longer than what we see on Spadina. People should be able to tell the difference.

That stock photo is rather extreme. Anyone can still just walk to the platform, so it really serves no purpose to just block off access with a turnstile. Just have some readers on the side. I highly doubt the city would promote midblock jaywalking by having the readers on the entire LRV train.

 

[Red October]

Never saw that in any of the 25 cities in 12 countries I visited in 2012 for Europe. Thats why you had a hard time trying to find this.

What good is it when you can walk by the entrance and step up onto the platform??

When I used it they had security at the platform, but I imagine there's also POP.

It's just another level of "pay here" than just having an open platform with a card reader located somewhere, or a bunch of them on a train where you'd get the same problem.

 

[smallspy]

By Toronto Yard, is that Lambton or Agincourt?

Agincourt. 420 doesn't normally service Lambton.

It's going to have to get shuffled to CN at some point for delivery to Bombardier, but I don't know if that will happen in Toronto, or some place further east.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[APTA-2048]

When I used it they had security at the platform, but I imagine there's also POP.

It's just another level of "pay here" than just having an open platform with a card reader located somewhere, or a bunch of them on a train where you'd get the same problem.

Is that level really worth the cost if it can be defeated so easily? If someone really wanted to avoid paying the fare, they would just walk around it.