Mayor Olivia Chow's Toronto

[elcorrerador]

I was curious to know how much these signs cost.
Has the city used these before?

 

[Northern Light]

‘Too big and unsightly’: Two Toronto councillors ask city to replace signs for Alcohol in Parks pilot with smaller ones

Two Toronto councillors are saying that the large-scale signs the city has chosen to use for its ‘Alcohol in Parks’ pilot program are “too big and unsightly” and want to see them removed and replaced with “appropriately scaled signage.”

www.cp24.com

They deployed comically large signs;
then they used the tiniest font size on them.

View attachment 500025

I feel like its amusing that one of the first 'acts' of the new admin is to publicly tell off Parks for wasting money and being over-bearing.

It gives me some hope.....hopefully not misplaced.

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The font observation is 100% on point and hilarious.

****

Good on @elcorrerador for looking up the cost of these things

While the cost of one is not prohibitive, if still foolish and wasteful; the cumulative cost across all the approved sites does add up.

 

[zang]

I was curious to know how much these signs cost.
Has the city used these before?

View attachment 500056

that is very likely not the price the city paid; they likely got a bulk discount.

Curbex also covers all costs of design, delivery, repair and any vandalism. I’m not sure that this isn’t the cheaper option to be honest.

I don’t get why so many people are upset about this. It’s an informational temporary sign. Comparing it to existing signage is moot because it’s likely a month or two from now they’ll be gone.

The size is intentional; to attract attention. Let’s not kid ourselves that outside of UT, municipal politics likely doesn’t have a get a lot of awareness amongst the general public.I certainly myself have friends who weren’t aware of it.

 

[picard102]

I guess Fletcher and Bravo have nothing else going on in their communities that signage is a bee in their bonnets.
They do know these are informational for a new program and not permanent signage like the smoking ones they are referencing... right?

 

[Northern Light]

I guess Fletcher and Bravo have nothing else going on in their communities that signage is a bee in their bonnets.
They do know these are informational for a new program and not permanent signage like the smoking ones they are referencing... right?

Wow, you're siding with Zang in favour of wasting money, and chiding NDP councillors who find moral hectoring at significant cost unnecessary.

Clearly something in the space-time continuum is out of alignment today.

 

[DSC]

I think I can hear the sound of shit about to hit a fan! Not expecting this to be a cheerrful meeting!

NOTICE OF SPECIAL MEETING

EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE

AUGUST 24, 2023 - 9:30 a.m.

In accordance with Sections 27-5.3 and 27-5.9 of Chapter 27 of the City of Toronto Municipal Code, Mayor Olivia Chow has called a Special Executive Committee meeting to be held on Thursday, August 24, 2023 at 9:30 a.m. in Committee Room 1, Toronto City Hall, 100 Queen Street West, for the following purpose:

1. To consider a report from the City Manager on the long term financial plan.

Members of Council and City Officials will be provided with the video conference details closer to the meeting date.

 

[zang]

Wow, you're siding with Zang in favour of wasting money, and chiding NDP councillors who find moral hectoring at significant cost unnecessary.

Clearly something in the space-time continuum is out of alignment today.

Wow, I thought you were ignoring me, and this little beef of yours is coming across like petulance.

 

[Northern Light]

Wow, I thought you were ignoring me, and this little beef of yours is coming across like petulance.

I am, in general, ignoring you; however, when other members respond to you, I may require the context of what they are responding to in order to respond to them.

I have no 'beef' with you.

I simply think you're wrong, on many things, and I think you're positions, by and large, are intellectually unjustifiable; and that you're unwilling to admit defeat on an issue
even when the evidence is overwhelmingly against you; and that you, yourself resort to petulant personalization of arguments, accusing people of being immoral or holding unethical positions when you are resoundingly repudiated.

Shrug.

Its just easier to default to not reading your stuff.

Moving along.

 

[picard102]

Wow, you're siding with Zang in favour of wasting money, and chiding NDP councillors who find moral hectoring at significant cost unnecessary.

Clearly something in the space-time continuum is out of alignment today.

I think the city using large format signage for public notices on new programs to not be a waste of money. Anymore than the large signs about new developments are a waste of money.
I couldn't tell you what affiliation either of these councilors with pristine wards are, who don't know the difference between permanent bylaw signage vs new program announcement signage.

 

[Northern Light]

I think the city using large format signage for public notices on new programs to not be a waste of money.

Except there really isn't a new program. What there is, is acknowledgement of the tacit policy of permitting drinking in parks (no one was charged last year, by by-law or police for this offense, and nothing is really changing.)

The signs pretend there is real change and then go on to hector people about not drinking near playgrounds and being nice etc.

We (The City) do not routinely use signage of this type for comparatively minor things like this; its certainly not unheard of, but not common either.

***

But both Parks and the City more broadly do have a tendency to publish too many rules, and to highlight those in too many places, meanwhile rarely enforcing any of them. Which does not serve respect for the law well.

Cities around the world permit drinking in parks without issue; disorderly conduct, public intoxication, etc are already addressed by the Criminal Code and the City needn''t duplicate the regulation, nor complicate it.

 

[DSC]

I think the city using large format signage for public notices on new programs to not be a waste of money. Anymore than the large signs about new developments are a waste of money.
I couldn't tell you what affiliation either of these councilors with pristine wards are, who don't know the difference between permanent bylaw signage vs new program announcement signage.

The waste of money is that the City has LOTS of Rules but enforces few of them. Having posted signs is a way to make us all feel 'something is being done' when it really isn't. Of course, these Drinking signs are FAR too large but...

 

[W. K. Lis]

Compare with Central Park in New York City, they have restaurants that serve the dreadful alcohol, carts that serve a "variety" of products, and picnics with alcohol. In Toronto, they create rules and menus that need to be approved, that all have to follow because of the bureaucrats enjoy the authority that it brings them. We can't have an outdoor tavern by a pond or park lake.

See link.

 

[Northern Light]

Compare with Central Park in New York City, they have restaurants that serve the dreadful alcohol, carts that serve a "variety" of products, and picnics with alcohol. In Toronto, they create rules and menus that need to be approved, that all have to follow because of the bureaucrats enjoy the authority that it brings them. We can't have an outdoor tavern by a pond or park lake.

See link.

I agree w/the gist of the above; but worth saying, Toronto does have licensed restaurants in parks, in both the Eastern Beaches and the Western Beaches.

Neither is particularly good, and the one in the east was particularly controversial for its lease terms and the nature of same being issued. (one company has a monopoly on concessions in the Eastern Beaches)

But again, that does speak to a bureaucracy not functioning particularly well.

 

[picard102]

Having posted signs is a way to make us all feel 'something is being done' when it really isn't.

And if that convinces the Karen across from the park that they don't need to call 311 or 911 to report people in these pilot parks, then good on them.

 

[DSC]

I agree w/the gist of the above; but worth saying, Toronto does licensed restaurants in parks, in both the Eastern Beaches and the Western Beaches.

Neither is particularly good, and the one in the east was particularly controversial for its lease terms and the nature of same being issued. (one company has a monopoly on concessions in the Eastern Beaches)

But again, that does speak to a bureaucracy not functioning particularly well.

and High Park, I think.