King Street (Streetcar Transit Priority)

[steveintoronto]

If dashcams are getting to be common in regular motor vehicles, so could they be used in transit vehicles.

If the plates can be read, which is a problem sometimes. Some plates are dirty or deliberately obscured.

It can be a $85 fine. Higher in other jurisdictions. Hopefully, the cops stopping vehicles will check to see if the plates are readable.

Except Toronto and other jurisdictions have had incredibly good success with Red Light Camera programs.

By Ben SpurrTransportation Reporter
Mon., Jan. 16, 2017
Toronto’s red-light camera program is headed for a major expansion, a year after the devices appear to have resulted in a record number of charges against drivers.

Last week, Toronto officials announced plans that could see the number of cameras, currently installed at 77 locations across the city, effectively doubled. The expansion is being billed as part of the city’s new $80-million road safety plan, which Mayor John Tory has championed with the aim of eliminating traffic deaths and serious injuries.

“I think the objective here is to get people to slow down and drive safely in school zones, seniors zones, places like that, to stop this carnage that’s been happening on the roads and to get (the number of traffic deaths) down to zero,” Tory said at a press conference last Tuesday, speaking in support of the cameras.

Last year, 77 drivers, car passengers, pedestrians and cyclists were killed on Toronto’s streets, the highest number of traffic fatalities in more than a decade.
[...]

https://www.thestar.com/news/pedest...more-red-light-cameras-coming-to-toronto.html

And here's an analogy to the TTC's wish for video recording miscreant drivers:

School bus cameras back in Ontario's sights, but Wynne won't commit
Other jurisdictions, including in Texas and Virginia, already have similar technology in place
The Canadian Press Posted: May 06, 2017 1:15 PM ET Last Updated: May 06, 2017 1:23 PM ET

Ontario legislators are debating the idea of using cameras on school buses to ticket drivers that illegally blow past the vehicles as children get on and off, but the government isn't ready to commit to the measure without further study.

Local politicians and school bus companies have called on the provincial government to pass legislation that will enable video from cameras mounted on the outside of school buses to be admitted as evidence in court without a witness to back up the footage, as is currently the requirement.

• School bus cameras could catch those passing stopped buses
• School bus cameras aimed at careless drivers

Such a change in law could mean that the owners of vehicles that illegally pass school buses get tickets in the mail after being caught on camera.

But Transportation Minister Steven Del Duca said while the Liberal government is supportive of the idea, it isn't ready to pass legislation on it without further consideration.

The government has some concerns about the details of the technology involved and the legislative change it would require, he said.

"We're going to make sure we get it right," Del Duca said. "Moving forward with technology that doesn't actually provide you with the outcome you're looking for doesn't make a lot of sense to me."

Tech already in action elsewhere
Several jurisdictions in the U.S., including in Texas and Virginia, already use school bus cameras to ticket drivers.

A pilot project also tested the technology this spring in Brantford, Mississauga, Sudbury and Kitchener-Waterloo. It was conducted by a company that makes the cameras, along with municipalities, school boards and police forces in the communities.

The project found drivers illegally passed school buses that stopped to let children on or off — with their lights flashing and stop-arm out — in all those communities.

In rural Brantford, there was one blow-by per bus every three days, but in Mississauga, the problem was the worst — occurring an average of two-and-a-half times per bus per day. [...]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/buses-cameras-ontario-1.4103093

The point as it pertains to the present Pilot, is that we can't wait for QP to figure out priorities. They have enough scandals to deal with as it is. TTC and/or City should send a solicitor's letter to the Honourable Minister of Puffery, Perfundary and Announcements stating that "as per the agreement signed with (xxx)(ION) the Corp of City or Toronto intends to establish same". What's his Highness to do? Call a press conference to announce "No"? "Let them ride cakes"?

It would require having a backbone...and therein lies the greatest challenge.

 

[steveintoronto]

Actually, these are the perfect places for stations. What we need is European style traffic priority stoplights.

European style "FAR-SIDE" traffic priority speedup for trams/streetcars
--> Stoplight automatically stay green until streetcar coasts past (or shortens red cycle upon GPS-trigger of approching streetcar)
--> Stops at platform to pick up people
--> Streetcar can immediately begin accelerating, never having been stymied by a red light.

I believe ION already has similar. If anyone is good at Googling, please try and find the legal background on their doing so. I've tried a number of times, and it's hopefully just the case of having the right 'tags' to get the result. "ION" in itself leads you to everywhere but Waterloo Region, even with modifier tags added in.

 

[drum118]

I believe ION already has similar. If anyone is good at Googling, please try and find the legal background on their doing so. I've tried a number of times, and it's hopefully just the case of having the right 'tags' to get the result. "ION" in itself leads you to everywhere but Waterloo Region, even with modifier tags added in.

All the transit signals are bar for both nearside and far side that I have seen so far. As for legal background, it has to be around since TTC has a few location for them for years. ION is a more advance system and a testbed for a new set of laws from what I can tell.

 

[DSC]

Reading some of the genuine feedback from actual users, I don't think it'll get better for them even with those improvements due to fundamental issues. Basically seeing that Streetcars will continue to get much more crowded as:

-Queen riders move there (funnily, probably made worse because of cars diverting to Queen from King slowing Queen traffic to a crawl),

Data, data, data vs subjective opinion. Steve Munro has crunched the numbers for before and the first few weeks numbers for after for both the 501 Queen streetcar and the 6 Bay bus. His conclusion, so far, is "For both routes, there is almost no change in the average travel times after the pilot began. Values on Queen bounce around a lot, but they do so both before and after the pilot began." His full report is at: https://stevemunro.ca/ Steve continues to produce reports on the pilot that are based on actual facts.

 

[steveintoronto]

Data, data, data vs subjective opinion. Steve Munro has crunched the numbers for before and the first few weeks numbers for after for both the 501 Queen streetcar and the 6 Bay bus. His conclusion, so far, is "For both routes, there is almost no change in the average travel times after the pilot began. Values on Queen bounce around a lot, but they do so both before and after the pilot began." His full report is at: https://stevemunro.ca/ Steve continues to produce reports on the pilot that are based on actual facts.

Steve Munro has also blasted the City for a half-assed and penny pinching approach to the King Pilot.

 

[steveintoronto]

All the transit signals are bar for both nearside and far side that I have seen so far. As for legal background, it has to be around since TTC has a few location for them for years. ION is a more advance system and a testbed for a new set of laws from what I can tell.

"ION is a more advance system and a testbed for a new set of laws from what I can tell" Yeah...if @reaperexpress is reading this, he appears to be the most schooled on their system in these threads, it would be great for him to review what he's already posted here and in the ION string.

That I have yet to read any media mentioning the comparison is troubling. Of course, it would help if City Hall had done their homework and linked it prior, but alas...

To any other readers, anything you could add on ION's legal basis and methods most appreciated.

Addendum: Just tried Googling, still coming up with nothing save for the UT ION string:
https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threa...-king-victoria-transit-terminal.19202/page-81

It's frustrating! The info must be out there, and probably on-line. I just might call or email ION to ask them for a reference.

 

[pstogios]

That's true, and that's why they're adding streetcars.

......

But that's quite difficult. We need the parking garages on King (I drive, too, by the way. but I support the Pilot).

Sorry for being off-topic and at the risk of being censured again by the mods, but I need to say that these pages-long replies by you really take away from the threads you post in.

Not many (most?) people have the time to read such long messages.

 

[mdrejhon]

Sorry for being off-topic and at the risk of being censured again by the mods, but I need to say that these pages-long replies by you really take away from the threads you post in.

Not many (most?) people have the time to read such long messages.

I now relatively-sparingly post my long posts (you should have seen me here in 2014-2015!).... But it was an important reply to educate -- and if you scroll back, you'll see at least three people "Liked" the big post, and two replied! Just skip over my posts if you prefer.

As Executive Director of the Hamilton LRT Advocacy (community run by residents) and writer of transit articles from time to time, I do add interesting stuff & knowledge to the conversation from time to time.

 

[Jaye101]

Sorry for being off-topic and at the risk of being censured again by the mods, but I need to say that these pages-long replies by you really take away from the threads you post in.

Not many (most?) people have the time to read such long messages.

His reply is well sourced and informative. I would suggest that you refrain from needlessly accosting other forumers. You lot can be quite condescending to one another sometimes.

 

[DSC]

Not many (most?) people have the time to read such long messages.

It is somewhat simplistic to think that complex topics can always be covered in short messages. Forums have all kinds of posters; some are verbose, others post one-liners, some can't spell (or be bothered to proof-read), some repeatedly post with their hobby-horses, some are almost always on topic and useful. Some give great information, others constantly report with 'my opinion' with no proof ever shown that it is worth much. A forum is not Twitter and if you can't cope with long posts you should not read them or you should block the posters whose posts offend you. Nobody forces anyone to read all posts or all posters.

 

[crs1026]

I am all for a long post if it is well organised and makes intelligent points, which this one did.

If the forum demanded brevity I'm sure the UT folks would configure the system to constrain post length. They haven't.

- Paul

 

[blixtex]

Data, data, data vs subjective opinion. Steve Munro has crunched the numbers for before and the first few weeks numbers for after for both the 501 Queen streetcar and the 6 Bay bus. His conclusion, so far, is "For both routes, there is almost no change in the average travel times after the pilot began. Values on Queen bounce around a lot, but they do so both before and after the pilot began." His full report is at: https://stevemunro.ca/ Steve continues to produce reports on the pilot that are based on actual facts.

Well the data seems to off (or lagging) or methodology off based on the 'time' savings that was done by U of T, whereas it shows not much change from the 504 King. I'm basing my comments on these observations from previous posts which I put more weight on in recent times. I talked to my sister on Sunday and she also went through a list of reasons why it doesn't really save time, and prefers the old stop layout.

"↑
I'll take a more conservative 75,000 per day by 2018.

But from what I hear from people, the King Streetcar is way more crowded since this project begun. One girl even suggesting to me that she is going to start driving because of how uncomfortably crowded it's gotten. I guess everyone has their threshold for what they'll consider acceptable."

"↑
A little anecdotal observation: I took the 504 from Spadina to a meeting near Parliament. I got there in about 10 minutes but the streetcar was packed the entire way. On the way back, I took the 501 on Queen to compare. It was a lot longer, almost half an hour stuck in traffic from about Yonge all the way to Spadina. The kicker though: the streetcar was nearly empty at around 3:30pm.

It’s pretty clear that people who took the 501 have migrated to the 504 since it’s like a downtown subway.

This is a good indication that the TTC should be shifting 501 capacity to deal with the new demand on King. Could they not create a new Queen/King hybrid route?"

Reading the comments from a Streetcar driver:

"Also, a big problem is the queue of cars waiting to turn right from east King to south Simcoe was so long, it backed up past the point of where they put the flower boxes in the EB curb lane, preventing streetcars from proceeding." (back to the drawing board on that one? which I predicted would happen)

 

[innsertnamehere]

they have said they will be making tweaks - expanding right turn queue areas would definitely be a possibility.

 

[blixtex]

they have said they will be making tweaks - expanding right turn queue areas would definitely be a possibility.

It's funny in that they just put those planters (and will continue to do so) to try to get rid of one problem but it created another unexpected problem. So that new solution will re-introduce the old problem + whatever proportional new one based on how differently they find this solution.

It reminds of me trying to dig a deep pit in the sand and the more you dig, the more sand comes down. The more you try to clear that area, sand comes down from somewhere else. Ultimately they'll get it right.. but it might take longer than a year and much more $$ than expected.

 

[raptor]

It's funny in that they just put those planters (and will continue to do so) to try to get rid of one problem but it created another unexpected problem. So that new solution will re-introduce the old problem + whatever proportional new one based on how differently they find this solution.

It reminds of me trying to dig a deep pit in the sand and the more you dig, the more sand comes down. The more you try to clear that area, sand comes down from somewhere else. Ultimately they'll get it right.. but it might take longer than a year and much more $$ than expected.

Alternating one ways is the only solution