News   Nov 18, 2024
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News   Nov 18, 2024
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Hume on Bay Street

I don't agree with Hume on this, but frankly, these reviews are highly beside the point anyways. If you cut through his blather, then this is the sum total of what he actually addresses about this building:

The miserable green metal columns that support the glass canopy clutter the sidewalk and the building. You just want to get past it as fast as possible.
The frontage on Bay and Gerrard Sts. has been broken up into a series of bays that reach up from a four-storey base. The bricks are beige and the results aren't pretty.


The rest could really be about any building anywhere. I do agree that the green metal columns are unfortunate (and we've discussed that a lot here), but I find his statement that you want to get past it as fast as possible to be bizarrely overstated. I have no problem with the brick colour, and find that throwaway comment thoughtless.

As for the row of four houses that survived nearby - they were boilerplate in their own time. The developer who put those up made a row of houses did more or less what every other developer did at the time, in the same style, with a profit motive. Sometimes I find Hume weirdly sentimental, without thought.

Myself, I would say that this building does a reasonable job of what it needs to do. It provides retail along both Bay and Gerrard in a way that is quite useful, it defines the street with its mass, the entrances for cars are as discreet as they can be, it acknowledges that it is on a corner with its rounded edge on the second floor and its angled window treatment.

It sort of reminds me of a Berlin loaf. Of such things are cities built.

Maybe the biggest slur I can muster up re this kind of mild orange-brick economy-model developer's postmodernism is "Huang & Danczkayesque"--and the Liberties is pretty inoffensive compared to H&D's infamous Queen's Quay "ugly siblings". And it shows more urban responsibility than the slightly earlier condo at the corner of Bay + Edward...
 
Adma, there certainly are worse examples on Bay. Yes, however, Bay Street fails to engage, and I agree with that sentiment.

Ganj, I wonder (and this is a thought, not even a suggestion) if the passage of time and the mere "differentness" of buildings from the past helps us accept them. I've been shocked a few times reading contemporary assessments about early 20th Century buildings, and how bitter and mean they treated buildings we now adore.

Also, the photo you posted isn't easily comparable - that row of buildings would have been the absolute creamest of the cream for high end residential anywhere in the world at that time - a yardstick by which upper Bay in Toronto is certain to fail. A better comparison, but one that might still work for you, would be much lower-end buildings built at the same time. Like tenements - with storefronts in the lower levels. (There, though, the comparison gets mucked up by significant differences in scale).
 
The miserable green metal columns that support the glass canopy clutter the sidewalk and the building. You just want to get past it as fast as possible.

Sorry for digging up this very old thread about the Liberties, but the "miserable green metal columns", as well as all the exterior sconces, are being painted... a very shiny silver. Classy.
 
I can't recall when I have flipped on an opinion so quickly.
I was about to agree on unimaginative's post a couple up and then I saw Ganjavih's post right after with the pic attached. I paused and I smiled. Time heals all wounds and scars soften with time.
This IS Bay St. today. Banal? No argument. Tomorrow? An appearance that will most likely looked upon with fondness.
 
Sorry Granny--are you saying that Fifth Avenue as shown IS Bay Street, for all intents and purposes?

If so, I disagree. Bay is much more urban and multi-income than Fifth Avenue, particularly above 59th Street.
 
Sorry Granny--are you saying that Fifth Avenue as shown IS Bay Street, for all intents and purposes?

If so, I disagree. Bay is much more urban and multi-income than Fifth Avenue, particularly above 59th Street.



I think I see what you mean and I agree, but to call Bay Street more urban seems a bit subjective. Right behind Fifth is Madison Ave, the main commercial street for the Upper East Side. The fact that Fifth in this neighborhood is zoned purely for residential purposes has not hurt street traffic as it also is zoned for the city's museums. Central Park being right across the street hasn't exactly hurt either.

I believe Bay Street still has great potential but think that to suggest that people will look upon what's there now north of Queen they way they now do Fifth in a generation's time is absurd. No one has yet romanticised First Ave., which is much more similar to Bay in terms of architecture.
 
I believe Bay Street still has great potential but think that to suggest that people will look upon what's there now north of Queen they way they now do Fifth in a generation's time is absurd. No one has yet romanticised First Ave., which is much more similar to Bay in terms of architecture.

I like First Avenue. It's an underdog, and I like underdogs;-)
 
I'm excited to see what sort of character Bay st. takes on in the coming years when all the parking lots / wasted commercial space is filled in. I don't mind the architecture so much as I mind a street lacking an identity. Right now the commercial character has yet to mature, Bay St. is still peppered with coffee shops, subways, some bank branches and a variety of convienance stores to service nearby commercial and the new residential.

Just wait though, as the area matures I have faith that some great dining, fashion outlets (to rival nearby yonge), and maybe some decent nightlife will move in.
 
I'm intrigued by the court yard SW corner of Bay & Charles. Those nice trees were installed last year and the retail space is being torn out and rebuilt. Its a very interesting space and not too far from Bloor. If they get it right, maybe a hip restaurant it could kick start some interesting activity extending down Bay, especially when U Condos get completed.

Does anyone about plans for this spot 57 Charles West?
 
I'm intrigued by the court yard SW corner of Bay & Charles. Those nice trees were installed last year and the retail space is being torn out and rebuilt. Its a very interesting space and not too far from Bloor. If they get it right, maybe a hip restaurant it could kick start some interesting activity extending down Bay, especially when U Condos get completed.

Does anyone about plans for this spot 57 Charles West?

I hope so, too. The reconstruction of what used to be a small grocery/corner store at 57 Charles is slow going and I'm not confident. Bay street south of Bloor seems unable to attract anything decent these days, and with the death of Bistro 990 you really can't find anything unique without venturing off behind St. Mary/St. Joseph. I'm hoping a decent restaurant would open up near by to replace Bistro 990 but I doubt it.
 
Bay st is undoubtedly the biggest failure in downtown Toronto. Bad architecture, bad street life;
University Ave has good architecture, but it is boring because there is nothing on it for people to go to north of Queen;
Yonge St has many interesting stores, but architecturally wise, mediocre at best;
Jarvis St has interesting historic buildings, but suffer the same problem as University;
Spadina is kind of interesting but looks rundown and messy in most part;
Bathurst is basically a suburban street.

I think Yonge will be transforming into something quite different, no matter local people like it or not.
University and Jarvis need to be transformed by adding tons of retail and other stuff to give a reason for people to go to as a destination, rather than a thoroughfare for cars to get to the core.
 
I think Yonge will be transforming into something quite different, no matter local people like it or not.
University and Jarvis need to be transformed by adding tons of retail and other stuff to give a reason for people to go to as a destination, rather than a thoroughfare for cars to get to the core.

Consider what is located on University:
College to Dundas-> most of the major hospitals are located there
Dundas to Queen-> Provincial courthouse on one side and US embassy on the other
Queen to Front-> pretty much all commercial

I somehow doubt University will change much, at least over my lifespan.

Jarvis- except for lower Jarvis around the St Lawrence Market, its hard to say as there is no common vision in the developments sprouting up. It is a shame that the green oasis aka Allan Gardens may now be in danger from all the multiple hi-rise condo initiatives.
 
Consider what is located on University:
College to Dundas-> most of the major hospitals are located there
Dundas to Queen-> Provincial courthouse on one side and US embassy on the other
Queen to Front-> pretty much all commercial

I somehow doubt University will change much, at least over my lifespan.

Jarvis- except for lower Jarvis around the St Lawrence Market, its hard to say as there is no common vision in the developments sprouting up. It is a shame that the green oasis aka Allan Gardens may now be in danger from all the multiple hi-rise condo initiatives.

I fail to see how the existence of hospitals, courthouses and US embassy makes it impossible to make University Ave more lively. reduce the car lanes and allow some interesting food stands, coffee shops on the median part, plant more grass and allow people to sunbathe on it. Many other cities such as NYC and Boston do this. And I am sure there is some room for a bit more retail on the sidewalk. Why do we need a 8-lane Ave in the middle of the city anyway?? Isn't Bay St serving as a highway enough only 1 minute away?

Yes, both Church st and Jarvis St need more visionary development. People seldom go east of Yonge st unless they live there and it is sad.
 
I fail to see how the existence of hospitals, courthouses and US embassy makes it impossible to make University Ave more lively.
Never said impossible, just not likely during my lifespan.

reduce the car lanes and allow some interesting food stands, coffee shops on the median part,
Dude, you're not very familiar with [FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Toronto's Municipal Code 545-Licensing requirements are you?[/FONT]

Why do we need a 8-lane Ave in the middle of the city anyway?? Isn't Bay St serving as a highway enough only 1 minute away?
Bay Street is far from being a highway. Come to think of it University Ave is an avenue when I last gazed upon it.
 

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