how long until toronto surpasses chicago on skyscrapers?

[Northern Light]

That is the shocking figure, really.

Wait til you see what hasn't been proposed yet, officially.

It's been quiet over at the AIC lately....but that's changing.............some new stuff to talk about shortly.

 

[UrbanDan]

Wait til you see what hasn't been proposed yet, officially.

Its been quiet over at the AIC lately....but that's changing.............some new stuff to talk about shortly.

I would personally love to see an article on UT containing @3Dementia and @Koops65 analysis, together with the potential "new stuff". @interchange42 is this possible?

It's great to finally see the GTA number for different heights of skyscrapers, not just Toronto proper! I would also love the numbers for the Grater Golden Horseshoe to be included, but they wouldn't significantly move the needle (and I don't want to start another discussion ).

 

[interchange42]

I would personally love to see an article on UT containing @3Dementia and @Koops65 analysis, together with the potential "new stuff". @interchange42 is this possible?

It's great to finally see the GTA number for different heights of skyscrapers, not just Toronto proper! I would also love the numbers for the Grater Golden Horseshoe to be included, but they wouldn't significantly move the needle (and I don't want to start another discussion ).

We cannot talk about "new stuff" until it's in the public sphere, sorry, but we could consider a piece about GTA skyscraper numbers sometime!

42

 

[MDV3]

Based on SkyscraperPage built, U/C, and proposed buildings over 150 m, Toronto is sitting at 371 vs New York City 363.

 

[Mercenary]

Based on SkyscraperPage built, U/C, and proposed buildings over 150 m, Toronto is sitting at 371 vs New York City 363.

New York skyline will be hard for Toronto to beat. We should surpass Chicago in about 10 years or so or 2035. New York is a different beast. Probably take us till 2100 to do so but even then, New York skyline will still be more iconic. I am happy with Toronto being 2nd to New York in North America.

 

[Koops65]

Based on SkyscraperPage built, U/C, and proposed buildings over 150 m, Toronto is sitting at 371 vs New York City 363.

This is not an apples to apples comparison... NYC has hundreds of real, built, skyscrapers, while Toronto has hundreds of proposals... many that wont get built, as proposed.

 

[afransen]

Wait til you see what hasn't been proposed yet, officially.

It's been quiet over at the AIC lately....but that's changing.............some new stuff to talk about shortly.

I get the sense that inflating the number further just adds to the backlog. Does the industry have the capacity to build any faster?

 

[Northern Light]

I get the sense that inflating the number further just adds to the backlog.

Not wrong.

Does the industry have the capacity to build any faster?

Not materially. There has been a bit of a slow down this year with the higher interest rates, but in terms of annual output, you're not going to get much above what happened last year (2022) in the near term.

There is a lot of training/recruitment underway but it'll be challenged to keep up w/retirements in trades where the median age is in the 50s.

High interest rates may also impede sales, which will impede building, at least in condo form.

Though some of that may be taken up by purpose-built rental.

 

[Koops65]

Toronto 150m+ buildings Built per year: https://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?searchID=102551903

2009 - 3
2010 - 2
2011 - 4
2012 - 5
2013 - 1
2014 - 1
2015 - 8
2016 - 10
2017 - 3
2018 - 6
2019 - 8
2020 - 5
2021 - 6
2022 - 4
2023 - 2 (so far)

total - 68, in 15 years, or 4.5 buildings Built per year on average...

 

[rdaner]

Thanks! I think it is also important to note that the uses of these buildings probably differs between the two cities. Many of the structures in Toronto are mixed use or purely residential whereas quite a few of the new builds in Chicago are likely commercial.

 

[Koops65]

Chicago 150m+ buildings Built per year: https://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?searchID=102554377

2009 - 8
2010 - 5
2011 - 0
2012 - 1
2013 - 2
2014 - 1
2015 - 1
2016 - 1
2017 - 3
2018 - 4
2019 - 3
2020 - 3
2021 - 1
2022 - 3
2023 - 1 (so far)

total - 37, in 15 years, or 2.5 buildings Built per year on average...

 

[afransen]

That makes it seem like Toronto is building at a higher rate, but most of the delta is a much longer backlog of projects.

 

[Mercenary]

A couple of reasons of the building boom in Toronto is the zoning laws which leaves a small parcel land to be developed as high rises so there is intense concentration of high rises in those areas.

Second is the growing population of Toronto due to immigration which means there is always more Demand than Supply which necessitates building these high rises.

Third is Toronto is Canada's leading economic center which means all companies usually have their HQ in Toronto which means more job growth and office space demand.

These reasons are kind of absent in Chicago. Chicago's zoning laws dont really encourage high rise development outside the downtown core. Immigrants to USA get dispersed all over USA and dont really concentrate in a single city and New York is the leading economic center in USA instead of Chicago.

 

[westtoeast]

Wait til you see what hasn't been proposed yet, officially.

It's been quiet over at the AIC lately....but that's changing.............some new stuff to talk about shortly.

I love these teases - imagination is fun

 

[Koops65]

Wait til you see what hasn't been proposed yet, officially.

It's been quiet over at the AIC lately....but that's changing.............some new stuff to talk about shortly.

Over a month now and I'm still patiently waiting for all these fantastic new proposals to be revealed.

It's easy to see that the number of new proposals has dried up a lot this year...