GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[Northern Light]

Niagara has a bike share service now BTW.

Zoom Leisure Bikes

Explore the beauty of Niagara when renting a cruiser, e-bike, or hybrid bicycle paired with unique brewery or winery bike tours in Niagara-on-the-Lake.

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Marineland is trying to sell right now and capitalize on it's zoning by selling to a company willing to build a proper amusement park there as well, from my understanding.

The Niagara tourism industry has struggled for the last decade or so, but was starting to finally boom again prior to COVID putting a temporary kink in it. I think the next decade is going to see a lot of changes.

Hmm.

Interesting.

At $8 per hour, not a cheap way to get around.

The website seems live, though google labels all their bikeshare docks as 'permanently closed'.

I looked them up that way as I didn't see a location map for their docks on their website.

With Only 2 noted locations near NF, neither of them at the train station, combined with the high pricing, doesn't seem like a viable solution as currently constituted.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Hmm.

Interesting.

At $8 per hour, not a cheap way to get around.

The website seems live, though google labels all their bikeshare docks as 'permanently closed'.

I looked them up that way as I didn't see a location map for their docks on their website.

View attachment 498372


With Only 2 noted locations near NF, neither of them at the train station, combined with the high pricing, doesn't seem like a viable solution as currently constituted.

There were a couple of them along the Niagara River Parkway trail between Queenston and Niagara-on-the-lake when I went biking there in the spring, but yes, I'm not sure how many there are around Niagara Falls.

 

[Northern Light]

There were a couple of them along the Niagara River Parkway trail between Queenston and Niagara-on-the-lake when I went biking there in the spring, but yes, I'm not sure how many there are around Niagara Falls.

So, I just contacted them.

The service exists, but it does not operate at all in Niagara Falls proper anymore; only in Niagara-on-the-Lake and environs.

Apparently they couldn't handle the level of theft and vandalism that happened to their bikes in NF. That's a shame.

 

[Richard White]

So, I just contacted them.

The service exists, but it does not operate at all in Niagara Falls proper anymore; only in Niagara-on-the-Lake and environs.

Apparently they couldn't handle the level of theft and vandalism that happened to their bikes in NF. That's a shame.

What they really need are e-scooters.

 

[Willybru21]

Yeha

The overcrowding problem with Niagara seems to only happen in the summer. If you go in the winter (January/February), the place can almost seem like a ghost town (this is when the $10 pass is great at boosting tourism).

I'm honestly surprised by how popular WEGO has gotten. When the $10 Sunday-only pass launched, most people I saw just walked along Niagara Parkway.

This reminds me of when VIA killed the Unlimited Semester Pass. Yes, it's less expensive for certain trips. But, if you were commuting on it, your travel costs went up 300%. In this case, if you're visiting multiple places in one day (Peterborough and Unionville), you're paying around $30 instead of $10 (despite the fact that most of the busses I traveled on were at least 70% empty and the 52 only had 5 riders total throughout my entire trip). The current system works well 90% of the time and only tends to break when there are holidays and major events going on (people weren't talking about this last weekend). To me, this seems like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

Yeah I rode the Niagara train a lot in the winter, at most there was probably 40-50 people onboard an entire 12 car train, and it commonly was less than that.

 

[Willybru21]

Also, even though it’s been available for almost 3 years, a lot of people are still very unaware of the weekend pass, and that includes a lot of people that take the Niagara train. When a fare inspection happens you will see most people around you showing their physical ticket or tapping Presto.

 

[just east of the creek]

The challenge: Is/was the $10 pass about GO/Mx or is/was it about tourism to NF and supporting all those attractions and hotels with a mix of day-use and overnight trips?

If the latter, GO's struggles only serve to indicate latent demand that can grow the tourism sector in the falls, and if there's a nominal loss of say $10 per ride, but it spurs $200 in spending for a day visitor, and $600 from an overnight visitor......best tourism investment I've heard of in ages on an ROI basis.

***

FWIW, I think 'The Falls' could be a vastly larger attraction than it is, if only by virtue of being adjacent of one of the larger urban centres on the planet, never mind having a singular natural attraction at its heart that really has no comparator globally and most people, given the chance, would want to see at least once).

I would argue, the area has 3-5 potential tourism markets on its own (as discrete from Toronto).

1) 'The Falls'
2) 'Wine Country/Gastro-tourism'
3) Cycling/hiking/scenery/nature/Bruce Trail.
4) Casinos/Kitsch
5) Family-friendly amusements.

*****

Only number 1 is broadly where it needs to be (though here is room to improve the adjacent promenade/park space.

Two requires, a few wineries and scenic town cores (ie. Jordan) to be upgraded both aesthetically and with more high-end restos; it also requires better transportation options for people who are drinking.

Three would benefit from Bikeshare, an expanded waterfront trail, and more cycle-friendly routes on road. I think a dramatically expanded Short Hills Provincial Park that could support camping would also work here. As would trail-head investments for the Bruce Trail improving visibility, transit access, availability of washrooms and drinking fountains at major road crossings.

Four is basically what it is, not my thing, but would probably improve some if the market-size were larger

Five to me reads as Marine-land replacement project.

****

The above is not to fully digress this into a tourism thread, but rather to suggest, that in-season, I think the market is probably there for hourly GO service or it will be with a few quality investments.

Off-season will never have that type of market size, but might be bigger than it is today with an enhanced student market as well in St. Kitts and NF.

I would add in Niagara-on-the -Lake itself as well.

I understand that the area in general is having a banner summer tourism wise.

 

[LNahid2000]

So, I just contacted them.

The service exists, but it does not operate at all in Niagara Falls proper anymore; only in Niagara-on-the-Lake and environs.

Apparently they couldn't handle the level of theft and vandalism that happened to their bikes in NF. That's a shame.

What's funny is that Niagara Falls, NY actually has an excellent bike share system, and you'd think theft/vandalism would be worse there. I actually signed up for a membership because it's so much more convenient than using NFTA in the summer when I'm there.

 

[RS3488]

Major service changes planned for August 18th. The most major of which being the reintroduction of off peak Barrie and Stouffville line trains.

 

[ShonTron]

Just in time for the CNE. Mid August is an unusual time for major GO changes. Was there enough construction completed to make the service suspensions worthwhile?

 

[Hairball]

Just in time for the CNE. Mid August is an unusual time for major GO changes. Was there enough construction completed to make the service suspensions worthwhile?

I don't think there was really any significant construction in the last few months on the Stouffville line despite that being the reasoning they used for the cutbacks. It's about time because the GO buses are always really packed and it's a pain in the ass to board them from Union as well.

Unfortunately it looks like they still do not have weekday evening service, it'd help a lot for after Jays games.

 

[nfitz]

There's been work on the Stouffville line, at least between Danforth to the East Harbour location. Perhaps removing the express Stouffville trains, allowed the Lakeshore trains to run on only two trains.

I'm pulling it out of my butt though.

 

[anb]

This is probably just to handle CNE traffic. The September changes will probably build further upon this but still great to see more Barrie/Stouffville line service more sooner.

 

[wopchop]

Both GO and the local Niagara Transit Service have a positive ‘problem’ on their hands - demand for a popular service to bolster an expanding tourism sector. Nice problem to have. Now you need to round up some tourism dollars to help support the infrastructure needed locally.

Tough to get enough out of tourism to completely finance construction of some type of mass transit system.

They could implement a hotel tax.
~16,000 rooms in Niagara Falls = 5.84MM nights x 50% occupancy* x $5 flat tax/night = ~$14.6MM/yr. Occupancy number is a total assumption. Hotel taxes are pretty common in the USA.

Or you implement an added % sales tax, directed to improvements. Apparently tourism spend in Niagara is $2B-$2.5B per yr, so even with a 2% construction tax, you could generate $40MM/yr - $50MM/yr for improvements.

Problem is even that kind of money doesn't buy much transit these days

 

[Mr Finish Line]

I don't think there was really any significant construction in the last few months on the Stouffville line despite that being the reasoning they used for the cutbacks. It's about time because the GO buses are always really packed and it's a pain in the ass to board them from Union as well.

Unfortunately it looks like they still do not have weekday evening service, it'd help a lot for after Jays games.

I'm continuing to maintain my theory that the cutting of Stouffville all-day/weekend service had nothing to do with Stouffville and everything to do with the Joint Corridor aka LSE/Ontario Line. The progress on the Stouffville portion was negligible. But on the Joint Corridor section it's down to 2 tracks, and East Harbour's in the thick of construction with barely enough space for the 2 tracks. I think cutting 2 TPH made enough of a difference to initiate the cuts to Stouffville, and LSE was clearly prioritized with its much higher ridership.

I was actually pretty pessimistic that we weren't going to get any service back this year considering the state of the Joint Corridor. I'll gladly take 1 TPH off peak weekdays and 2 TPH weekends. Though looking at things on the Joint Corridor, I don't think we'll see anything more than 2 TPH on Stouffville until at least a 3rd track, which makes the remaining Stouffville upgrades seem like less of a priority. Still a shame they couldn't make use of the downtime...