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Global warming: Real or Fraud?

Global Warming: Real or Fraud?

  • Real

    Votes: 58 75.3%

  • Fraud

    Votes: 19 24.7%
  • Total voters
    77
^ It makes me think less of the people who believe this garbage.

I don't dismiss such an idea outright. But some guy with a video camera, final cut pro, a CD titled "100 spooky songs", and too much time on his hands isn't going to convince me.

Nothing which you've presented contains anything like evidence. None of the material seems to even try to present itself as serious about the subject matter it's approaching. It's like Fox news for the tinfoil toque crowd. All I hear and see are the usual conspiratorial platitudes, reiterated for the benefit those who already believe them.
 
^ It makes me think less of the people who believe this garbage.

I don't dismiss such an idea outright. But some guy with a video camera, final cut pro, a CD titled "100 spooky songs", and too much time on his hands isn't going to convince me.

Nothing which you've presented contains anything like evidence. None of the material seems to even try to present itself as serious about the subject matter it's approaching. It's like Fox news for the tinfoil toque crowd. All I hear and see are the usual conspiratorial platitudes, reiterated for the benefit those who already believe them.
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Perhaps you should watch Fall of the Republic (and for that matter the great climate swindle which is much stronger than Mr Gores horribly one-sided, non-science based presentation) there will be people speaking much more learned than you on the matter, but they're all tinfoil hat wearing nuts aren't they? At least they present hard evidence... which is more than an Inconvenient Truth.
 
You do understand that nothing within climatology and climate change research rests on the opinions of Al Gore, right? It's great that Al Gore cares about climate change and wants to spread the word, but he's just a regular dude with a ton of money and a cause at this point.

It's kind of like intelligent design advocates who spend all their time attacking Darwin. Except even crazier, because Al Gore isn't any kind of scientist or researcher or anything.

It's like the anti-tobacco lobbyists attacking Joe Camel's credibility in order to prove cigarettes are dangerous.
 
If there is a carbon-tax, it should be used for one thing: funding alternative energy research, especially solar. An article on BBC News pointed out that solar panels could become grid competitive with coal and nuclear in about 10 years, mostly because government incentives in Germany and Spain allowed solar co.s to develop and sell panels at a profit. If we're going to drive some of our industries into the ground with the carbon tax, then we better develop something to replace them.
 
wonderboy416 said:
Perhaps you should watch Fall of the Republic (and for that matter the great climate swindle which is much stronger than Mr Gores horribly one-sided, non-science based presentation) there will be people speaking much more learned than you on the matter, but they're all tinfoil hat wearing nuts aren't they? At least they present hard evidence... which is more than an Inconvenient Truth.
Click to expand...

I didn't say anything about Al Gore, or an Inconvenient truth.

If I'm going to form an opinion on an important matter, I'm probably not going to watch any films on the subject to do so (I've never seen "An Inconvenient Truth). The medium seems to lean more toward convincing than explaining. I'm not an adherent believer in global warming, either. Even if Al Gore is full of it, it still doesn't necessarily lend a shred of credibility to any of his detractors ideas. That is, just because Al Gore maybe wrong about something, doesn't mean you're right about it. Unless your only opinion is that he was wrong, and you have no ideas of your own. The video Kamuix posted seems to be postulating that Mr. Gore isn't just lying, he's lying to forward the plans of some Masonic conspiracy. That's where I get all "Lol wut".

There are plenty of people more learned than me on any subject, I'm afraid. I could also say there are many learned people who disagree with you on these matters. The best I do is look at the serious evidence (from people whom I believe are at least trying to be objective) weigh it out, and hope I'm right. Very few of these people use 3 minute You Tube videos, complete with audio and visual theatrics, to do so.
 
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wonderboy416 said:
Perhaps you should watch Fall of the Republic...
Click to expand...

Perhaps one should ignore propaganda films on both sides of the debate and just do a search on a scientific search engine like Medline or something to see what is being published in peer-reviewed journals. There is little debate that man's activities is changing the climate anymore... it's essentially been accepted. But of course there will always be people who still challenge such things as HIV being the cause of AIDS, and the earth being round. You can find evidence for whatever argument you want on the internet... but you have to know where to go to get the most reliable information.
 
I don't dismiss such an idea outright. But some guy with a video camera, final cut pro, a CD titled "100 spooky songs", and too much time on his hands isn't going to convince me.
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you talk as if it's the only thing i've posted here. research Climate-Gate and yes watch The Obama Deception/Fall of the Republic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwkR3uuZMIM

Interview with Tim Ball a retired climatologist from Canada.

Hacked documents which were confirmed to be real here:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=003LKN94

And after knowing that this is legit, watching the media lie and try to twist the truth is that much more proof of how corrupt the system is. Hey question! If Al gore/UN/the media were honest, why instead of having a debate with these people who counter global warming, instead REFUSE to discuss it WHATSOEVER. And instead spread lies about these people through the media? why would they do this if they were honest? WHY?

EDIT: Abunch of posts appeared that i had missed
 
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Kamuix said:
you talk as if it's the only thing i've posted here.
Click to expand...

That may be so, but to post a video such as that, tells me that you and I have completely different ideas as to what constitutes useful knowledge, or research. I would never submit such a bizarre clip and present it as "evidence", or expect it to convince anyone who didn't already believe it.

You obviously want to convince us of the things you're saying, and I'm willing to let you try, but you're never going to do it with you tube. That's not research, that's entertainment.

I watched a portion of "The Obama Deception/Fall of the Republic". I wish I had the time back. The same BS as you've trotted out before, scary music, sound clips out of context, never knowing who uttered them, quick video edits to keep the viewer entertained for lack of any real substance, no footnotes, or any slightest attempt to look at the topic objectively.

If this is where you're doing the "research" you mentioned earlier in this thread, get thee to a library. How you can say you're sceptical about people and drag this ragged corpse of a film as "truth" in front of me would be amusing if it weren't slightly frightening.
 
True you're right in the films they don't refer to official reports until some time during it. They refer to them all of the time during their videos and holds them up.

http://www.infowars.com/climategate-cru-source-code-confirms-agw-fraud-from-hacked-documents/

This guy talks about the code comments in the source code. Although i guess you believe that global warming was a scam so i don't have to show you that :D

I'm going to look around for a compilations of evidence/reports and bills/bill quotes etc. so that i can actually have something official to show people.

EDIT: Important!::http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel#p/a/u/0/m3NJVr-M1rg
 
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ganjavih said:
Perhaps one should ignore propaganda films on both sides of the debate and just do a search on a scientific search engine like Medline or something to see what is being published in peer-reviewed journals. There is little debate that man's activities is changing the climate anymore... it's essentially been accepted.
Click to expand...

I would agree that this topic is rife with hardened positions across the entire political spectrum - which is deeply problematic.

Regarding the issue of peer-review, in this instance it would appear that the process may have been undermined by some of the people associated with CRU. This is one of the accusations that has resulted from those who have read through the emails that have been made public. If the other allegations are true regarding data manipulation, then a significant portion of this research must be considered as questionable. The data published by CRU is a cornerstone in the building of the global temperature record. Many of the scientists who's names appear in the emails, and who are accused of participating in the alleged manipulation of data, are leaders in arguing that humans are a cause of climate change over that same time period.

What is absolutely essential right now is an open and transparent investigation of not only the actions of these scientists, but the data they compiled and the methods that they used in building that temperature record. On the one hand, such an investigation could clear up the allegations and allow these researchers to explain their email exchanges. On the other, such an investigation could expose the allegations as being true - which would be a heavy blow to some key assumptions that underlie the argument that humans play a central role in climate change. This issue could be that serious.

Without such an investigations, there inevitably will continue to be charges that data manipulation is widespread, and that the truth is not being told. Any other published research that used the work of these scientists will then be brought into question. CRU receives considerable public funding, and it is essential to governments and to publicly funded science efforts that this matter be cleared up properly, honestly and openly - for all sides to see.
 
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Kamuix said:
I dare you to watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMQVDjdUHyM&feature=related

A nice compilation and talk with all the wearechange groups including wearechangetoronto. I can't believe 49 of you guys still think Global Warming is real.

Your ignorance is cornered.
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Sorry, but I threw up before finishing that video, and therefore had to close it. What did he end up finishing with? That Al Gore is the antichrist, trying to kill off the world's population? Maybe Obama is really a lizard person as well?

Again, you'll always get crazies that think the government is conspiring against them. Of course, with global warming, these people may be even more inclined to find alternate excuses because they don't want to change their unsustainable practices. But those crazies and the scientists that disagree with climate change are only 1% of all scientists who have an opinion on climate change. The other 99% believe that it's happening, driven by us, and we need to do something about it fast.

I'm not sure if it's that I'm young and, that when all the baby boomers retire my generation will inherit a dying and seriously f'd up world, but I'm actually totally disgusted by these people. They're cowards and lazy asses who can't take some responsibility for their own actions and not only that, but they try to make sure others think it's not their fault. That guy that you just posted a youtube clip of, Kamiux, would probably be missing the use of a few vital organs if I found him in a back alley.

And so I also think that we need to do something about global warming. Sitting on the fence with this issue, just as Harper and the US are doing, is not what we should be doing now. We need to be investing in solutions that will see results now. And it's not just greenhouse gasses. It's general sustainability as well. Boy, if I was PM would I have some changes made.

So perhaps if you could get some actual evidence, then I'd be okay. These people don't even have any scientific evidence, just crazy conspiracy theories. I'd be willing to consider it for a second if you actually brought up evidence, like maybe that greenhouse gas levels are lowering in some areas? I could probably shoot every bit of that evidence down, but it'd at least be credible, if not explainable by science.
 
Therion said:
If there is a carbon-tax, it should be used for one thing: funding alternative energy research, especially solar. An article on BBC News pointed out that solar panels could become grid competitive with coal and nuclear in about 10 years, mostly because government incentives in Germany and Spain allowed solar co.s to develop and sell panels at a profit. If we're going to drive some of our industries into the ground with the carbon tax, then we better develop something to replace them.
Click to expand...

Nah. A carbon tax should be used to cut other taxes. If you set the carbon tax high enough, you don't have to pick winners (like solar panels in a dreary country in the far north! What a winner!).

Maybe we should let the market decide.
 
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