General cycling issues (Is Toronto bike friendly?)

[Rock]

"having to deal with congestion, parking fees, etc."

So, just curious... is it a very long list?

 

[Rock]

-1

"nfitz has not made any friends yet ". Sorta sad, some others might think.

 

[ShonTron]

"nfitz has not made any friends yet ". Sorta sad, some others might think.

You've been warned. Take a break, it's on me.

 

[the lemur]

"having to deal with congestion, parking fees, etc."

So, just curious... is it a very long list?

No idea, really. Not as long as the list of advantages to cycling.

 

[cassius]

Just catching up. Wow, has this thread gone downhill since a certain poster, who seems to love the sound of his/her voice, has completely hijacked it. Thanks for giving us a breather, ShonTron.

I'm not a big fan of the idea of allowing electric bikes and motorized bikes into the cycling lane. But at the same time in understand that they're not quite fast enough to keep up with cars. Lot of the time. What I do think is that road infrastructure is going to have to change at some point. No idea what that change will look like.

 

[Rock]

Hehe... "since a certain poster, who seems to love the sound of his/her voice"... Currently it is difficult to use my voice to speak in any language. I did post a link to this thread on another forum where folks have known me (my writing) for years. And at least a few of them looked at this thread and got a chuckle. They "know" me from writing about the history of travel extensively, mostly since humans gave up using animals to pull vehicles. BTW, I did find that pic of ladies drinking tea, etc while travelling/flying:

... referring to "transportation" of course. Sorry! Back on topic.

 

[Rock]

BTW... On the subject "Cycling in Toronto (Is Toronto bike friendly?)", I am a huge fan of the Victorian pedal bicycle. The "trick" maybe is to maybe make it waaay more attractive to own/operate than the private automobile (and to make urban travels waaay safer for those of us travelling on two/three wheels).

 

[the lemur]

Just catching up. Wow, has this thread gone downhill since a certain poster, who seems to love the sound of his/her voice, has completely hijacked it. Thanks for giving us a breather, ShonTron.

Agreed. Thanks, ShonTron. I noticed that certain person is even more elaborately verbose and nonsensical on other sites.

I'm not a big fan of the idea of allowing electric bikes and motorized bikes into the cycling lane. But at the same time in understand that they're not quite fast enough to keep up with cars. Lot of the time. What I do think is that road infrastructure is going to have to change at some point. No idea what that change will look like.

I think legislators at various levels have sort of painted themselves into a corner regarding what an e-bike is and is not and what it can and can't do. In order to make it accessible to most people without requiring a licence or insurance (not a bad aim in itself), they've limited the ability of e-bikes to keep up with urban traffic, except in the most congested stop-and-go conditions (although I've seen some that are easily able to maintain 30+ km/h).

As for road infrastructure, I think we should be looking at building segregated bike tracks beside major roads. There is already some of this along a stretch of Eglinton, but it essentially dumps cyclists into traffic at intersections. Where downtown streets are concerned, maybe quieter side streets should be reconfigured to prioritize bikes and pedestrians - the European approach where cars are considered the 'guests' of other road users - and we should be looking more at filtered permeability.

 

[Rock]

"even more elaborately verbose and nonsensical on other sites."

Hehe... Without naming names...

Ya know, as a recent escapee for the Ontario health care SYSTEM (multiple "hospitals"), while I was there bedridden, two separate
persons told me privately that in their two separate tests of "brain function" according to their (flawed?) tests, I should be "brighter"
than 95% of their other patents. So perhaps only the "not-so-bright" end up in Toronto hospitals in the first place. Or their tests are
flawed. Or something.

It's a curse being maybe "bright" as far as I am concerned. I know at least I enjoy physics and chemistry (having taken "advanced" courses -
"first year university" in my last year of high school. And reading history. For over the last decade about vehicles used for transportation.

I forget, I have to stay more quiet. To not confuse others with the facts.

Most car makers want to get in on other forms of transportation in the same way they want a finger in the pie of whatever might
replace the IC engine. I wouldn't read too much into it.

Even though vehicles used for transportation are changing rapidly elsewhere I guess. It might be that the "car makers" are running
scared. (And many others connected with that vehicle if they understand what is already changing elsewhere.)

BTW... On the subject "As for road infrastructure, I think we should be looking at building segregated bike tracks beside major roads", in
another thread elsewhere in reply to the comment "I think weather keeps a lot of potential cyclists in the cars", my response:

Easy solution (solar-lution) maybe. Build canvas etc. canopies/roofs over roads and bicycle pathways (at least covers that
orient east/west, with some south-facing solar panels on top (to feed electric bicycle rider plugins etc.)

But again, I should apologize if this idea is "too complicated" for some (but again, examples are already being designed and built in
Europe).

 

[the lemur]

"even more elaborately verbose and nonsensical on other sites."

Hehe... Without naming names...).

I doubt there are many who are more effusively unintelligible than you, Mr Hughes.

If nothing else, you are keen to demonstrate that you have no idea what quotation marks are for. They're not for emphasis and your attempts to use them to convey a sardonic tone fall consistently flat.

Even though vehicles used for transportation are changing rapidly elsewhere I guess. It might be that the "car makers" are running
scared. (And many others connected with that vehicle if they understand what is already changing elsewhere.)

We're not even close to a point where the change in types of vehicles used poses a threat to car makers. They are going to build cars for as long as they can, regardless of power source, as long as demand warrants.

Build canvas etc. canopies/roofs over roads and bicycle pathways (at least covers that
orient east/west, with some south-facing solar panels on top (to feed electric bicycle rider plugins etc.)

But again, I should apologize if this idea is "too complicated" for some (but again, examples are already being designed and built in
Europe).

Really? There are already roads/bike paths in Europe with canopies, solar panels, plug-in facilities? Where?

 

[Rock]

"We're not even close to a point where the change in types of vehicles used poses a threat to car makers. They are going to build cars for as long as they can, regardless of power source, as long as demand warrants."

Hehe... "as long as demand warrants"...

Early last year, the Dutch "bike discussion" reported "One million e-cyclists", (on Dutch roads, in 2012, according to their count), seen here:
http://www.fietsberaad.nl/index.cfm...wsYear=2013&repository=One+million+e-cyclists

And in April last year, the European Cyclists' Federation reported "Car sales down, bike sales up: Two new bikes are sold for every car in Europe", online here:
http://www.ecf.com/news/car-sales-down-bike-sales-up-two-new-bikes-are-sold-for-every-car-in-europe/

And by one report (now out, from 2011), "The annual production of electric bicycles in China has grown from 58,000 in 1998 to 27 million in 2010. According to the Chinese National Statistics Bureau, in 2006, China has 450 million bicycles and in 2009, China has over 100 million ebikes."

Perhaps more folks would bicycle... if our roads weren't littered with large, mostly empty vehicles operated by large humans.


"There are already roads/bike paths in Europe with canopies, solar panels, plug-in facilities? Where?"

One example from Switzerland:
http://greenings.tv/archives/730?lang=en

There is another in Italy.

But now I am curious. How many examples would you like (At what point might some light come on)?

 

[cassius]

That barely even looks like a legitimate proposal, nevermind implemented. Got any real world examples and/or any that didn't break the bank account? This sounds like a financially unviable endeavour.

 

[Rock]

Hiya Cassius.

"That barely even looks like a legitimate proposal, nevermind implemented. Got any real world examples and/or any that didn't break the bank account? This sounds like a financially unviable endeavour."

Well, I assume you are referring to solar road roofing/canopies...

Regarding "breaking the bank", in February, 2010 Toronto Mayor Miller was quoted in the press as saying "the city spends more than $240 million yearly to repair roads."

And re breaking stuff generally, in January a year ago in "The Grid":

The first pieces of concrete to fall from the elevated Gardiner Expressway came down on January 8, 1978, and they were huge—as heavy as 200 pounds, according to a Toronto Star article published the next day. The problem was the same then as it is now: salt. More than 1,000 tonnes of the stuff is dumped onto the elevated stretch of the expressway every winter and, along with melting snow and ice, seeps into the structure, corroding the steel beams inside, which then expand, causing the concrete that envelops them to crack.

In the report "Review of Effects and Costs of Road De-icing with Recommendations for Winter Road Management in the Adirondack Park" from "The College Of The Adirondacks" in February, 2010.) In part:

The impact of road salt on the groundwater in the Greater Toronto Area (GTA) has been extensively studied over the past 30 years.

Canada’s largest city applies over 100,000 tones of NaCl annually to its roadways. Researchers have documented excessively high concentrations of chloride in shallow groundwater in the GTA, in some cases exceeding 1,400 mg per liter. Low iodide to chloride ratio in the groundwater samples suggest that the road de-icing salt is the source of the chloride. A chloride mass balance study in the Highland Creek basin of Toronto that revealed only 45% of the salt applied to the watershed is removed annually; the rest is temporarily stored in shallow subsurface water. The authors suggested that if present salt application rates persist, the average steady state chloride concentration in springs could reach 426 mg per liter in a 20 year time frame.

In 2008 the website "How Stuff Works" in their report "How Thin-Film Solar Cells Work" said in part:

The technology ..., by 2010, will be producing 3,700 megawatts of electricity worldwide [source: US National Renewable Energy Laboratory].

Anyway... The whole report can be read online here:
http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-science/thin-film-solar-cell.htm

And on the "Green Toronto" website about Toronto solar exposure:
http://www.greentoronto.me/retscreen-what-it-knows-about-toronto-solar-exposure/

Exec Summary? There are already many installations and whole fields of solar panels in the southern Ontario area. Is it such a stretch to imagine roofs of panels over some of our city roads, cutting salt usage and repairs (and vehicle repairs) at the same time???

 

[Rock]

PS. Note that this online forum title is "Transportation & Infrastructure", and this thread title "Cycling in Toronto (Is Toronto bike friendly?)". It may be that many in Toronto might enjoy cycling and travelling around in Toronto year `round on dry pavements, while saving money at the same time. Hehe...

 

[Rock]

In this forum titled "Transportation & Infrastructure", and this thread titled "Cycling in Toronto (Is Toronto bike friendly?)", this post is clearly unrelated, but some may be interested to watch if other cities become any more "bike friendly" by changing their laws.

EG seen just now elsewhere:

Thanks to severe levels of air pollution for 5 consecutive days, Paris has just put in place a day-to-day ban on about 50% of cars, motorcycles, and trucks. Electric cars, hybrid cars, taxis, and cars including 3 or more passengers are exempt.

Using a system commonly used in China, vehicles with license plates ending in odd numbers are banned from the roads today. Tomorrow, it switches to those ending with even numbers. The length of the ban will depend on the change in pollution levels.

The ÃŽle-de-France (entire region of "Paris") has a pop of over 11 million residents spread over maybe 12,000 square kms, while the area of the Greater Toronto and Hamilton Area has a pop currently only of maybe 6 million, across a land area of maybe 6+ million, but that might suggest the area in Canada is about as pop dense per km, if not slightly higher.