Former President Donald Trump's United States of America

[Filip]

Care to elaborate?

I don't have to - you're either for it or against it, globalism is polarizing - and is primarily the reason why there's a surge in populism in Europe specifically.

Globalism can be incompatible with nation states - and that's what Europeans are finding out.

 

[pman]

I don't have to - you're either for it or against it, globalism is polarizing - and is primarily the reason why there's a surge in populism in Europe specifically.

Globalism can be incompatible with nation states - and that's what Europeans are finding out.

Of course you don’t have to elaborate, but it’s more interesting for the rest of us if you provide some justification for your opinion. Which I guess you just did.

 

[Filip]

Of course you don’t have to elaborate, but it’s more interesting for the rest of us if you provide some justification for your opinion. Which I guess you just did.

I believe in strong national identities - because that's what makes the world more interesting.

Globalism seeks to erase these differences over time - it's supranational assimilation - a word Canadians usually get all upset over.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I am sure European history, circa 1939 was *very* interesting.

AoD

 

[Filip]

I am sure European history, circa 1939 was *very* interesting.

AoD

Clever to invoke Godwin's law, but you're wrong.

This isn't about fascism, or racial superiority, or any of that garbage - but about rejecting a supranational agenda in favour of agendas driven by the nation states - something that is probably going to cause the end of the EU in the next few decades.

Europeans, while strongly rejecting any fascist narratives - want to preserve their distinct cultures, because those cultures have no other home. Only in places such as Canada, where there isn't a nation, or an overarching identity, does globalism thrive. This will be evident in the next few decades.

It's also about viewing it through a global lens vs. through western tunnel vision. China, India, or pretty much any country outside of western Europe/North America, does not subscribe to globalism. They subscribe to international cooperation, but not supranational management.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Clever to invoke Godwin's law, but you're wrong.

This isn't about fascism, or racial superiority, or any of that garbage - but about rejecting a supranational agenda in favour of agendas driven by the nation states - something that is probably going to cause the end of the EU in the next few decades.

Europeans, while strongly rejecting any fascist narratives - want to preserve their distinct cultures, because those cultures have no other home. Only in places such as Canada, where there isn't a nation, or an overarching identity, does globalism thrive. This will be evident in the next few decades.

It's also about viewing it through a global lens vs. through western tunnel vision. China, India, or pretty much any country outside of western Europe/North America, does not subscribe to globalism. They subscribe to international cooperation, but not supranational management.

That's what they all say, at first. We shall see how well they subscribe to that as times goes on. History has an interesting way to teach lessons - and if one chose to call it "Godwin's Law", so be it. Those who failed to learn from history is doomed to repeat it, as the saying goes.

As to supranational management - somehow I suspect however distinctive European cultures are, they are no less distinctive than regions within the nations you've mentioned. If they failed to band together - guess what, they will end up being the loser relative to these emergent superpowers. It has nothing to do with globalism and all to do with common interests. They think they can go it alone, strike a better deal with China or India or whatnot and somehow retain more "sovereignty" than sticking with the EU where they at least have representation and a relatively common cultural heritage? Good luck to them on that score.

AoD

 

[Filip]

That's what they all say, at first. We shall see how well they subscribe to that as times goes on. History has an interesting way to teach lessons - and if one chose to call it "Godwin's Law", so be it.

AoD

If you don't mind - please explain how the fall of globalism will lead to Nazis v2.0

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

If you don't mind - please explain how the fall of globalism will lead to Nazis v2.0

Listen to the rhetoric around populism in Europe at the moment. No one has - or indeed no masses truly does believe in fascism or racial superiority right off the start - that's always the post-hoc justification.

Also, ask yourself what's the real grievance (because that's what it is) was about - and the how being "sovereign" resolves that (or not, as Brexit is clearly playing itself out). The failure of conventional politics to resolve those ingrained issues (e.g. chronic unemployment; class immobility; poor/ineffectual national government management) ultimately empowers radicalism. That's what the problem is.

AoD

 

[SunriseChampion]

It's true - but I am in love with his death to globalism tirade.

Globalism is a cancer that must be cured.

What?

Globalism is the future of the human race.

If you think we're going to go on living in our little tribes and progress beyond a bunch of warring little children then, best of luck.

If anything, tribalism is a cancer that must be cured.

 

[SunriseChampion]

What nation states?

France has never been one.
Spain? Nope.
Italy?
Germany?
Czechia?
The list goes on.

None of those are or were ever ethnically homogeneous. EVER.

Ethnically homogeneous states.....cute, isn't that a recipe for genetic stagnation? (Quite the opposite of the racial purist fool theories).

 

[SunriseChampion]

Clever to invoke Godwin's law, but you're wrong.

Wrong?
Nah, check again....Europe in 1939 was very interesting.

Of course, it was shitty sort of melodrama.

 

[Filip]

What?

Globalism is the future of the human race.

If you think we're going to go on living in our little tribes and progress beyond a bunch of warring little children then, best of luck.

If anything, tribalism is a cancer that must be cured.

Lol.

Altruistic - I appreciate that.

Like communists before - you are making a mistake in introducing an ideology that while great on paper is incompatible with human nature.

Humans are innately tribal. We are innately attracted to groups like us. There is nothing wrong with that.

But if history has taught us something - it’s that going against human nature - for no matter how good of an idea - won’t work in the long run.

You are fighting for the second Warsaw Pact. It won’t last. We are now in the 1980s of globalism.


Ps Czechia is 95% Czech. That’s ethnically homogenous right there. Lol. Serbia in comparison (without Kosovo) is 86% serbian.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Lol.

Altruistic - I appreciate that.

Like communists before - you are making a mistake in introducing an ideology that while great on paper is incompatible with human nature.

Humans are innately tribal. We are innately attracted to groups like us. There is nothing wrong with that.

But if history has taught us something - it’s that going against human nature - for no matter how good of an idea - won’t work in the long run.

You are fighting for the second Warsaw Pact. It won’t last. We are now in the 1980s of globalism.


Ps Czechia is 95% Czech. That’s ethnically homogenous right there. Lol. Serbia in comparison (without Kosovo) is 86% serbian.

As if....pick a better example than to accuse me of fighting for a second Warsaw Pact.

Those 95% of "Czechs" are a good 30% German, to start. Never mind how many are of central Asian ancestry.

The idea of these monolithic nation states is a great myth and delusion. Maybe Japan and Korea. Maybe Mongolia. That's about it.

The reason you and I are here is because of globalisation. The reason you have an offer to be transferred to Paris is because of globalisation.

Anyone who thinks globalisation necessarily precludes the preservation of culture is paranoid.

Humans may be innately tribal but we are also innately cooperative within those tribes, and as an extension, between them when there is no danger of strife.
Communists didn't have an idea that was incompatible with human nature.....they were murderous autocratic hypocrites who happened to push an ideology that was incompatible with innate human freedom.

 

[Filip]

Those 95% identifying as Czech is all that matters. Their genetic makeup is not part of this conversation. Nations and states are human constructs. One feels Canadian. One isn’t Canadian genetically. Neither is anyone in Europe. It’s a continent of mutts. But the feeling of being part of a nation, of a collective - is a powerful thing and requires alignment which doesn’t exist at a supranational level.


Anyway communism as an economic system failed because it went against human nature. Humans are competitive. Humans like self actualization. The concept of achieving something through hard work. In the collective this drive doesn’t exist. Hence why communism is now a historic relic.

Do not confuse it with authoritarianism. Look at your own country to see where it’s sliding - and that’s in formerly euro loving atheist czechia.

 

[jje1000]

What nation states?

France has never been one.
Spain? Nope.
Italy?
Germany?
Czechia?
The list goes on.

None of those are or were ever ethnically homogeneous. EVER.

Ethnically homogeneous states.....cute, isn't that a recipe for genetic stagnation? (Quite the opposite of the racial purist fool theories).

That's a bit of simplification- even though these states were far from homogeneous, the degree of similarity between their constituent peoples (even in places like Islamic Spain) were far greater than the mass migration occurring today- which is nearly unprecedented in human history in terms of the speed at which it is occurring at, the disparity of the cultures brought together, and the number of people migrating to these Western countries.

The assumed homogenous populations of nation states still usually tend to have some degree of genetic heterogeneity that allows them to stay viable, some genetic variations from regional environmental contexts, plus a small amount of slow genetic diffusion that occurred in the past as people migrated between these states. It's only truly insular populations that have gone through several population bottlenecks (i.e. the Ashkenazi Jews) who tend to have higher risks of genetic disease.

Essentially, today we have the tap running whereas in the past, it was more like a drip-drop.