Exisisting Urban Rail Lines for Subway and LRT Use.

[TOareaFan]

The disdain for the suburbs are defined by development style, not people. Lower density, not in walking distance of groceries, not in walking distance of restaurants and retail, not in walking distance of decent transit, and usually nowhere near work. Sure, people choose those places but the disdain isn't with the people, it is with the idea that after choosing to live there that there is an expectation of an urban level of services. It is much like living near the airport and complaining about the airport noise... why shouldn't they get to have the quiet everyone else has or why shouldn't everyone else feel the pain.

To be fair, the post I responded to clearly critiqued this plan on the basis that it brought more suburbanites into the city...so his issue seems to be with the people....not the buildings/planning.

 

[nfitz]

... I'm saying that there are those who act as though being from the suburbs is a crime or treat suburbanites like foreigners. Is that better?

Still sounds kind of odd. Treats suburbanites like foreigners? How would one treat foreigners differently than non-foreigners? Does one treat them better or worse? Surely you treat a foreigner better, as one should always be extra polite to guests.

Obviously no normal person is going to have disdain for anyone based on ethnicity. Such extreme bigotry would be quite rare.

 

[Dan416]

I have disdain for the people who have disdain for GO for bringing suburbanites to the city. You'd think that was a positive thing!

 

[CanadianNational]

Personally, I'd like to get out of the city more easily!

 

[jwill]

These articles aren't even about bringing more suburbanites into the city. The whole point was to use smaller and faster electric vehicles on the railway network to better serve trips within the city.

 

[Dan416]

I think you can do all these things these existing lines. Of course we should beef up service near the core, but all-day service in the suburbs is necessary too.

 

[ssiguy2]

The rest of the planet has been doing this for decades while Toronto slowly tunnels to Walmart.
Look at the Pearon Rail Link..............using a ROW for a line only the business class will be able to afford. They could use regular subway or LRT trains and make it a subway service by adding more station and it could be the new DRL but no.... Instead it's a line only the Rothchild's could love. Sao Paulo is currently transforming many of their current commuter rail lines into full metros with standard metro spacing, frequency, and standard fares. Denver is doing the same with a new DMU to it's airport for regular people with regular fares.
Where they cannot use all of the existing rail ROW they could negotiate to atleast use a small strip beside it for elevated sections.
This is a no brainer and for this reason the Pearson line should be cancelled unless they get it writing that the line will be electrified and part of the standard TTC service with high metro capacity, service levels by 2020. They can certainly charge an extra dollar for the trips all the way to Pearson which is often the case in many cities.

 

[Dan416]

I wouldn't cancel the Union-Pearson/Air-Rail link at this point. Let's just get it built, and we can add more stops after.

 

[ssiguy2]

While I agree with that in principle unless they get in writing it won't get done and will become yet another Metrolinx/TTC battle. If they want the line up and running for the Pan-Am games that's fine as long as straight after that it becomes part of the TTC system.

 

[gweed123]

I wouldn't cancel the Union-Pearson/Air-Rail link at this point. Let's just get it built, and we can add more stops after.

I would just make it a branch route of the Georgetown line.

 

[TOareaFan]

I would just make it a branch route of the Georgetown line.

This. And I would have just facilitated the connection to the airport via an extended/enhanced version of the people mover to Malton station.

That said, what's done is done and a big part of our transit/infrastructure mess/deficit is over people rethinking/redoing plans to the point nothing gets built.

The frustration/irony of an Eglinton subway started/cancelled/reprioritized/started again should be all we need to see to know that no plan is perfect and once we start something we should keep going with it!

 

[gweed123]

This. And I would have just facilitated the connection to the airport via an extended/enhanced version of the people mover to Malton station.

That said, what's done is done and a big part of our transit/infrastructure mess/deficit is over people rethinking/redoing plans to the point nothing gets built.

The frustration/irony of an Eglinton subway started/cancelled/reprioritized/started again should be all we need to see to know that no plan is perfect and once we start something we should keep going with it!

Interesting idea with the people mover. It certainly would be easier to integrate that into the urban fabric of the area than a rail line.

Malton station is also barely outside of Toronto, so that would work well with my above-mentioned plans of having some trains stay exclusively within the 416 (or stop at the first stop just outside of it). Malton Station would certainly qualify for that. During rush hour Pearson-bound passengers would get Toronto-exclusive trains that would terminate at Malton Station, and if the people mover were integrated properly into the station, it would be a pretty easy transfer that would bring you right to your terminal.

 

[TOareaFan]

Interesting idea with the people mover. It certainly would be easier to integrate that into the urban fabric of the area than a rail line.

Malton station is also barely outside of Toronto, so that would work well with my above-mentioned plans of having some trains stay exclusively within the 416 (or stop at the first stop just outside of it). Malton Station would certainly qualify for that. During rush hour Pearson-bound passengers would get Toronto-exclusive trains that would terminate at Malton Station, and if the people mover were integrated properly into the station, it would be a pretty easy transfer that would bring you right to your terminals.

Fixed your post slightly.

The people mover idea is not new (been a fan of it for a while) nor (to be fair) exclusively mine. It also has the advantage that while you are extending/enhancing you could do it to the south side of the airport as well to serve the Eglinton/Renforth area.

 

[EnviroTO]

To be fair, the post I responded to clearly critiqued this plan on the basis that it brought more suburbanites into the city...so his issue seems to be with the people....not the buildings/planning.

Enabling longer commutes enables sprawl, spends more public money per person on transportation than would be required in a more compact form, and (if provided by the TTC rather than GO) is provided at a greater cost to those who live in the city and travel shorter distances (they pay the city in residential and business taxes) and subsidizes suburban commuters (who would pay the city in business taxes only) that travel longer distances on the transportation system. The system now has people who pay both residential and business taxes living at St.Clair not getting a seat on a subway paid for by their city because the seats were largely taken at Finch. It isn't about disdain for suburbanites, it is about value for money and intelligent planning.

 

[Palma]

Add more stations within the city's boundaries. All travels between stations within the city charge the same fare as TTC (i.e. $3.25). Allow free transfers between GO and TTC if both the origin and destination are in the city. Run local trains (stopping at all stops inside Toronto) alongside express trains (stopping at selected stops). When will Metrolinx do that?
Scenerio:
1. take the Georgetown train at Weston, get off at new GO station at Queen West, transfer to Queen streetcar, get off at Spadina, $3.25.
2. from Oriole, to Exhibition, $3.25.
All trips originates and ends within the city.

How is it fair someone coming from georgetown pays 3.25?. Presently TTC is 2.50 but you did say charge the same fare as TTC. Either way it does not seem fair that someone in Toronto has to pay the same amount going. 1 stop. This distance based fares is right up there with congestion/tolls that no one one wants to touch but needs to sooner or later