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Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

I don't understand why people in this city don't protest more often when bad ideas are proposed or implemented? The 'in your face' approach is what you need for this plan.
 
Juan_Lennon416 said:
I don't understand why people in this city don't protest more often when bad ideas are proposed or implemented? The 'in your face' approach is what you need for this plan.
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Under Ford, we did much more. Then the problem was the Ford administration ignored the input.

Under Tory, however, he does listen and does respond. Only sometimes, he takes the opposite input to what others want.
 
The Scarborough subway needs to be built. The subway reduces travel time for most people compared to LRT, and it eliminates the transfer at Kennedy. It currently takes far too long to get from downtown to Scarborough and the Scarborough subway + the Stouffville line electrification will reduce this significantly.
 
LNahid2000 said:
I don't think we should base our transit planning on who is the angriest...
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rbt said:
That's my point; with current tax levels and the current SSE agreement the province will have a DRL to build if they choose to as Toronto won't be able to participate in that or anything else for 2 decades. SSE would be the last big TTC project during my working career and I'm in my 30's.

Seriously, the 5% budget reduction for all departments is a direct result of the Gardiner decision. TTC buying buses with funds-from-current (operating budget via the last fare hike) is another sign we've already hit the cap. Finding ~$1B+ for the cities share of SSE is going to require some magic. The feds, thus far, are providing generic funding only which should go into maintenance rather than expansion (we have reliability issues on both Yonge and Bloor; SSE is useless if the rest of Bloor is taken offline).

The whims of the province, and Metrolinx, change every 4 years. Without a Wynne re-election, I expect current GO plans to be truncated and I can guarantee GO will sacrifice projects for other orgs (TTC, Hamilton, Mississauga) before they reduce scope on their own stuff.
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kEiThZ said:
Call it like I see it. And my opinions are based on watching my immigrant relatives take 1.5 - 2 hr commutes to the core. I'd gladly support LRT if they were actually willing to build a full LRT plan. But somehow the choice is between a $3 billion one stop subway or an LRT line that barely touches Malvern and a Sheppard LRT that doesn't go past Morningside. I'd fully back LRT if somebody said that the new plan for $3 billion worth of LRT in Scarborough.



This. And the prime example is the Sheppard subway. I've not even seen any discussion outside the forum on converting that to LRT. If they ever build the SELRT, they'll have another sore point for decades. Why can't they simply bite the bullet and push for conversion? That would make the LRT a ton more palatable in that corridor.



Absolutely does not have to be this way. There are plenty of ways to make LRT more palatable. But that does not even seem to be something to consider. And since nobody seems to want to commit to a full LRT plan and push it through, the subway has become a symbol of progress and improvement.
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StevieD said:
Agreed. This back and forth between LRT and subway for Scarborough is so tiresome and unproductive that it wouldn't shock me if nothing gets built. We have all 3 levels of government on board to get this bloody subway extension (It's not a stub way of a new line like how some people make it out to be. It's the Bloor-Danforth extension.) to the STC finished. If anyone thinks the LRT plan is coming back, you are foolish to think so. If Toronto City Council votes in favour of going back to the LRT plan, do you really think it will be built? No. The Ontario Grits are going to have the subway built one way or another.

To councillors like Josh Matlow and Gord Perks, let it go. Please let it go. The LRT plan was a good plan, yes, but going back and forth is getting nowhere. I say just set it some new taxes for transit building and get on with building new projects, such as the Relief Line and Eglinton Crosstown East. And yes, use new money raised from new taxes to finish the Bloor-Danforth subway extension.
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I don't we should base our transit planning on anger either. But again, here it is. It's been 10 years!! At some point you have to produce something. The city better pay for this, I don't want one dime of RER money going to this. Raise Taxes, built the bloor subway (it is a stub, but does it really matter at this point?) build sheppard east in full, move on. I want to talk about the DRL going to Dundas West, Mount Dennis, Eglinton/Don MIlls and Sheppard. I want to us fight to get more service on GO Milton and Richmond hill, new lines after RER as well. Enough already. Let's just move on, I agree it does not have to be this way.
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
I don't we should base our transit planning on anger either. But again, here it is. It's been 10 years!! At some point you have to produce something. The city better pay for this, I don't want one dime of RER money going to this. Raise Taxes, built the bloor subway (it is a stub, but does it really matter at this point?) build sheppard east in full, move on. I want to talk about the DRL going to Dundas West, Mount Dennis, Eglinton/Don MIlls and Sheppard. I want to us fight to get more service on GO Milton and Richmond hill, new lines after RER as well. Enough already. Let's just move on, I agree it does not have to be this way.
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You don't seem to understand that we won't have money for all of these other projects if we build the $3 billion Scarborough subway. We need to think about the opportunity costs.
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
I don't we should base our transit planning on anger either. But again, here it is. It's been 10 years!! At some point you have to produce something. The city better pay for this, I don't want one dime of RER money going to this. Raise Taxes, built the bloor subway (it is a stub, but does it really matter at this point?) build sheppard east in full, move on. I want to talk about the DRL going to Dundas West, Mount Dennis, Eglinton/Don MIlls and Sheppard. I want to us fight to get more service on GO Milton and Richmond hill, new lines after RER as well. Enough already. Let's just move on, I agree it does not have to be this way.
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Where are you going to find the money for this? We have the money for 1, at most 2 of all of these projects in the next 25 years. There is no way we are finding the money for building more than 1 subway line at a time. If the Subway extension proceeds, I do not see a way that the DRL does not get delayed for at least another 10 years.
 
LNahid2000 said:
You don't seem to understand that we won't have money for all of these other projects if we build the $3 billion Scarborough subway. We need to think about the opportunity costs.
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goreckm said:
Where are you going to find the money for this? We have the money for 1, at most 2 of all of these projects in the next 25 years. There is no way we are finding the money for building more than 1 subway line at a time. If the Subway extension proceeds, I do not see a way that the DRL does not get delayed for at least another 10 years.
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More taxes. Toronto has to eat this if they want to be serious.
 
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denfromoakvillemilton said:
More taxes. Toronto has to eat this if they want to be serious.
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Not going to happen with this council. That, and the taxes would probably have to increase by 20%+ if we want to make all of these projects feasible in the next 30 years or so. Unfortunately, that means political suicide in this city.
 
I watched a bit of the city council meeting on youtube from about 2-330pm. What was the final vote?
 
Here's what I think Scarborough and hopefully the city could buy off on:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1fETduC7g6E_OfbEHK1QRaX881Vs&usp=sharing

- SRT upgrade to LRT, subway really doesn't make sense for the amount of money and stop(s)
- To buy peace in the land, use $s on something that makes more sense - Sheppard extension to Victoria Park (since LRT would need to be underground anyway to Consumers, and attaches to a major employment node)
- If there are additional savings, then extension to Agincourt as a natural end of the line (to connect to Smarttrack/GO/Sheppard LRT to Zoo & UTSC)
- If there are additional savings, Crosstown East LRT
 
superman said:
Here's what I think Scarborough and hopefully the city could buy off on:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1fETduC7g6E_OfbEHK1QRaX881Vs&usp=sharing

- SRT upgrade to LRT, subway really doesn't make sense for the amount of money and stop(s)
- To buy peace in the land, use $s on something that makes more sense - Sheppard extension to Victoria Park (since LRT would need to be underground anyway to Consumers, and attaches to a major employment node)
- If there are additional savings, then extension to Agincourt as a natural end of the line (to connect to Smarttrack/GO/Sheppard LRT to Zoo & UTSC)
- If there are additional savings, Crosstown East LRT
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SLRT is dead & trying to resurrect it doesn't do anything to buy "peace in the land"
STC >>>>>>>>than Victoria Park in terms of priority. After all this nonsense you'll have very minimal support from Scarborough residents on that one as it merely borders onto Scarborough.

No matter what savings the other LRT lines should be funded and paid for in addition to whatever form of subway passes STC. We do have a funding issue that needs to be resolved to get this done in an integrated manner.
 
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