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Into the Mist
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Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

Are you suggesting we redefine the border of Toronto? Keep in mind the 407 is quite substantially further away from Steeles on the eastern half of the city. And that it seems wrong to demarcate a city by the path of an ostensibly privately owned highway (at least for the next 80 years :))

At least Steeles is mostly a straight line!
 
TheTigerMaster said:
Okay. Let's spend $1.2 Billion to save people 6 minutes for three years, since Scarborough residents seem to be exceptionally fragile compared to everyone else.
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Why not? This is grade separated transit and other systems thru the world don't have a problem with it. Any upgrades needed to the current corridor to accommodate RER/GO could certainly be done with the $2 billion saved from the Danforth extension to STC. They could run trains every 3 minutes with the trains alternating between Markham and STC for 6 minute service to each.

Every other city on the planet has figured it out so what makes everything impossible in Toronto?
 
DonValleyRainbow said:
I'm aware that the border pre-dates the 407, but the 407 would be a more logical border, would it not? It's a huge corridor separating neighbourhoods, as opposed to just being the other side of a municipal street.
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407/hwy7/hydro corridor, yet it looks to me it would serve better as a boundary. Looks like Markham and Vaughan are the only stakes have to work with if there is such proposal
 
salsa said:
Jennifer Pagliaro ‏@jpags
On presentation board at Scarborough subway consultation, staff announce peak hour, peak direction ridership of one-stop subway is 7,300
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Those look like projections for the DRL, not the Scarborough subway.

Clearly you can see that a DRL that only goes from downtown to Pape station is practically useless and will have low ridership. The DRL needs to go further north in order to have high ridership.
 
The real planning issue not being properly discussed is the introduction Smartrack. It's not the right plan whether we build the subway along as surface subway or the McCowan

We have a small window to save another subpar Political transit design in Scarborough if they can build:

1. Surface subway to Malvern
2.Sheppard LRT & Eglinton Xtown to UTSC LRT

Fingers crossed this subway will run surface and head to Malvern. Cancel the Lawrence & Ellesmere ST stops & the entirety of Scarborough will have a great future. Otherwise we've just picked winners and losers again & large areas of Scarborough will lose once again be victim to short sighted stubborn Political planning.
 
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coffey1 said:
Fingers crossed this subway will run surface and head to Malvern. Cancel the Lawrence & Ellesmere ST stops & the entirety of Scarborough will have a great future. Otherwise we've just picked winners and losers again & large areas of Scarborough will lose once again be victim to short sighted stubborn Political planning.
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I get what you are saying, but I have a lot of difficulty with building parallel transit paths in the same general area. It will appease the people who feel a grievance today, but in a few years there will be regrets.

Your suggestion creates two redundancies:
- SmartTrack plus a surface subway in the current SRT corridor
- a subway running east-west from SRT to Malvern plus (eventually) transit on Sheppard running east-west just a little to the north

A better layout would be
- Build the Crosstown East LRT, going all the way up to Malvern
- Change the "express" version of the Line 2 extension back to its original version , with the Lawrence stop, extending all the way up to Sheppard
- Build Sheppard transit all the way out to connect with the Crosstown East line on its way to Malvern
- Build SmartTrack in the recommended Option C format

More expensive? Yes. Scarberians won't object to that! But it's better spent money as there are fewer redundancies and it brings transit closer to most parts of Scarboro. It will all get built eventually anyways, so our kids will thank us (while they pay the bill).

- Paul
 
@crs1016. Id prefer Smarttrack stops disappear in Scarborough all together (except Kennedy). It's sad the proposed surface Subway and current RT takes such a poorly designed route to begin with. But keeping the subway thru that route should allow for a longer extension to Markham/Milner which has great benefits.

I also agree with your approach. I just think there is much more benefit to have multiple stops around STC and Centennial College as well as the much needed regeneration of Markham/Milner. But at this point either plan will suffice. Just need to put an end to the "one stop" Tory plan or the original SLRT transfer plan.

If we can remove the transfer for the STC route and build the SMLRT it makes the Sheppard LRT connection to the Stubway much more palatable & we'd have a solid network
 
coffey1 said:
@crs1016. Id prefer Smarttrack stops disappear in Scarborough all together (except Kennedy). It's sad the proposed surface Subway and current RT takes such a poorly designed route to begin with. But keeping the subway thru that route should allow for a longer extension to Markham/Milner which has great benefits.

I also agree with your approach. I just think there is much more benefit to have multiple stops around STC and Centennial College as well as the much needed regeneration of Markham/Milner. But at this point either plan will suffice. Just need to put an end to the "one stop" Tory plan or the original SLRT transfer plan.

If we can remove the transfer for the STC route and build the SMLRT it makes the Sheppard LRT connection to the Stubway much more palatable & we'd have a solid network
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I actually really like the idea of having the subway route through the current RT corridor, and having a subway stop at Lawerence and a Smarttrack stop at Ellesmere.

It keeps both services running without too many closely spaced stops, both go downtown in one form or another, and one could transfer at Kennedy if they need to.
 
coffey1 said:
@crs1016. Id prefer Smarttrack stops disappear in Scarborough all together (except Kennedy). It's sad the proposed surface Subway and current RT takes such a poorly designed route to begin with. But keeping the subway thru that route should allow for a longer extension to Markham/Milner which has great benefits.

I also agree with your approach. I just think there is much more benefit to have multiple stops around STC and Centennial College as well as the much needed regeneration of Markham/Milner. But at this point either plan will suffice. Just need to put an end to the "one stop" Tory plan or the original SLRT transfer plan.

If we can remove the transfer for the STC route and build the SMLRT it makes the Sheppard LRT connection to the Stubway much more palatable & we'd have a solid network
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SmartTrack is actually appealing to those who live on Finch and Steeles where the Scarborough subway will never reach. Think of all the riders from Pacific Mall and surrounding area can just take ST instead of the 53 and the Yonge subway to downtown. That will cut their commute in half.

If they have money, just build the stations back into the Scarbrough subway.
 
bill r said:
Any comments about SmartTrack 2.0?
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/transit-fantasy-maps.3005/page-292#post-1109076
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I hope revision 3.0 actually includes the other 2/3rds of Scarborough & STC.

Smarttrack doesn't replace the SSE. The SSE can replace much of Smartrack

1. Option D GO RER (Smartrack)

2.SSE surface to Markham/Milner or worst case SSE via McCowan Corridor extension with a Lawrence stop in a more central location.

3. LRT loop around Eglinton, Kingston rd. & Sheppard

That's a respectful plan for Scarborough.
 
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One thing about railway corridors. People don't feel as safe and appealing than subway stations. Eglinton, Lawrence and Ellesmere are in a really bad location. Even the UPX stations (Weston and Bloor) feels isolated at night while they are substantially better than typical GO stations. There won't be a lot of walking in traffic those stations. The Scarborough subway corridor is much more suitable for friendly neighbourhood access.
 
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