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City orders condo developers to buy annual metropass for every unit

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Wow.....what else can this city council think of.:rolleyes: just another item to check for on craigs list......TTC 1 year pass cheap 1/2 price.:D


Developers building condos on Toronto transit lines will now have to buy every unit a TTC metropass for a year in order to obtain condominium approval from the city, a policy critics say comes at a high cost and without proof people will use it.

“How does the city know that everyone is going to want or need a metropass?” said Stephen Dupuis, president and chief executive officer of Building Industry and Land Development Association (BILD).

City council voted yesterday in favour of the policy, which Mr. Dupuis said adds a systemic cost of about $1,400 per unit. He said his organization is pro-transit, “but people are going to take transit if it suits their lifestyle.”

Councillor Howard Moscoe, however, believes it “will cause people on transit lines to abandon their cars.”

He pushed the initiative forward, which passed council without debate. The policy states the cost of the metropasses cannot be passed on to the condo buyer.

City staff describe it as a “transportation demand management measure” that is aimed at encouraging transit use and reducing dependency on cars. It applies to condo projects with 20 or more units in areas that “are or will be well-served by transit.” A map shows that includes downtown, from Bathurst Street to the Don Valley Parkway and past Bloor, the central waterfront, and avenues where there are current or planned streetcar and light rail lines.

Mr. Moscoe said he used to delay developments, demanding the metropass policy as a condition of approval. Some builders embraced the idea, while others fought it to the Ontario Municipal Board.

“It turned out to be a great marketing tool for the condo builder,” he said. “Besides, it doesn’t cost the builder of the condo anything up front. He can buy the transit pass in bulk from the TTC at a 12% discount, and get a 16% writeoff on his income tax from the federal government for transit passes. So it’s a win win for everybody,” he said.

Mr. Moscoe said the idea is not really to generate revenue, since presumably some people in the building would have bought passes on their own, but to get people thinking about public transit.

“I think we’re going to get awards for this all over North America,” he said.

And he would like to see the plan expand into a sliding scale that would allow a builder to construct fewer parking spaces, if the company buys metropasses for more years.

Mr. Dupuis noted zoning bylaws stipulate 1.2 spaces per unit, which creates extraordinary expense for some of the larger buildings that have to dig several floors underground.

“The city is in a funny position because they set the parking standards and they’re always concerned that there be enough, if not more than enough parking, so people don’t park on the street,” said Mr. Dupuis.

“This is found money for the TTC,” he said of the plan. Or a treat for a condo dweller who can simply resell the pass.

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/...s-to-buy-annual-metropass-for-every-unit.aspx
 
Silly Silly Silly,

In many ways it's not "found" money for the TTC -assuming most of thess passes get used, i.e. sold / used by the buyer - it'll hurt the TTC has they suffer the most on metropasses.

This will simply translate into a 800+ dollars increase on the condos, moreover, the developer will benefit from the tax creditor, not the owner!

Was this thought out at all.

I'm sure MikeTO will be all over this one :)
 
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Good, because there was so much extra room on the subways for more people. :rolleyes:

Moscoe, you are the biggest idiot in town.
 
They want to discourage driving, but do they not realize that the vast majority of people living in these areas already use transit, bike or walk? And that many people would rather save money by walking/biking and only taking transit when necessary rather than paying for a full month? And that any additional cost/tax gets passed onto consumers?

Here's the modal split for the census tract where that RCMI car-free building is going


Cars: 12%
Transit: 27%
Walking/biking: 60%.
Other: 1%

and this is for the CityPlace neighbourhood

Car: 32%
Transit: 27%
Walk/Bike: 39%

This is just going to punish people who walk/bike or who need to drive for work by increasing the cost of a new condo

Percent of commuters walking, biking, or using transit to get to work by census tract

 
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Good, because there was so much extra room on the subways for more people. :rolleyes:

I guess I'll be the contrarian on this one, then. I think it's a fantastic initiative. If anything, it should be extended. No room in the subways? Then, for God's sake, expand them. We want people choosing transit rather than other modes. And, if there is not enough room for all the people who want to take public transit, then let's have more public transit, please. The save-subways-by-restricting-access argument is, I think, a poor one. Otherwise then, by all means, let's charge ten bucks a ride, leaving those few left in subway cars to savour their empty surroundings.

I don't see how it would result in less money for the TTC. Those who were not already taking transit either switch to transit, or sell the pass. If they sell the pass, it will already have been bought at "full" price by the condo developer -- and make up for any foregone revenue from the secondary-market buyer who would forego a direct purchase.

(Any slight difference in what the condo developer paid, and what the secondary-market buyer would otherwise have paid, is made up for by the TTC's lesser transaction costs, greater certainty, and other bulk-sales advantages that motivate it to discount such sales.)

As to secondary-market prices, it is hard to believe people would really sell at half-price -- there is huge demand for full-price metropasses, so even a slight discount would be marketable, I would have thought.
 
I'm all for encouraging public transit but this is nanny-statism at its worst. What's next, a mandatory year's supply of cod liver oil? This policy will be toast soon after the new mayor takes the throne.
 
I guess I'll be the contrarian on this one, then. I think it's a fantastic initiative. If anything, it should be extended. No room in the subways? Then, for God's sake, expand them. We want people choosing transit rather than other modes. And, if there is not enough room for all the people who want to take public transit, then let's have more public transit, please. The save-subways-by-restricting-access argument is, I think, a poor one. Otherwise then, by all means, let's charge ten bucks a ride, leaving those few left in subway cars to savour their empty surroundings.

What comes first, the cart or the horse?

Quite obvious from your post you haven't been on a rush hour Yonge train recently. There is a serious capacity problem at the moment, and that needs to be fixed before we squeeze it to even more dangerous levels.
 
What comes first, the cart or the horse?

If you mean that we ought to discourage transit ridership because we just don't have enough room, I disagree. Out of curiosity, how high do you advocate raising fares in order to bring down ridership, though?

Quite obvious from your post you haven't been on a rush hour Yonge train recently.

Careful. It sounds like your grasp of the obvious is tenuous. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow morning, though.
 
Why? Metropasses will be dead in a few years when Presto is fully in service.
 
If you mean that we ought to discourage transit ridership because we just don't have enough room, I disagree. Out of curiosity, how high do you advocate raising fares in order to bring down ridership, though?

in rush hour, a fare between $3 and $3.25, in the off peak, under $3.

Are you unaware of the dangers of exceeding safe capacity? Of course, the ultimate goal is to increase over all capacity, but you don't do that by creating a health and safety hazard.

Think about it, if TTC lowered the cash fare to 10 cents tomorrow, can you not predict what problems it will cause?
 

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