California Condos (Camrost-Felcorp) - Real Estate -

[YourAnthony]

Hey everyone I just purchased a condo in this building. Looking forward to it!

When do you guys think it will actually be completed?

 

[yyzer]

congrats on your purchase, YourAnthony!

 

[YourAnthony]

Thanks! I got a Corona, going to be my first place.

 

[Funkster]

I agree with Solaris, which is similar to what I had been saying earlier - only to be accused of working for the developer.

Quite the opposite mybrains...buying real-estate is serious business. The neighbourhood was all built by this builder, as well as they have a number of other successful developments under their belt.

People in the market should carefully evaluate the product, the neighbourhood and the builder that they are buying in / from, no matter where it is. I would personally be nervous to buy in a builder's first building, or from a builder who has had unsuccessful projects in the past.

On another note, I was actually out of town this past weekend so I couldn't stop by to see the action. I'll hopefully make it there next weekend to check things out.

 

[cdr108]

Thanks! I got a Corona, going to be my first place.

congratulations YourAnthony.

personally, from a design/space use perspective, i think the interior designers should have forgone the den for a larger LR/DR area from it's current 12' x 13' space.

i guess it's better marketing to sell a 1 bed +1 635 SF vs. 1 bed 635 SF.

 

[Eug]

Yup not impressive at all, my gut feeling of a fly condo style pricing system was confirmed today.

Here is the price list that I got:
455 sq ft $149900
530 sq ft $204900
545 sq ft $189900
580 sq ft $219900
635 sq ft $244900
675 sq ft $259900
695 sq ft $274900

etc

Plus $16000 for a standard parking spot (cheaper spots available if you have a smart/small car, or a moped), and $3000 for a storage locker.

Ouch, that's pretty unimpressive.

Basically, the 455 sq. ft. $149900 unit is just a loss leader. Almost all the more reasonably sized and livable units are over $200000, just like any other condo development in the GTA.

 

[Mike in TO]

It's my understanding that the new launch was a tremendous success - a lot of units were sold this past weekend.

 

[mybrainsyourmoney]

HUH???....Camrost been building condos for over 25 years,what you mean more desirable projects,he has ALOT of money invested into Mystic Point and hes planning more when the economy picks up in this area,this is classic marketing tutorial how to get your project in the news.Sales at California is very good he just wanted to be above the rest in getting the attention of new buyers.There was a line up at the first day of sales and at the main release there is people there at 9:00am waiting.

Ducati,

You are probably too young to remember Bramalea. They were arguably the biggest developer in Canada and they went bankrupt under a pile of debt in the early 1990's. Tridel was in receivership as I recall as well and other big name developers that you may know were badly hit back then too. It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you SEE.

It is very rough out there guys. The capital markets are dead and banks are calling in their loans and collateral. Just because Feldman has had success in the past is no assurance that he can survive. Proceed with caution. I don't have any details about his financial situation but common sense says watch out.

You are much better off buying a resale unit if that works for you, (there are thousand of them!) or finding a deal in a better area in a building that is already under construction. This location is not undesirable, but there are much more desirable locations in the City for the average buyer. If it works for you that's great and I'm sure you get lots of enjoyment out of the area for 4 months of the year.

 

[Eug]

You are much better off buying a resale unit if that works for you, (there are thousand of them!) or finding a deal in a better area in a building that is already under construction. This location is not undesirable, but there are much more desirable locations in the City for the average buyer. If it works for you that's great and I'm sure you get lots of enjoyment out of the area for 4 months of the year.

Yeah, you can already get resale units right in the downtown core for the same price or even cheaper, at least when compared to the pricing of the larger units.

Like I said before, that $149900 price is a loss leader. The per sq. ft. price in the larger units is significantly higher than in the $149900 units.

 

[Eug]

another person yelling the sky is falling.Banks arent as strict on lending practices even though the USA market still hasnt hit bottom.I know Camrost well,my relatives owns two of their condo units and they are very happy with the service and product,Camrost never extended itself by building multiple projects at once without secure financing.If you want to group all builders together and say they are on shaky ground so be it but spreading rumors that Camrost is desperate to sell California units if a lie.Their prices havent dropped one cent since the VIP showing last year,infact some of the larger units went up in price.

The fact that they are now selling loss leaders tells me that they're hurtin' (just like everyone else is in the new condo market). No, they many not be in trouble, but obviously they are using these $149900 units to generate publicity in order to stimulate sales of their other units.

 

[Eug]

Again "hurting".."desperate to sell"...havent you heard about marketing?.They got so much press about the $149,000 units that it got people interested again about buying condos again.Im not going to tell you how marketing works you probably know any business from retail to condos entices buyers in with some sort of bargain,its not a sign they are in financial crisis its to get notice.Same as the builders who offer free cars,free trips etc,etc its a classic marketing tip.Show me one of Camrost Felcorp buildings that has not been completed or in need of funds.From Red Hot condos to Avenue to Ilofts all of them are almost sold out or on the verge of selling out,this is a sign of broken down company?.

Thanks for reinforcing what I just said.

They, like everyone else, are hurting because of the downturn of the market. However, instead of offering free cars or free upgrades, they're offering loss leader condo sales at the low end.

Too bad the pricing of the rest of their units isn't very interesting. I'd rather get upgrades on a $200000+ unit, cuz that's what I'd actually buy, not some $149900 455 sq. ft. shoebox.

 

[YourAnthony]

Yeah I hope they start construction soon!

 

[AGTO]

every condo offers small units starting at 475SF and up

Brad Lamb is offering condos atarting at 310 SF for $149,000.
These days, 475SF is huge!

 

[Funkster]

wow!

First, Mybrains, you may be a little off on your understanding of economics and the real-estate market. Over the long term (5 yrs. +), real-estate has demonstrated to be a good investment, for the most part. Camrost posted videos on camrost.com that have interviews with purchasers and real-estate experts. I'm not going to go on further, but have a look at the big picture with the Toronto and GTA housing market.

Second, have you ever thought to look at this new offering from a different perspective? It's no secret that they must want to sell their product - who wouldn't? At the same time, this builder must have listened to current and perspective purchaser feedback, as well as he understands what the present market needs / wants. Based on the feedback, he went back to the drawing table to offer some new, more affordable suite designs in response to market demands. The lower price point will make it much easier for people like me who want to purchase their first piece of real-estate, and build from there.

Buy resale at lower prices? There is no comparison between resale and pre-construction. Just scraping the surface, buy resale now, you move in now, you pay mortgage payments now. You can't buy resale and move in 1.5 yrs. from now.

Buy pre-construction at affordable prices? You're not in a rush to move right away, you expect to move around the time the building is finished, you pay a deposit now and you start paying your mortgage once you occupy.

I would personally rather have my money sitting in a deposit for a condo, rather than in the unpredictable stock market. Also, I am no economic expert, however I would suggest that signs of our economy in 1.5 yrs. from now are more positive than negative. As we progress out of this downturn, the value of resale properties will also go up.

Suddenly, people who buy fair priced, pre-construction condos now will be laughing at people who either waited, or those people who bought resale and had to put lots of money into the property to bring it up to new construction standard.

Mybrains and others, don't be so narrow minded. If anything, the news of the success of this project demonstrates good strength in the market. Look at the big picture!

Just some food for thought....

 

[Funkster]

p.s. that was also directed at Eug too Not meant to be insulting, just trying to offer a different viewpoint.