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Baby, we got a bubble!?

I have been quite happy with Plazacorp buildings. Both buying and aftermarket care.
They may not be the most beautiful outside but they are good mid range quality at a fair price.

Tridel is of course very good as proven by JD Powers serveys and as TheKingEast has pointed out.

As always with a boom, anyone who can hold a hammer is a "finished carpeter". If you can hold a paint brush you are a painter.
 
I have been quite happy with Plazacorp buildings. Both buying and aftermarket care.
They may not be the most beautiful outside but they are good mid range quality at a fair price.

Tridel is of course very good as proven by JD Powers serveys and as TheKingEast has pointed out.

As always with a boom, anyone who can hold a hammer is a "finished carpeter". If you can hold a paint brush you are a painter.

Plazacorp is very good. I have experience with them and while the design may not be cutting edge and sometimes downright ugly (on the outside), the quality is good! I believe they have their own contractors as well. Tridel, same thing. There are a few other good ones, but the rest range from pretty good to pathetic.
 
As many of us already know, the psychological $1 million barrier has meant less and less over the course of the past number of years. How many times have we heard the line,"You can't get much for $1M anymore!"? There was once a time when $1M homes meant high-end, luxury accommodations. I believe in the past few years, that de facto figure was closer to $1.5M. Today, I read the online paper and discover that it's now upped itself to $2M!

http://business.financialpost.com/2...ousing-market-2-million-is-the-new-1-million/

In Toronto’s housing market, ‘$2-million is the new $1-million’

Garry Marr | June 4, 2014 5:25 PM ET

The strength of the $2-million-plus market comes as Toronto home prices continue to soar. TREB said Wednesday the average sale price of a home across the Greater Toronto Area reached $585,204 in May, an 8.5% increase from a year ago.

Torontonians who can barely wrap their minds around a housing market where $1-million is the average price for a detached home might want to take notice of a new fast-approaching benchmark.

Try not to panic if you haven’t bought yet but the $2-million home is a growing segment of the market in Canada’s largest city.

Data released by the Toronto Real Estate Board Wednesday shows there were 461 detached home sales for more than $2-million through its Multiple listing Service system in the first five months of the year. That’s only 2.4% of all detached home sales activity for the year but the $2-million plus range has climbed 37% over the past year in the GTA.

“What you are seeing is $2-million is the new $1-million,” says Drew Laszlo, an architect in the city who has been involved in several infill projects that have fallen into the new threshold.

The strength of the $2-million-plus market comes as Toronto home prices continue to soar. TREB said Wednesday the average sale price of a home across the Greater Toronto Area reached $585,204 in May, an 8.5% increase from a year ago.

It was the best May ever for Toronto real estate sales with detached homes in the city proper reaching an average price of $943,055.

Jason Mercer, TREB’s senior manager of market analysis, cautions when it comes to the $2-million-plus market the numbers are still small so it could affect the data.

“There is a clear reason why prices have gone up. Demand is strong but the majority of people looking to purchase a home are still doing it with a mortgage,” says Mr. Mercer, citing record-low interest rates as a factor that continues to drive sales. “That leads to strong price increases because of a tight market.”

David Batori, a 25-year veteran of the industry, says part of what is happening in the market is people with those $1-million homes are selling and moving on to bigger and better houses and driving up prices.

“For $1-million, you don’t even get a bungalow in certain areas,” says Mr. Batori. “I had a client who just sold his house, he thought he would get $1-million, so he bought a $2-million home. He ended selling for $1.4-million. He told me if he knew he was going to get that much, he would have spent $2.5-million [on his new house].”

What are people getting for their $2-million? In Mr. Laszlo’s projects it usually means a brand new home on a lot about 25 feet by 120 feet with about 3,000 square feet of living space. Land prices, land transfer taxes and construction costs have dictated that $2-million figure for any builder hoping to get a 10% profit for what could be a risky venture if the market goes south. The cost of the land alone is usually $1-million.

Mr. Laszlo says the people buying the new $2-million homes are well off but hardly the super rich. “It’s a lot of doctors and lawyers,” he says.

Mr. Batori says family money continues to be a factor in the market, especially for young couples buying in the $1-million range. “Thank God for the parents and the grandparents,” he says, with a laugh.

A Vancouver credit union tried last month to put a little fact behind all the speculation that gifted money is driving the housing market.

Vancouver is long familiar with the $2-million home, in many parts of the city the median price of home has even extended far beyond that threshold. The Real Estate Board of Greater Vancouver said this month that the average price of a detached home in its catchment area reached $1,218,772 last month.

BlueShore Financial conducted an online survey of 650 of its members asking whether they’ve had a “family-financed’ mortgage. The credit union got 356 responses with 41% of those responding saying they received financial assistance from parents or family members in either the form of a loan or a gift.

“I think families are seeing that asset itself as a good investment. Real estate has gotten good returns over time,” said Chris Catliff, chief executive of BlueShore.

Mr. Catliff agrees his survey was not scientific but it does suggest the trend of family giving is only going to increase.

The same survey found 76% of people with children plan to provide some sort of assistance in the future to the children with 21% of people saying they plan to give $100,000 to $199,000.
 
*amazed*
what ever happened to the days when hard work was all that is required to buy a house? Who ever needed to borrow from family? God - these high prices are too too tooooo much. It feels like building one yourself maybe cheaper!
 
Similarly, being a millionaire isn't that uncommon these days. That doesn't even put you in the 1% in terms of net worth. Being a ten-millionaire does though.
 
IMO, it's essentially the boomers helping out their kids in light of their significant growth in wealth due to the real estate bull market of the last decade.
 
*amazed*
what ever happened to the days when hard work was all that is required to buy a house? Who ever needed to borrow from family? God - these high prices are too too tooooo much. It feels like building one yourself maybe cheaper!
It's funny you should mention that. I touched on this before but by chance I am in a somewhat unique situation that allows me to indirectly address that comment.

Last month I switched from one underwriter at my insurer to a different underwriter. The two underwriters represent two different departments at the same insurance company. The two departments share resources, but effectively compete against each other for customers. Let's call them underwriter A and underwriter B.

From 2007 until last month, I was with underwriter A. Because my insurance rate has been climbing steadily over the years, I've been looking around at various other insurers, but it turns out that the group rate (through my employer) with my existing company but with underwriter B would give me a better rate. So, I stayed with my existing insurer, but moved from underwriter A to underwriter B.

Part of the reason my insurance rates have been climbing is because they have been factoring in increases in build costs over the years. The build cost of my home in 2014 was estimated to be 30% higher than what it was in 2007. 30%! I didn't believe this, so I asked if I could get a formal appraisal done, like what I had done in 2007. Despite the fact it costs them a bit of money, they agreed. They were going to just use the estimates they had been using for underwriter A, but since I'm essentially a new client with underwriter B, and presumably because they sensed I was shopping around due to the fact I didn't believe their 30% increase estimate, they approved the new appraisal.

Coincidentally, the person doing the appraisal in 2014 is the exact same person that did the appraisal back in 2007, so he actually would have access to his old appraisal as well, as a reference to the new appraisal. Well, as I suspected, the new appraisal did not come in at 30% higher, but to my insurer's credit, it was relatively close. The new build cost appraisal came in at 27.5% higher than 2007. That represents roughly a 3.6% increase in build costs per year. (Their estimate had put the increase at 3.8% per year average.)

What does this all really mean? It means that in Toronto for detached homes, gone are the days of home builds for $175 per square foot. Even cheaper builds are usually well north of $200/sf these days, and expensive builds may be north of $300/sf. In fact, IIRC the guy told me that he hasn't seen home builds for reasonable detached homes in Toronto below $250/sf lately.

So, let's take that $250/sf number as an entry level number. To build a basic 2000 sf detached home will cost you $500000 or more. But that's just the build cost (including permits and contractor profit, etc.). The lot is on top of that. To get a decent lot in a reasonably nice but lower cost area will cost you around $500000 (and that's not even including taxes). So, already $1 million plus taxes. If you go to a higher end area, you may be looking at $800000 just for the lot, so $1.3 million for the lot plus house build, and that's just for a 2000 sf home. Move up to 2500 sf and add nicer finishes, and you may be looking at closer to $650000-$700000 for just the build cost.

You will be able to save money if you can take a year off work and actually physically build the house yourself or supervise 3rd party subcontractors that you hire yourself at builders' rates, but that's not really an option for most people, and that assumes your time is worth nothing.
 
*amazed*
what ever happened to the days when hard work was all that is required to buy a house? Who ever needed to borrow from family? God - these high prices are too too tooooo much. It feels like building one yourself maybe cheaper!

My wife and I feel very frustrated. We feel like we did everything right -- avoided and/or paid down debt, developed stellar credit ratings, saved our money, and secured decent-paying jobs. Yet, to purchase even a modest home in this city, in the areas we like, is completely out of reach, both from a financial point of view and a common sense one. Fixer-uppers for over $600K? People paying upwards of 45-70% of their monthly income to purchase and maintain a garbage-dump property? Doesn't seem to lend itself to a decent quality of living.

We like condos, but man, the staggering costs, cheap quality of most of the newer builds (future glass replacement is going to be a nightmare), outrageous maintenance fees (higher than almost every other city), and now this complete horseshit of "parking maintenance" in newer buildings is making it less and less palatable. It still makes more sense to rent. The frustration comes from an increasing lack of choices for those of us who did what we thought we were supposed to do, and yet still feel like this city is quickly being taken away from the grasp of regular hardworking citizens who play by the rules and still come up short.

In almost any other city we would have a wide selection of housing options and neighbourhoods, maybe even the ability to build whatever we wanted wherever we wanted. But here we are excluded from the party. And I don't think anyone is entitled or deserves anything; the world is not fair and you have to scramble and play the angles to get what you want of out life. But there is a pronounced disconnect between housing costs in Toronto and the everyday life of the average Canadian family that is likely going to do us long-term harm.
 
My wife and I feel very frustrated. We feel like we did everything right -- avoided and/or paid down debt, developed stellar credit ratings, saved our money, and secured decent-paying jobs. Yet, to purchase even a modest home in this city, in the areas we like, is completely out of reach, both from a financial point of view and a common sense one. Fixer-uppers for over $600K? People paying upwards of 45-70% of their monthly income to purchase and maintain a garbage-dump property? Doesn't seem to lend itself to a decent quality of living.

We like condos, but man, the staggering costs, cheap quality of most of the newer builds (future glass replacement is going to be a nightmare), outrageous maintenance fees (higher than almost every other city), and now this complete horseshit of "parking maintenance" in newer buildings is making it less and less palatable. It still makes more sense to rent. The frustration comes from an increasing lack of choices for those of us who did what we thought we were supposed to do, and yet still feel like this city is quickly being taken away from the grasp of regular hardworking citizens who play by the rules and still come up short.

In almost any other city we would have a wide selection of housing options and neighbourhoods, maybe even the ability to build whatever we wanted wherever we wanted. But here we are excluded from the party. And I don't think anyone is entitled or deserves anything; the world is not fair and you have to scramble and play the angles to get what you want of out life. But there is a pronounced disconnect between housing costs in Toronto and the everyday life of the average Canadian family that is likely going to do us long-term harm.

Sucks, doesn't it? Toronto is becoming more and more unaffordable by the second. Salaries aren't really in line with home prices either. When the interest rates creep up, there's going to be a lot of people hurting.

The home prices are high. But then there are so many other added costs. If you're not a 1st time home buyer you're paying the 2 land transfers. If the property is over $400K, you're paying even more. Then there's the property taxes. If you're buying new, you need to come up with 20% down. Then there's the closing costs which are starting to really get up there. Lawyer fees, tarion fees, et... If it's a condo, you get destroyed on maintenance fees and now as you said the parking maintenance fee. I didn't even mention Hydro, internet, tv, etc. LOL. And after all that, you're probably getting a crappy product.

To own a home in Toronto you kinda have to close your eyes and hope you don't get reamed too badly.

You can always move to Hamilton, though.
 
.... and now this complete horseshit of "parking maintenance" in newer buildings ...

Pardon my ignorance but could you, please, explain in a bit more detail as to what this 'parking maintenance' is about?

I live in College Park 1. If you are referring to the charges related to the parking spot, then, for years, I have been paying a charge, included in monthly condo fees, for the parking spot.

Ths.
 
Pardon my ignorance but could you, please, explain in a bit more detail as to what this 'parking maintenance' is about?

I live in College Park 1. If you are referring to the charges related to the parking spot, then, for years, I have been paying a charge, included in monthly condo fees, for the parking spot.

Ths.

It's a maintenance fee for the parking. Built into your maintenance fees. I've seen fees as high as $50/month
 
My wife and I feel very frustrated. We feel like we did everything right -- avoided and/or paid down debt, developed stellar credit ratings, saved our money, and secured decent-paying jobs. Yet, to purchase even a modest home in this city, in the areas we like, is completely out of reach, both from a financial point of view and a common sense one. Fixer-uppers for over $600K? People paying upwards of 45-70% of their monthly income to purchase and maintain a garbage-dump property? Doesn't seem to lend itself to a decent quality of living.

-- snip --

In almost any other city we would have a wide selection of housing options and neighbourhoods, maybe even the ability to build whatever we wanted wherever we wanted. But here we are excluded from the party. And I don't think anyone is entitled or deserves anything; the world is not fair and you have to scramble and play the angles to get what you want of out life. But there is a pronounced disconnect between housing costs in Toronto and the everyday life of the average Canadian family that is likely going to do us long-term harm.
That's why people move to the inner 'burbs or the suburbs. Not that I'd advise that for everyone, because everyone's preferences are different, but I personally moved to the inner 'burbs because I wanted a detached home on a big lot, and it was much, much more pricey in central Toronto. And yes, in another smaller less expensive city, I could probably buy in any neighbourhood I want, but I chose to live in Toronto.

BTW, while I empathize, I don't quite buy your harm claim. Oh and, having a stellar credit rating is nice, but it's not as if it's going to help you get a home cheaper. The mortgage rates you'll get are the same if your credit score is 692 or if it's 801.

We like condos, but man, the staggering costs, cheap quality of most of the newer builds (future glass replacement is going to be a nightmare), outrageous maintenance fees (higher than almost every other city), and now this complete horseshit of "parking maintenance" in newer buildings is making it less and less palatable.
Parking maintenance is perfectly reasonable. It's not as if parking lots automagically maintain themselves. Now it's true that some buildings may charge too much for maintenance fees on parking spots, but that's a different argument.

The time when having no separate parking spot maintenance fee makes sense is when the parking spot is bundled in with your unit. However, that just means you're paying higher condo fees for your unit than you would otherwise. Either way, you're still paying fees to maintain your parking spot.

BTW, when I bought my condo, I specifically looked for one with as few amenities as possible. The fewer the amenities, the cheaper the condo fees. (Not always, but frequently.)
 
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It's a maintenance fee for the parking. Built into your maintenance fees. I've seen fees as high as $50/month

It is only fair that there should be a separate charge for parking spot/garage maintenance. In our building, if you bought a studio/bachelor unit, you could not buy a parking spot even if you had wanted to. For the bigger units, buying a parking spot was optional.
 
Pardon my ignorance but could you, please, explain in a bit more detail as to what this 'parking maintenance' is about?

I live in College Park 1. If you are referring to the charges related to the parking spot, then, for years, I have been paying a charge, included in monthly condo fees, for the parking spot.

Ths.

Here's how I feel about it, misguided or not:

If I choose to purchase a parking spot with my unit for whatever price they are asking, and then I am being charged monthly maintenance fees for the building structure and amenities, as far as I'm concerned I am DONE. Call me crazy, but I would assume that the parking area is part of the building property and thus should be included in my regular monthly maintenance fees. If it is included, that is fine and expected, but from what I've been hearing, and perhaps I misunderstood, is that these fees are now above and beyond regular maintenance (due to some folks not having cars, perhaps?).

It's a maintenance fee for the parking. Built into your maintenance fees. I've seen fees as high as $50/month

Some of the newer projects near Yonge and Eglinton are charging around $150. I think someone mentioned it in this thread.
 

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