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407 Rail Freight Bypass/The Missing Link

I'm not wholly convinced the best approach might not be for Crosstown to bypass Yonge Street entirely. It does somewhat compromise connectivity, but a station east of Spadina combined with improved Bay bus service wouldn't be badly connected while avoiding a good chunk of the property and subway capacity issues North Toronto station would have.
 
Probably just directed that's links to study missing link again. Upated: added page 3.


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Allandale25 said:
Also, is that a typo where it says "/2" on the first page? Is there a secret real page one?
Click to expand...
Think you may need to go directly to the tweet since the four pages are there. I'll put them here to make it easier.

1736443502660.jpeg1736443517819.jpeg1736443536048.jpeg1736443547587.jpeg
 
The original bypass plan didn't really revolve around CPKC, it merely posited that it would be cheaper to shift CN off the Halton Sub onto a new line than enlarge the Halton Sub to accommodate all users. In the end Ontario chose to go ahead with modest expansion along the CN line to add some GO service.

One suspects that there will still be an upper limit to how much passenger service can be added without an even larger expansion.

I wonder if the same dilemma may exist for the Milton line - is it cheaper to shift CP to a bypass route so that the Milton line does not need expansion to grow to 2WAD?

And the other dilemma may be catching up with us - would it make sense to add CN to that bypass rather than make further enlargements to the Halton Sub, given that there is even greater potential passenger capacity required that has been committed to date?

Perhaps the bypass isn't dead after all, timing is everything.

- Paul
 
crs1026 said:
The original bypass plan didn't really revolve around CPKC, it merely posited that it would be cheaper to shift CN off the Halton Sub onto a new line than enlarge the Halton Sub to accommodate all users. In the end Ontario chose to go ahead with modest expansion along the CN line to add some GO service.

One suspects that there will still be an upper limit to how much passenger service can be added without an even larger expansion.

I wonder if the same dilemma may exist for the Milton line - is it cheaper to shift CP to a bypass route so that the Milton line does not need expansion to grow to 2WAD?

And the other dilemma may be catching up with us - would it make sense to add CN to that bypass rather than make further enlargements to the Halton Sub, given that there is even greater potential passenger capacity required that has been committed to date?

Perhaps the bypass isn't dead after all, timing is everything.

- Paul
Click to expand...

Indeed. The archived press release from the announcement for CN only. Posted here at the time but posting it again for anyone new here.

Ontario Newsroom

news.ontario.ca

Also discussed in September 2024 here.
 
Excellent! People kept telling me that the proposed flyover at Georgetown would make the 407 freight bypass obsolete, but I never believed it. Even with the flyover, the freight bypass would eventually still be needed.

I can't see CN agreeing to go ahead with the 407 freight bypass if it means having to share the track with CPKC. Allowing CPKC trains to run on the Halton & York subdivisions would have a negative impact on CN operations at the Brampton Intermodal facility and the MAC yard. I don't even think they'll agree to GO trains running on this subdivision. Which is okay IMO. Just taking CN trains off the Kitchener line would be a huge boost to the passenger rail network in the GTA.
 
Bojaxs said:
I can't see CN agreeing to go ahead with the 407 freight bypass if it means having to share the track with CPKC. Allowing CPKC trains to run on the Halton & York subdivisions would have a negative impact on CN operations at the Brampton Intermodal facility and the MAC yard. I don't even think they'll agree to GO trains running on this subdivision. Which is okay IMO. Just taking CN trains off the Kitchener line would be a huge boost to the passenger rail network in the GTA.
Click to expand...
CP has no need to run trains from Milton to Bramalea.

I don't know why anyone is mentioning it.
 
nfitz said:
CP has no need to run trains from Milton to Bramalea.

I don't know why anyone is mentioning it.
Click to expand...

Well, it was Ford who clearly has rekindled the idea of the Bypass. One is entitled to wonder why he would do that when the original Halton Sub rationale is somewhat resolved.

You are correct that it is UTers who are speculating that this implies CPKC would participate. They have logical reasons for that speculation, but whether those are Ford's agenda is just conjecture. And maybe a bit of overimagination, at least for what will happen in my lifetime.

- Paul
 
Not sure about calling it "GO 2.0", but glad the Ford government seems to finally be considering building freight bypasses and diverting freight to open up capacity for passenger rail. Hopefully this isn't a hollow announcement for PR/campaign purposes and the start of serious work to expand regional rail. With the growth of cities west of Brampton, the incremental improvements to the Kitchener Line wouldn't be enough.

I don't see a meaningful way to decrease highway congestion in the GTA via regional rail without considering these options.
 
nfitz said:
CP has no need to run trains from Milton to Bramalea.

I don't know why anyone is mentioning it.
Click to expand...
I mean "trip length/ time" isn't a deciding factor for freight rail as much as it is with passenger rail. But technically speaking if CP trains were allowed to run along the Halton/ York subdivision it would make for shorter trips. Instead of the current mainline setup where CP trains have to go all the way down to the Junction in Etobicoke and then go up the Mactier subdivision to Vaughan. This would be especially true for CP trains running between Chicago-Montreal which have to make a stop in Toronto.

If CN were to construct 407 bypass, then they'll have a much better mainline setup in Toronto compared to CPKC. It'll effectively be a straight east-west line across North Toronto with easy access to their Intermodal facility in Brampton and freight yard in Vaughan.
 
crs1026 said:
Well, it was Ford who clearly has rekindled the idea of the Bypass. One is entitled to wonder why he would do that when the original Halton Sub rationale is somewhat resolved.
Click to expand...
The post I was responding to was about a different plan than the Milton to Bramalea bypass.

crs1026 said:
They have logical reasons for that speculation, but whether those are Ford's agenda is just conjecture.
Click to expand...
Logical? Seems like fanwank to me.
 
The other biggie is that the bypass gets us to a place where something short of federal intervention could put electrification of Milton and beyond Bramalea on the table.

I actually quite like calling it GO 2.0; the level of transformation if this gets us full electrification of Kitchener and Milton corridors, let alone if it opens up Midtown, is on that level…. Really I’d suggest the biggest issue with it is that it highlights that electrification as it stands now never got good, concise, branding. In a sensible world “go expansion” would have had something as pithy and pointed as “GO 2.0” attached to it from the beginning, and we could be talking about the bypass being “GO 3.0”.
 
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