2014 Municipal Election: Toronto Council Races

[adma]

Then again, given how long in the tooth some incumbents are (Kelly, Cho, DiGiorgio etc), not everybody will be running for reelection in 2018--might be an opening there...

 

[Videodrome]

I just checked out the 43 Down page and was highly amused at how they reacted to so many of their chosen candidates losing.

 

[aquateam]

I just checked out the 43 Down page and was highly amused at how they reacted to so many of their chosen candidates losing.

Was it like ISIS coming to Toronto?

 

[adma]

Y'know, I wonder if there's a different kind of "strategic" explanation for why so many incumbents survived--too many wards with too many candidates running, too many names on the ballot, too many of them marginal nonentities, and they clog up the works to the point where voters might go "the eff with it" and opt for the safety of incumbency. Whereas the option is much clearer when we're dealing with just two or three or four (indeed, in Ward 12, with only four candidates, all four hit 20%).

Perhaps it also explains mayoral choices--like, traditionally, the biggest fringe/marginal/"other" share has been in the poor, multiethnic, low-info suburban wards where DoFo did best...

 

[Palma]

Then again, given how long in the tooth some incumbents are (Kelly, Cho, DiGiorgio etc), not everybody will be running for reelection in 2018--might be an opening there...

They should not have been running this time. Di Giorgio is 68. He must not have a stressful work day. I do not think he is like some councillors in some wards dealing with development issues in the ward. There is some development in the ward but he never has any community meetings. Does not even have an eNewsletter or website. Jaye Robinson has a website with info and Vaughan had one and there must be others

 

[Palma]

Y'know, I wonder if there's a different kind of "strategic" explanation for why so many incumbents survived--too many wards with too many candidates running, too many names on the ballot, too many of them marginal nonentities, and they clog up the works to the point where voters might go "the eff with it" and opt for the safety of incumbency. Whereas the option is much clearer when we're dealing with just two or three or four (indeed, in Ward 12, with only four candidates, all four hit 20%).

Perhaps it also explains mayoral choices--like, traditionally, the biggest fringe/marginal/"other" share has been in the poor, multiethnic, low-info suburban wards where DoFo did best...

I have to agree. I was working at the election in Ward 12. When explaining the ballot to voters and they can choose one mayor, one councillor and one trustee, they looked at the ballot and saw all those names and were confused. There were 4 people throughout the day that when presented with the ballot, looked at it and said where is Fords name. Their English was poor. I had 15 rejected ballots in which I had to issue new ballots (there were 4 ballot officers) so there must have been the same number of ballots rejected. One couple had to have 3 ballots issued to them (each). There were people thinking you had to place an X, those that thought after the selection that the ballot goes into a box (the types that were used when an X was placed beside a name). What people should have done when selecting councillors is not choose the name they recognize but the name they do not.

 

[adma]

And this trend t/w *huge* candidate lists is relatively recent, and snowballing.

And if you think it's bad now, imagine how it'd be under ranked balloting: voters having to (or feeling obligated to) rank every single name on the ballot...

 

[ttk77]

And this trend t/w *huge* candidate lists is relatively recent, and snowballing.

And if you think it's bad now, imagine how it'd be under ranked balloting: voters having to (or feeling obligated to) rank every single name on the ballot...

The ranked balloting may make things more complicated or confusing, but it should also negate some of the incumbency advantage. I think we'd see wards changing hands a lot more often.

 

[WislaHD]

And this trend t/w *huge* candidate lists is relatively recent, and snowballing.

And if you think it's bad now, imagine how it'd be under ranked balloting: voters having to (or feeling obligated to) rank every single name on the ballot...

I was scrutineering at a polling station and was surprised at some of the things I've seen, similar to Palma's story.

I'm all for ranked ballots but honestly, I foresee a big problem with just explaining how ranked ballots work to people, let alone the time it would take as people inevitably try to rank 60+ candidates and get the mayor/council/trustee lists mixed up in their rankings...

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

It's pretty sad, but there is a large section of the population in Toronto that is functionally illiterate in English. It's one major downside to having an open immigration policy... family reunification is the worst for this given how hard it is for older people to learn a new language.

 

[W. K. Lis]

An extreme example of a ranked ballot:

A more likely ballot, with first, second, and third choices only:

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

It's pretty sad, but there is a large section of the population in Toronto that is functionally illiterate in English. It's one major downside to having an open immigration policy... family reunification is the worst for this given how hard it is for older people to learn a new language.

Here's a funny story -- when I was a TA at Waterloo for the Technical Writing & Speaking course (assigned to engineering students who failed the entering English exam), ALL the 'immigrants' worked hard, improved, passed the course. It was all the 3rd or 4th generation Torontonians that couldn't grasp the language.

Maybe if we allow family reunification but kick out all the 3rd generation functional illiterates?

 

[Palma]

An extreme example of a ranked ballot:

View attachment 36624




A more likely ballot, with first, second, and third choices only:

View attachment 36625






View attachment 36626

I really think politician love that the system is so messed up and count on people not being informed

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

Here's a funny story -- when I was a TA at Waterloo for the Technical Writing & Speaking course (assigned to engineering students who failed the entering English exam), ALL the 'immigrants' worked hard, improved, passed the course. It was all the 3rd or 4th generation Torontonians that couldn't grasp the language.

Maybe if we allow family reunification but kick out all the 3rd generation functional illiterates?

Yeah but you're talking about young, smart university students who want to pursue careers in Engineering. I'm talking about adults and senior citizens who may have never completed high school, never mind attending the most prestigious engineering school in the country.

Unfortunately there are also a large number of Canadian-born residents who find the current ballot too complicated. Lots of seniors with undiagnosed dementia, for example...

 

[aquateam]

Yeah but you're talking about young, smart university students who want to pursue careers in Engineering. I'm talking about adults and senior citizens who may have never completed high school, never mind attending the most prestigious engineering school in the country.

*cough* Queens *cough* U of T *cough* UBC *cough*