What are all the ways to pay for subway expansion.

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Toronto has this idea that they want subways. If you want them, pay for it! What are they ways we can pay for subways

I have:
Road Tolls
Gas Tax

Anymore?

 

[rfid]

I kinda brought this up before, and I'm not entirely sure how it works.. But MTA in NYC issues bonds.

As for road tolls, a lot of the traffic on the area highways are for transportation of goods (i.e. trucks). What can we do about that? Shift it to more freight train traffic?

 

[nfitz]

How many threads is this user going to create on virtually the same topic? We've already had The user has already created two other threads recently with almost exactly the same topic - he's already done http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/18434-Road-Tolls.-The-Gordon-Chong-report-Thread and http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/18183-Canadians-willing-to-pay-road-tolls. recently, and we've also got:
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showth...t-Alliance-GTA-needs-road-tolls-and-taxes-now
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/5162-What-s-wrong-with-tolls
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/3101-Would-downtown-resident-s-have-to-pay-road-tolls
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/3105-Star-Support-for-Tolls-on-the-Rise ...

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

How many threads is this user going to create on virtually the same topic? We've already had The user has already created two other threads recently with almost exactly the same topic - he's already done http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/18434-Road-Tolls.-The-Gordon-Chong-report-Thread and http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/18183-Canadians-willing-to-pay-road-tolls. recently, and we've also got:
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showth...t-Alliance-GTA-needs-road-tolls-and-taxes-now
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/5162-What-s-wrong-with-tolls
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/3101-Would-downtown-resident-s-have-to-pay-road-tolls
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/3105-Star-Support-for-Tolls-on-the-Rise ...

1) I'm not kettal.
2) half the threads you mentioned are from 5 years ago, conditions have changed
3) Those two articles are NEWS REPORTS!


You seriously need to cut it out. You are not a mod, and if a mod determines this thread should go down so be it.

 

[rbt]

I kinda brought this up before, and I'm not entirely sure how it works.. But MTA in NYC issues bonds.

They issue bonds for capital purchases and have a real-estate tax and road-toll based revenue stream in addition to fares.

MTA has some pretty heafty debt. $31B in debt on $6.5B of revenues (from all 3 of the above sources) and annual operating costs of $13B.

I'm not convinced that specific model is functional.

Translink in Vancouver seems to be having better luck. Their revenue streams (gas tax and road tolls) seems to be somewhat more predictable.

 

[nfitz]

1) I'm not kettal.

I don't even know what that means.

2) half the threads you mentioned are from 5 years ago, conditions have changed

Two of them (the two you created) are still on the first page. The topics are virtually identical.

You seriously need to cut it out. You are not a mod, and if a mod determines this thread should go down so be it.

You need to cut it out. You should be able to self-moderate. This sub-forum is a disaster of readability to begin with. Don't make it worse.

 

[rfid]

For gas tax, would it be province or country wide and directed proportionally? I always wondered how Western New Yorkers feel about NYC, if it's like how the rest of the province feels about Toronto. I guess it would capture out of province road users if they fill up within the province? We know city level taxes fail here since it's easier to relocate outside the city proper (vs. NYC, where do you move, out of state to NJ across the river? A lot harder).

Should we try to divert out of region truck traffic (through traffic) onto toll roads like the 407 (after the east end connectors are built)?

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I don't even know what that means.

You mean trying to insinuate another poster is me?

Two of them (the two you created) are still on the first page. The topics are virtually identical.

And that does not mean the same.

You need to cut it out. You should be able to self-moderate. This sub-forum is a disaster of readability to begin with. Don't make it worse.

Mostly because it is you starting fights with people over ideological nonsense. Or your over the top exaggerations. Pick one.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

For gas tax, would it be province or country wide and directed proportionally? I always wondered how Western New Yorkers feel about NYC, if it's like how the rest of the province feels about Toronto. I guess it would capture out of province road users if they fill up within the province? We know city level taxes fail here since it's easier to relocate outside the city proper (vs. NYC, where do you move, out of state to NJ across the river? A lot harder).

Should we try to divert out of region truck traffic (through traffic) onto toll roads like the 407 (after the east end connectors are built)?

It is worse than the Toronto-ROO relationship. It's funny because Buffalo is a leech city if there ever was one. I think a gas tax should be regional.

 

[nfitz]

You mean trying to insinuate another poster is me?

I've done no such thing. I said you'd recently created two threads on the topic. Your are listed as the first poster in both of those threads.

To bring this back on topic. I think we should fund subway expansion by imposing a tax on posters who create multiple unnecessary threads discussing subway expansion funding.

 

[M II A II R II K]

The transit agency can get into the real estate business and perhaps list themselves on the TSX to raise some extra capital. They can buy up land and develop along the new routes being built and take the profits from the mortgages they sell, and including to sell property for a profit in the future. In addition they can perpetually lease land to developers if they choose not to build on it themselves. Also use the position to leverage how zoning will take place to get the necessary transit densities.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I've done no such thing. I said you'd recently created two threads on the topic. Your are listed as the first poster in both of those threads.

To bring this back on topic. I think we should fund subway expansion by imposing a tax on posters who create multiple unnecessary threads discussing subway expansion funding.

They you should have said so.
Okay. That's not on topic.

 

[GraphicMatt]

Road pricing is good because by itself it will ease some congestion, while also raising revenues.

More generally, I'd want to look at either a payroll tax or a sales tax.

A payroll tax set at 1%ish of a company's payroll would help Toronto recoup some of the costs that arise from 905 residents who make use of the city's transportation infrastructure.

A sales tax (again at 1% or even 2%, bringing the sales tax back in line to what it was for more than a decade) would be good because it would mean the city would derive direct financial benefit from special events. Right now, when City Hall endorses an event like Pride or TIFF, the economy activity those events generate has minimal direct impact on the city's finances. (They make a little cash off parking and permits, but that's about it.)

The Chong report looked at both these options, though not in any great depth. KPMG estimated a payroll tax at 1% could drive $680 million per year in additional revenue for the city. A 1% sales tax could generate $503 million.

Both revenue tools would have to be studied to look at the impact on business growth, especially in the outer suburbs. Regional implementation of these new taxes — with all revenues going direct to infrastructure across the GTA — would be preferable to a 416-only strategy.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Road pricing is good because by itself it will ease some congestion, while also raising revenues.

More generally, I'd want to look at either a payroll tax or a sales tax.

A payroll tax set at 1%ish of a company's payroll would help Toronto recoup some of the costs that arise from 905 residents who make use of the city's transportation infrastructure.

A sales tax (again at 1% or even 2%, bringing the sales tax back in line to what it was for more than a decade) would be good because it would mean the city would derive direct financial benefit from special events. Right now, when City Hall endorses an event like Pride or TIFF, the economy activity those events generate has minimal direct impact on the city's finances. (They make a little cash off parking and permits, but that's about it.)

The Chong report looked at both these options, though not in any great depth. KPMG estimated a payroll tax at 1% could drive $680 million per year in additional revenue for the city. A 1% sales tax could generate $503 million.

Both revenue tools would have to be studied to look at the impact on business growth, especially in the outer suburbs. Regional implementation of these new taxes — with all revenues going direct to infrastructure across the GTA — would be preferable to a 416-only strategy.

And with the land transfer , car tax we are at past 1.5 billion. I would think the percentages would be 2.5% or so.

 

[CDL.TO]

I've done no such thing. I said you'd recently created two threads on the topic. Your are listed as the first poster in both of those threads.

To bring this back on topic. I think we should fund subway expansion by imposing a tax on posters who create multiple unnecessary threads discussing subway expansion funding.

Can we start a tax on members who feel the need to passive aggressively police the forum by attempting to shame other members?

I'm closing this thread and renaming http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showthread.php/18434-Road-Tolls.-The-Gordon-Chong-report-Thread so it's inclusive of all potential funding sources.