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Waterfront Transit Reset Phase 1 Study

How should Toronto connect the East and West arms of the planned waterfront transit with downtown?

  • Expand the existing Union loop

    Votes: 205 71.2%

  • Build a Western terminus

    Votes: 13 4.5%

  • Route service along Queen's Quay with pedestrian/cycle/bus connection to Union

    Votes: 31 10.8%

  • Connect using existing Queen's Quay/Union Loop and via King Street

    Votes: 22 7.6%

  • Other

    Votes: 17 5.9%
  • Total voters
    288
Allandale25 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1819924693601702083
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Can we say drawbridge still up with cars not aware of it? It supposed to be up till next weekend.

Unless the LRT line is built by 2030 which is already too late, traffic will be a nightmare when the first residential development opens.

2025 is when the new park will be open to the public and you better be prepare to do some long walking as TTC bus service will be the pits trying to get to it.
 
With all the density coming to the East Bayfront and Port Lands, I’m surprised a subway line wasn’t proposed. There are so many destinations and a lot of density near the lake from the Beaches to Humber Bay.

But it can be inefficient to take transit from, say, Parkdale to South Core or the Port Lands. At the time of writing, Google Maps said that it would take 1 hour and 1 minute to travel from Queen and Beatty to Corus on Queens Quay by transit, which seems dismal.
 
junctionist said:
With all the density coming to the East Bayfront and Port Lands, I’m surprised a subway line wasn’t proposed. There are so many destinations and a lot of density near the lake from the Beaches to Humber Bay.

But it can be inefficient to take transit from, say, Parkdale to South Core or the Port Lands. At the time of writing, Google Maps said that it would take 1 hour and 1 minute to travel from Queen and Beatty to Corus on Queens Quay by transit, which seems dismal.
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It was along with a monorail with TTC shooting it down along with the committee.

TTC max ridership for Union Loop was 10, 000 at peak time for the various lines feeding into it. More like 15,000, but who am I to say this when TTC/ML is to supposed know more than us.
 
The amount of dithering on transit on the waterfront is staggering. It’s time the city took a decision and start building the waterfront east LRT already. It’s cheaper to build it now rather than wait years - construction inflation is much higher and it’s simpler to build infrastructure when no one lives in the new area yet. Why is it we can build roads and sewers and provide electricity but we can’t build transit from day 1. The loop at Union is a problem but a solution is available - it just needs to be picked. Expansion of the loop is probably best but most expensive. However, it’s likely the right solution long term. Maybe we also need to solve for something in the interim with a street loop - maybe it’s time to dedicate a lane of York and Bay and Front to an LRT and make those streets one direction.
 
drum118 said:
It was along with a monorail with TTC shooting it down along with the committee.

TTC max ridership for Union Loop was 10, 000 at peak time for the various lines feeding into it. More like 15,000, but who am I to say this when TTC/ML is to supposed know more than us.
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If you don't have a subway in neighbourhoods with the projected density and the destinations of the East Bayfront and the Port Lands, you have traffic jams and a lot of car accidents.

The days when it could be justified to take an hour to travel from Parkdale to the East Bayfront are long gone (that was more than a century ago when Parkdale was an outer suburb). These are central neighbourhoods that are filling with density and should be efficiently connected.
 
lead82 said:
The amount of dithering on transit on the waterfront is staggering. It’s time the city took a decision and start building the waterfront east LRT already. It’s cheaper to build it now rather than wait years - construction inflation is much higher and it’s simpler to build infrastructure when no one lives in the new area yet. Why is it we can build roads and sewers and provide electricity but we can’t build transit from day 1. The loop at Union is a problem but a solution is available - it just needs to be picked. Expansion of the loop is probably best but most expensive. However, it’s likely the right solution long term. Maybe we also need to solve for something in the interim with a street loop - maybe it’s time to dedicate a lane of York and Bay and Front to an LRT and make those streets one direction.
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The dithering on transit on the waterfront is staggering because of TTC lack of funding of Union loop and lack of vision what is really needed that is already close to been 20 years late already.

The city is also reasonable for the dithering on transit with a lack of funds and having to jump through so many hoops to get back to where we are to day, not 2014.

Then you got ML who has stop the QQE expansion to Cheery St Loop until the OL is built there as well at exhibition

If Waterfront Toronto had full control on building transit on the waterfront as well access to funding it, it would all been built a decade ago keeping with Transit First, not the car.
 
Maybe it’s time to give control of waterfront transit to WaterfrontTO. In terms of funding, I find it a false narrative. Toronto has the money but no political will to raise it. Yes it would mean they have to raise property taxes or parking fees or get out of certain services and to focus on core things like infrastructure and transit and drop non core services or rebuilding the Gardiner was not a sane idea.
 
lead82 said:
Maybe it’s time to give control of waterfront transit to WaterfrontTO. In terms of funding, I find it a false narrative. Toronto has the money but no political will to raise it. Yes it would mean they have to raise property taxes or parking fees or get out of certain services and to focus on core things like infrastructure and transit and drop non core services or rebuilding the Gardiner was not a sane idea.
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Where do you think WT gets ITS money? Hint: It has no taxing powers and is jointly funded by Feds, Ontario and Toronto. Currently WT is responsible for the surface part of the QQE LRT while TTC is responsible for the tunnel and the loop portion.
 
lead82 said:
The amount of dithering on transit on the waterfront is staggering. It’s time the city took a decision and start building the waterfront east LRT already. It’s cheaper to build it now rather than wait years - construction inflation is much higher and it’s simpler to build infrastructure when no one lives in the new area yet. Why is it we can build roads and sewers and provide electricity but we can’t build transit from day 1. The loop at Union is a problem but a solution is available - it just needs to be picked. Expansion of the loop is probably best but most expensive. However, it’s likely the right solution long term. Maybe we also need to solve for something in the interim with a street loop - maybe it’s time to dedicate a lane of York and Bay and Front to an LRT and make those streets one direction.
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I think the issue is staffing, the TTC has to run a minimum frequency of 30 mins. Building a sewer doesn't really require workers every day to be paid once it's done
 
turbanplanner said:
I think the issue is staffing, the TTC has to run a minimum frequency of 30 mins. Building a sewer doesn't really require workers every day to be paid once it's done
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True but with streetcars, you could actually automate the service with AI and self driving vehicles. The technology is there it just needs to be trained. However, one can build a line and provide minimal service until demand grows. The city government is just plain incompetent and doesn’t know what to prioritize. It tries to do too much and fails miserably.
 
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