VIA Rail

[Northern Light]

What's the point of building a dead end rail line to Peterborough and then cancelling the rest of the project? If anything the whole thing would get cancelled.

The concervative opposition has been dead set against the spending going on with the current government and promising to cancel projects to win votes is for sure their strategy.

Or they may sell it to private investors and let them roll with it.

I'm confused by your comment.

What's likely to be announced has nothing to do with Peterborough. Its the segment of VIA's operations in Quebec (associated with the corridor).
That route is unlikely to change. It already meets the existing corridor in Ottawa.

So far as we know, there is nothing to do with Peterborough involved here.

****

No one is going to build a dead-end to Peterborough. But any section of the proposed HFR route from Smith's Falls to Quebec City can be invested in without reference to the Toronto - Smith's Falls segment.
The existing corridor already gets to Smith's Falls. So you can chunk out work on that section easily.

Once you decide to proceed with the route to Smith's Falls, via Peterborough, that project has to be done mostly as one big project.
It would be possible to phase in or defer certain parts such as alternative alignments or some passing tracks; but you need a complete route, with essential passing tracks in place.

We really don't know what decisions have been taken so far; and we really do have to wait for the announcements that follow.
But what appears to the case is that the government is committing resources to sections that are easier to deliver and less expensive and can be used with or without a new routing in Ontario.
That defers the big expenses and politics to a later date.

****

Because this segment doesn't involve any new route in Ontario, and is comparatively cheap, assuming a tendering process were imminent, its unlikely any future government would roll that back. Irrespective of their politics.

 

[Bordercollie]

I'm confused by your comment.

What's likely to be announced has nothing to do with Peterborough. Its the segment of VIA's operations in Quebec (associated with the corridor).
That route is unlikely to change. It already meets the existing corridor in Ottawa.

So far as we know, there is nothing to do with Peterborough involved here.

****

No one is going to build a dead-end to Peterborough. But any section of the proposed HFR route from Smith's Falls to Quebec City can be invested in without reference to the Toronto - Smith's Falls segment.
The existing corridor already gets to Smith's Falls. So you can chunk out work on that section easily.

Once you decide to proceed with the route to Smith's Falls, via Peterborough, that project has to be done mostly as one big project.
It would be possible to phase in or defer certain parts such as alternative alignments or some passing tracks; but you need a complete route, with essential passing tracks in place.

We really don't know what decisions have been taken so far; and we really do have to wait for the announcements that follow.
But what appears to the case is that the government is committing resources to sections that are easier to deliver and less expensive and can be used with or without a new routing in Ontario.
That defers the big expenses and politics to a later date.

****

Because this segment doesn't involve any new route in Ontario, and is comparatively cheap, assuming a tendering process were imminent, its unlikely any future government would roll that back. Irrespective of their politics.

So are you implying that they are planning on investing in, increasing frequencies in the existing corridor without building a new line?

Or that the first step would be to build the corridor from Peterborough to Smith falls in one shot?

Think of the Eglinton subway, it was committed and construction had started and it was cancelled. Twenty years later we built an LRT at ten times the cost.

So even with shovels in the ground projects can be cancelled.

You don't think that a "Fiscally responsible concervative government" would want to win votes by showing that they are going to balance the budget as soon as possible? By following through with opposing liberal make work projects?
But no matter how much you want to save money today, to build it later will cost more.

 

[Northern Light]

So are you implying that they are planning on investing in, increasing frequencies in the existing corridor without building a new line?

Whoa. Take a deep breath. I'm not saying any of that. Where are you getting all of this. I think I've been perfectly clear.

The government committed a few hundred million in the budget for HFR this year. They are calling that a down payment.

It will be spent upgrading track in Quebec.

We simply don't have any information on any other part of the project going forward yet. Which does not mean it will or wont' happen. That's simply not the likely subject of the upcoming announcement, that's all.

Or that the first step would be to build the corridor from Peterborough to Smith falls in one shot?

See above.

Relax.

Make fewer assumptions please.

 

[crs1026]

^I don’t expect this announcement to be all that significant. Politicians can make big photo ops out of precious little. The Minister is simply making an appearance in the region. None of the other faces who one would expect at a big kickoff announcement will be anywhere nearby.

We don’t even know how much of the $492M funded will end up doing what.

We do know that the North Shore politicians are among the most enthusiastic for the project, and with an election coming I’m sure the Liberals want them saying nice things and not sounding disappointed. So there may be some local good news delivered. It wouldn’t be beyond belief that the locals are the ones playing this up to force the Minister into a corner.

One would hope that any money released is being spent on long lead time items and to de-risk the project for investors.

In a more perfect world I might speculate that a first step might be for VIA to secure title or long term lease on the Trois Rivieres line. But merely picking a site for its train station is more likely. Or maybe funding some smaller crossing or bridge repairs that are inevitable and ensure the line is still operable.

- Paul

 

[innsertnamehere]

What's the point of building a dead end rail line to Peterborough and then cancelling the rest of the project? If anything the whole thing would get cancelled.

The concervative opposition has been dead set against the spending going on with the current government and promising to cancel projects to win votes is for sure their strategy.

Or they may sell it to private investors and let them roll with it.

By phases they likely mean that they will break it out into "chunks", but not pointless sized chunks.

I can see it being split into Quebec-Montreal, Montreal-Ottawa, Ottawa-Toronto, Toronto-London, and London-Windsor, for example.

Ideally we see Quebec-Toronto done at once, but I have a feeling the $500 million may be used first to try to do Quebec-Montreal as it uses existing corridors and can be a quite useful line with probably only a smaller investment, provided that access to Montreal can be addressed around the Mount Royal tunnel.

The "big" part of the project is of course Montreal-Toronto, but getting from Ottawa to Toronto is where the vast majority of costs will be, as it needs a basically new rail corridor and access to Toronto is challenging.

The southern Ontario parts will then likely be held back for years despite them not likely really being super high cost items.

 

[kEiThZ]

Let's recall that one of the old articles said that Ottawa-Montreal was $92M. I would presume a lot of that is track work and maybe some platform upgrades. It could probably be done faster than some other sections.

If they wanted to, they absolutely build some parts out early.

 

[rbt]

Additional service is being restored in 10 days.

ROUTE	SERVICE
Toronto-Kingston-Montréal	Trains 62 and 65– daily as of July 12
Toronto-Kingston-Ottawa	Trains 47, 52, 54 and 59 – daily as of July 12
Québec City-Montréal-Ottawa	Trains 22, 29 and 633 – daily as of July 12

VIA Rail Increases Corridor Service Levels to Over 50% Starting July 12

VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) is pleased to announce it is moving forward with its service resumption plan in the Québec City-Windsor corridor by adding, starting July 12, 63 weekly frequencies, thus bringing service levels from 38% to 54% on that route.

finance.yahoo.com

 

[Allandale25]

"major announcement"

https://twitter.com/x/status/1412082788954689538

 

[cplchanb]

So they're going to announce a further study or and election pledge for funds? When will actua design work and procurement be remotely in the radar???

 

[roger1818]

So they're going to announce a further study or and election pledge for funds? When will actua design work and procurement be remotely in the radar???

My guess is they are going to add a bit of clarity to some of the money that is already in the budget, not promise new money.

 

[Allandale25]

Update:

Announcement location in Quebec City.

Media Advisory - Minister Alghabra, Minister Duclos, Minister Champagne, Parliamentary Secretary Lightbound and the Mayor Labeaume to make an announcement on High Frequency Rail in Quebec City

The Minister of Transport, the Honourable Omar Alghabra, the President of the Treasury Board, the Honourable Jean-Yves Duclos, the Minister of Innovation, Science and Industry, the Honourable François-Philippe Champagne, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency...

finance.yahoo.com

 

[crs1026]

^Notice the emphasis on "High Frequency Rail in Quebec"

Perhaps this helps derisk the larger project - it was the Quebec leg that was deemed not supported by the BCA.

- Paul

 

[nfitz]

Presumably an announcement that they'll resume the north-shore service through Trois-Rivieres, with some upgrades to the track using some of the recently announced money.

Certainly the low-hanging fruit in the HFR project. Probably could do the required track upgrades, for the price of getting HFR from Union to Markham Road - if not Leaside.

 

[Reecemartin]

Apparently speeds of up to 200kph, thats high speed rail baby

https://twitter.com/x/status/1412108012559417348

 

[ManyQuestions]

Apparently speeds of up to 200kph, thats high speed rail baby

https://twitter.com/x/status/1412108012559417348

This is great news. 200kph operation means full grade separation in some sections. Likely means that they are currently just constructing the new tracks as non electrified lines with the speed being limited by the rolling stock. This is great because it means the higher speed operations should be possible with future electrification! My understanding is that this is both a huge upgrade right now and a path towards further massive improvements in the future!