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TTC: Sheppard Subway Expansion (Speculative)

GenerationW said:
Well then if there is a 2013 election, you can stay home and relax.
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So can you, because it's not happening.

First-term David Miller campaigned on a Sheppard extension, and lobbied hard for it in 2004 and into '05. Being the good politician he was, Miller certainly accepted Spadina once he realized he was trumped by Queen's Park, Ottawa, and York Region, but he never pushed on his own for Spadina

Miller's call for a DRL study was clearly a reaction to York Region making what appeared to be substantial progress in advancing a Yonge extension into Richmond Hill. It's a complete fiction to say that Miller (or Giambrone) was ever proactive on a DRL.
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Fine, but you are basically washing away the fact he did it by saying it was only because of york region. Whatever the reason was he tried and failed in this system. So transit city is born. Being around for as long as you have, you know that Ontario would rather play catch then be proactive. At least he tried.
 
I'm sorry, but how does this discussion about what Miller did have anything to do with the topic at hand? May we please focus on any potential extensions of the Sheppard Subway or SELRT instead of looking back?
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
So can you, because it's not happening.
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I'm betting on yes. We'll see.

Fine, but you are basically washing away the fact he did it by saying it was only because of york region. Whatever the reason was he tried and failed in this system. So transit city is born. Being around for as long as you have, you know that Ontario would rather play catch then be proactive. At least he tried.
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Your timeline is bass ackwards. Miller and Giambrone's initial Transit City press conference was in early 2007, and their transit plan for the next 10+ years did not include a DRL. The Yonge extension, spearheaded by York Region, gathered substantial momentum in '08 and '09. In reaction, Miller commissioned a DRL study in '09 or '10 (I forget which) during his last year of office. There was no trying and failing because there was essentially no trying.

If Miller had made the DRL the central feature of Transit City like he should have, it would be under construction right now.
 
GenerationW said:
I'm betting on yes. We'll see.

Your timeline is bass ackwards. Miller and Giambrone's initial Transit City press conference was in early 2007, and their transit plan for the next 10+ years did not include a DRL. The Yonge extension, spearheaded by York Region, gathered substantial momentum in '08 and '09. In reaction, Miller commissioned a DRL study in '09 or '10 (I forget which) during his last year of office. There was no trying and failing because there was essentially no trying.

If Miller had made the DRL the central feature of Transit City like he should have, it would be under construction right now.
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So it was a reaction, my bad. That does mean he at least talked about. I don't think the DRL would be underconstruction right now because 1 this is Toronto and 2 money.
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
I don't think the DRL would be underconstruction right now because 1 this is Toronto and 2 money.
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Why wouldn't it be? Eglinton was the centrepiece of Transit City and it's under construction right now, and is taking up most of the $8.4 billion the province gave us to spend on local transit in 2009-10. And it's being built despite Ford's initial opposition. The DRL would be a standard Toronto subway (which of course Ford loves), so I see no reason why it wouldn't be built if the DRL had been the centrepiece of Transit City instead of Eglinton.

But what's done is done.
 
GenerationW said:
Why wouldn't it be? Eglinton was the centrepiece of Transit City and it's under construction right now, and is taking up most of the $8.4 billion the province gave us to spend on local transit in 2009-10. And it's being built despite Ford's initial opposition. The DRL would be a standard Toronto subway (which of course Ford loves), so I see no reason why it wouldn't be built if the DRL had been the centrepiece of Transit City instead of Eglinton.

But what's done is done.
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Agreed.
 
EnviroTO said:
If Miller had made the DRL the central feature it would have not been Transit City... it would be Transit Downtown. The whole idea of Transit City was the "City" part.
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Ironically, he might have gotten more support/less opposition with that "Transit Downtown" than the Transit City that was shoved down everyone's throat.
 
11th said:
Ironically, he might have gotten more support/less opposition with that "Transit Downtown" than the Transit City that was shoved down everyone's throat.
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Shoved down everyone's throat? Why are you parotting the deranged rambling of the extreme right-wing? He campaigned on the ideas behind Transit City during the 2007 election, won support from every part of the city, and then implemented it when elected (a novel idea of actually doing what one promised to do in an election).
 
EnviroTO said:
If Miller had made the DRL the central feature it would have not been Transit City... it would be Transit Downtown. The whole idea of Transit City was the "City" part.
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The whole idea SHOULD have been to set proper priorities. Transit City, which ostensibly laid out the next 10-15 years of transit-building in Toronto, completely ignored a DRL (arguably our #1 local priority) and elevated a Sheppard LRT close to the top of the list. That made no sense.
 
GenerationW said:
The whole idea SHOULD have been to set proper priorities. Transit City, which ostensibly laid out the next 10-15 years of transit-building in Toronto, completely ignored a DRL (arguably our #1 local priority) and elevated a Sheppard LRT close to the top of the list. That made no sense.
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It wasn't ever presented as the next 10 to 15 years of transit-building. Only the LRT plan. Other avenues were also pursued at the same time, such as the Spadina extension, Yonge extension, DRL, express buses, and various BRTs.
 
nfitz said:
Shoved down everyone's throat? Why are you parotting the deranged rambling of the extreme right-wing? He campaigned on the ideas behind Transit City during the 2007 election, won support from every part of the city, and then implemented it when elected (a novel idea of actually doing what one promised to do in an election).
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We should stop labelling every opinion as either left or right wing, it's all relative. He was doing a decent job in his first term in my opinion. Beside, the election was in 2006, and Transit City only came on plan (publically?) in 2007. Even if he did campaigned Transit City (w/ at-grade) during the 2006 election, I'm sure most would've overlooked that and voted based on what he accomplished/did from 2003-2006. Or, maybe there really weren't any other strong candidates to choose from?
 
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11th said:
We should stop labelling everyone as either left or right wing. He was doing a decent job in his first term in my opinion. Beside, the election was in 2006, and Transit City only came on plan (publically?) in 2007.
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He campaigned on the ideas behind Transit City during the 2006 election (surface LRT in the suburbs instead of subways), and enacted it in 2007 after the election.

Personally I was always opposed to Transit City because it once again screwed the old City of Toronto in favour of the suburbs ... but what do you expect from a suburban mayor like Miller?
 
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