TTC: Other Items (catch all)

[Mind_the_gap]

Do passengers transferring from Line 1 to 4 still run up the stairs and along the platform at full speed at Sheppard-Yonge?

This always seemed like such a sadistic practice to me - making people wait for the closing door chime. Montréal does this better with their pre-departure chimes.

They switched back to beeping from the Parisian/Berlin/Stockholm doors closing horn sound.

Old/again:

 

[Kyle Campbell]

Do passengers transferring from Line 1 to 4 still run up the stairs and along the platform at full speed at Sheppard-Yonge?

This always seemed like such a sadistic practice to me - making people wait for the closing door chime. Montréal does this better with their pre-departure chimes.

They switched back to beeping from the Parisian/Berlin/Stockholm doors closing horn sound.

Old/again:

Not a beep, but in Ottawa there's an "Attention. The Line 2 train is departing" automated announcement about 30 seconds before they close the doors at Bayview.

 

[11th]

Do passengers transferring from Line 1 to 4 still run up the stairs and along the platform at full speed at Sheppard-Yonge?

This always seemed like such a sadistic practice to me - making people wait for the closing door chime. Montréal does this better with their pre-departure chimes.

They switched back to beeping from the Parisian/Berlin/Stockholm doors closing horn sound.

Old/again:

It's gotten "better" since they made trains park longer at Sheppard-Yonge. The next train usually pulls up shortly after the previous one had left the station.

 

[PL1]

It's gotten "better" since they made trains park longer at Sheppard-Yonge. The next train usually pulls up shortly after the previous one had left the station.

Why not a countdown timer at terminal stations? They do that on the UP and it works great! (Yes, this would be a longer term solution)

 

[JSF-1]

Do passengers transferring from Line 1 to 4 still run up the stairs and along the platform at full speed at Sheppard-Yonge?

This always seemed like such a sadistic practice to me - making people wait for the closing door chime. Montréal does this better with their pre-departure chimes.

They switched back to beeping from the Parisian/Berlin/Stockholm doors closing horn sound.

Old/again:

Honestly I think it would be neat if we did something like in Japan where a little jingle plays before its time for the train to leave. They also have just a buzzer at some stations but that's being phased out. Something like that would be nice, alongside other things I think we should adopt from our Japanese peers.

 

[Kyle Campbell]

Why not a countdown timer at terminal stations? They do that on the UP and it works great! (Yes, this would be a longer term solution)

Would that really be that hard? Couldn't you just put a screen at the top of the stairs, just using the same tech as on the platform itself?

Example from Ottawa, this screen is visible from the stairs and entrance on the line 2 level. I kind of wish they had it at the top of the stairs too, but at least when I get to the bottom I know if I should sprint over to the train.

I know people think dot matrix screens are meh, but you can't beat their visibility at a distance. But I'd expect in this case you could just add the same screen that displays ads and the next train time you see on every subway platform

 

[drum118]

Fare inspections expand to TTC bus network next week

March 14, 2025

Starting Monday morning, March 17, customers riding the bus network could be asked to show proof of payment as the TTC expands its crackdown on fare evasion to all modes.

Already, customers riding streetcars and entering subway stations through fare gates are subject to random fare inspections. Adding the bus network is another step in the TTC’s enhanced efforts to protect some of the $140 million lost to fare evasion yearly.

Those ticketed for fare evasion are subject to fines under TTC Bylaw #1.

“Despite a significant operating subsidy from the City of Toronto, the TTC still relies heavily on the farebox to fund our service. When people don’t pay, that impacts our ability to increase service and keep fares down,” said TTC CEO Greg Percy. “Our preference is that all customers pay for their rides rather than issuing tickets. We must let those who intentionally cheat the system know we’re serious.”

To maximize efficiency, inspections will be carried out on bus platforms at integrated stations where customers could be required to show proof-of-payment between exiting buses and entering the subway system.

All Fare Inspectors will be uniformed and equipped with body-worn cameras to record customer interactions. They will continue to use discretion to ensure tickets are issued fairly.

This is the third new fare evasion initiative implemented in the past several months.
Already, the TTC has started closing the ‘no-tap’ fare gates at subway stations, and in December, plain clothes fare inspectors were introduced.

More information on the TTC’s Fare Evasion program is available at https://www.ttc.ca/Fares-and-passes/Fare-information/Fare-evasion.

 

[Mihairokov]

All Fare Inspectors will be uniformed and equipped with body-worn cameras to record customer interactions.

Small victories, I guess. Plain-clothes fare inspectors was a very poor idea.

 

[T3G]

Small victories, I guess. Plain-clothes fare inspectors was a very poor idea.

How? Having fare inspectors in uniform just means people will pay if they happen to see someone. If you want to actually sort out the root of the problem, you need people undercover.

It's sneaky, but we all know the rules.

If there's going to be fare inspections on the bus network can we grow up and start boarding through all the doors please?

 

[Mihairokov]

How?

People in plain-clothes approaching passengers asking for PoP, which is occasionally credit cards and other payment methods, seems like a bad idea to me. Under normal circumstances if someone asks me for something on TTC, money or otherwise, I ignore them.

If you want to actually sort out the root of the problem, you need people undercover.

We'll disagree on this. I don't think it's reasonable to have people be undercover in any scenario.

 

[T3G]

People in plain-clothes approaching passengers asking for PoP, which is occasionally credit cards and other payment methods, seems like a bad idea to me. Under normal circumstances if someone asks me for something on TTC, money or otherwise, I ignore them.

We'll disagree on this. I don't think it's reasonable to have people be undercover in any scenario.

Allow me to issue a disclaimer first that fare evasion is not an issue that particularly concerns me. I do not lose sleep at night over the fact of people trying to game the system, and fare inspector is not a position I have any especial respect for. The money and time spent on focusing fare evasion should be directed instead to funding the system and making sure people gaming it do not bring it to its knees.

But if you are trying to enforce a type of behaviour through fines, advertising that there is an authority around to issue those fines is an ineffectual strategy. If you are a fare evader and you are waiting for the streetcar and see that there's fare inspectors waiting, you will tap, to avoid being fined. If you don't see them, especially if you are going for a short journey, you won't tap, and have a reasonable chance of getting away with it. You see this all the time on the roads - if there's a cop car around, people behave like angels, but if there isn't a cop around, people act like it's Mad Max. You'll behave when you think there will be consequences for it, and flaunt the rules when you think there won't be. If the aim is to change people's behaviours, this is not a good way to go about it.

But, like I said, fare evasion is not a concern to me and ultimately it is all one to me whether anyone ever gets their fare checked. But if, from the perspective of the TTC, you are trying to change behaviour, this is a fantastic own goal.

 

[Richard White]

How? Having fare inspectors in uniform just means people will pay if they happen to see someone. If you want to actually sort out the root of the problem, you need people undercover.

It's sneaky, but we all know the rules.

If there's going to be fare inspections on the bus network can we grow up and start boarding through all the doors please?

You also need Bus Operators to enforce the rules.

You won't believe how many times I see operators willfully ignore people with insufficient funds on their card or on them.

Back when my father was an operator it wasn't uncommon to have an operator park their bus and call control over a fare dispute.

Now they don't do that. Enabling fare evasion won't solve anything.

 

[T3G]

You also need Bus Operators to enforce the rules.

You won't believe how many times I see operators willfully ignore people with insufficient funds on their card or on them.

Back when my father was an operator it wasn't uncommon to have an operator park their bus and call control over a fare dispute.

Now they don't do that. Enabling fare evasion won't solve anything.

No, you don't.

I've made this exact same argument in this forum several times over the last year, so I apologize to all reading if this makes me sound like a broken record, but it is frustrating how this keeps coming up. Making bus operators enforce the rules makes about as much sense as having cashiers confront shoplifters. It's all well and good if you are built like a mountain, but there's lots of bus operators who are on the smaller side in terms of build, folk who can't reasonably go up against someone who could get violent when challenged, and you have older folk who are nearing retirement. The employment profile of the TTC is varied and diverse, and many of them plain and simple will not win in a fare dispute. They would be foolish to put themselves in harm's way over a matter of less than $4, and I have no respect for anyone who does.

And refusing to move a bus until a fare is paid is quite possibly the most atrocious form of customer service I have ever seen. Forget surly operators, forget not explaining the reasons why a bus is delayed - if I'm on the bus, it's probably because I want to get somewhere, and if we have to wait around till all hours while we solve a dispute of a matter less than - again - $4 worth, next time, I will remember how worthless the transit agency perceives my time to be and I will drive instead.

 

[drum118]

Small victories, I guess. Plain-clothes fare inspectors was a very poor idea.

Why??

You will find systems in Europe where a mob of enforcers in plains cloth jump onto a vehicle and pullout the their badge around their keck and started asking for your proof of payment. The first time it happen to me, I thought we were going to be beaten or robbed. They caught a fair number of rider who hadn't paid their fare and got a 100 euro ticket as that was the going fine back in 2012.

 

[Richard White]

Why??

You will find systems in Europe where a mob of enforcers in plains cloth jump onto a vehicle and pullout the their badge around their keck and started asking for your proof of payment. The first time it happen to me, I thought we were going to be beaten or robbed. They caught a fair number of rider who hadn't paid their fare and got a 100 euro ticket as that was the going fine back in 2012.

This happens all the time in Budapest. Uniformed fare inspectors are generally not a thing there.

They also have fare inspectors at the top of escalators checking the fares of those who come off the subway. 99% of the time you don't see them until they are too late however the locals have grown accustomed to them and always have their fare media close by.