TTC: Bloor Danforth Line 2 West Extension(s)

[Observer Walt]

Burnhamthorpe is clearly arterial along its whole length, by anyone's definition. MT buses go along Burnhamthorpe to Islington station mainly because there is no provision for them at Kipling.

Having said that, I do have some sympathy for the "Etobicoke NIMBYs", as they see inferior TTC service on Route 50 (no service at all after 10 pm on much of Burnhamthorpe), while MT buses zip by until 2 am. As Doady suggests, it would make perfectly good sense for Mississauga Route 26 to provide the service, and let the TTC redirect their resources elsewhere. It's another of those instances where protecting political turf seems to trump what would actually make the most sense for all concerned.

 

[dashingdan]

I'm not okay with Mississauga Transit running a Burnhamthorpe bus for the the TTC because it degrades the service for Mississauga residents who just want to get to the subway as quickly as possible. Of course, I believe there should be a direct bus from Square One to Kipling or Islington, with no stops.

 

[dashingdan]

I was sketching out possible routes to Mississauga City Centre from Kipling, and this is what I came up with:

1 The East Mall Station @ The East Mall & Dundas
2 Sherway Gardens Station @ The Queensway & The West Mall
3 Dixie Station @ Dixie & Dundas

(4) Tomken Station @ Tomken & Dundas
5 Cawthra Station @ Cawthra & Dundas
(6) Cliff Road Station @ Cliff Rd & Dundas
7 Hurontario-Dundas Station @ Hurontario & Dundas
(8) Central Parkway Station @ Central Pkwy & Hurontario
9 Mississauga City Centre Station @ Rathburn & Station Gate Rd

The stations in brackets I added because otherwise the stations were pretty far apart, and they could be left out and built later to save money. The first grouping, East Mall, Sherway and Dixie would be what I'd build first. Cawthra, Hurontario-Dundas and Mississauga City Centre would be next, and then Tomken, Cliff Rd and Central Pkwy could be added later as ridership or funds increased.

If you want to be more realistic though, you could just settle for East Mall & Sherway, or just East Mall lol.

In regards to the rail corridor the subway follows from Islington to Kipling, I wouldn't follow it. I'd follow Dundas, then dip down to get Sherway, and then come back up to meet Dundas at Dixie. Then I'd follow Dundas from Dixie to Hurontario, then go up Hurontario to MCC/Square One.
Cliff Road I only added as a midway station between Cawthra and Hurontario because I had Tomken as a station midway between Dixie and Cawthra.

I guess you could also just follow Dundas after East Mall, but there isn't really anything there: West Mall? so what, Etobicoke Creek? Toyota Dealership? Yeah, I think Sherway is the obvious choice.

 

[doady]

Hmm... there can't be a Hurontario-Dundas station if it goes to Square One. I think Hurontario-Dundas is a good enough terminus for the subway. It is quite an irban intersection by Mississauga standards, with lots of redevelopment potential. If people in SCC take take the Scarborough RT to the subway, then people in MCC can take the Hurontario LRT to get to the subway.

I'm not okay with Mississauga Transit running a Burnhamthorpe bus for the the TTC because it degrades the service for Mississauga residents who just want to get to the subway as quickly as possible. Of course, I believe there should be a direct bus from Square One to Kipling or Islington, with no stops.

It is GO Transit's job to provide the non-stop bus service, not MT's. MT already does provide express service along Burnhamthorpe anyways, so there is no reason for the 26 to not stop in Etobicoke, not that it doesn't in the first place since MT does have a few stops there.

 

[spmarshall]

You could also argue that it is GO Transit's job to provide rail service into Mississauga. I really think Mississauga is best served by proper regional rail service, and a good local network, including perhaps the Hurontario LRT.

This is why I'd prefer regional rail into Vaughan than the Sorbara subway serving nowhere north of York U. Regional rail can be upgraded relatively easily to meet demand or planning objectives. With a subway, it's all or nothing. I'd much rather see GO Transit get the money, with enough strings attached to forced the cabbageheads to build a real, affordable regional transit system, and not blow the money on a BRT following the 407 and more mega parking lots and engineering overbuilds.

 

[doady]

^ Well, the Milton line will be upgraded eventually and GO will be able to provide all day service, and I think that is good enough.

I doubt the Bloor-Danforth line will ever be extended into Mississauga anyways, considering that the city now wants to build an LRT line along Dundas East to connect the Hurontario LRT to the subway by 2031. So probably the only subway Mississauga has a chance of getting is the Eglinton subway.

 

[roch5220]

(4) Tomken Station @ Tomken & Dundas..............

I think the number of stops heading to MCC in Mississauga should be limited, to improve service times from MCC, and to reflect the the future of the Hurontario LRT. I would cut off the Hurontario stops and have a more direct line, depending on how much the planners use the Queensway hydro lines, towards MCC, and let the hwy 10 LRT cover hwy 10.

 

[dashingdan]

I agree the stops should be limited, and they are. But using a hydro ROW for a subway would be a mistake in my opinion. The subway should be built where the people are, i.e. along Dundas and Hurontario. Hurontario LRT notwithstanding, that's the logical place for a subway if you were to ever have one in Mississauga.

 

[cacruden]

So probably the only subway Mississauga has a chance of getting is the Eglinton subway

If I remember right -- the original "future plans" for the eglinton line was to go out to the airport.

Subway all the way to SQ/One though -- is a little long to go without an express line.

 

[cacruden]

But using a hydro ROW for a subway would be a mistake in my opinion

Agreed, it would limited it's use. Psycological barriers including walking into "wilderness" to catch a subway will likely reduce it's use.

 

[roch5220]

it would limited it's use. Psycological barriers including walking into "wilderness" to catch a subway will likely reduce it's use.

vs... what, stripmalls??
the only way a subway gets built to MCC is via the cheapest way. ie, utilizing hydro corridors whereever possible. It would be optimal, if cash wasn't an issue, to bury the line. But, its going to be above ground like portions of the existing subway network. I personally think extending past sherway gardens is a waste of money, and really, its got no business being going out there for many reasons I've already stated/debated, right or wrong, in past threads. But, you always gotta go back to $$$$ and politcs.

 

[cacruden]

^ In the same way the Gardiner is a psycological barrier to the waterfront. The first two years I lived in Toronto -- I never went south of the Gardiner -- to me -- it was the border of Toronto.

Yes, Strip malls with parking lots would also count to some extent.... low density - boring landscape tend to make the walk seem longer. Higher density with storefronts, walks seem shorter.

 

[cacruden]

My opinion (costly):

Subways that should be considered are: York University extension (only), Scarborough Town Centre Extension to Bloor line and Sheppard extension to STC, Eglinton Subway from Yonge to Airport, King or Queen Street from Yonge Street - through Dundas Station - up the most dense regions in that area -- with a tail linking into Sheppard East Extension. That would create a subway backbone to LRT and buses.

GO should be transformed into a regional express with lines that intersect the subway -- have common stations. (heavy GO stock will probably have to replaced with something that can run every 10 minutes or so). The current token system should be scrapped in favour of a Monthly pass (Zone system + Express surchare [GO] or no express surcharge [no GO]). The per-ride system should be changed to use electronic cards that are used for multiple purposes (i.e. city parking, etc.) -- the computers can allocate the funds based on parts of the systems used (i.e. card must be swiped on entry and exit). Go "trains" may short-turn at the edge of the GTA to reduce the frequency to a little less in areas that have less density (i.e. every second train goes to the line - or maybe every third).

 

[doady]

If I remember right -- the original "future plans" for the eglinton line was to go out to the airport.

Subway all the way to SQ/One though -- is a little long to go without an express line.

I meant any subway line in Mississauga, and the airport is in Mississauga.

vs... what, stripmalls??

People actually live and work in strip malls, but they don't in hydro corridors and strip malls can actually be redeveloped into something much better. I think if the subway line is not build along Dundas, then it shouldn't be built at all.

And really, Hurontario as transit corridor is bad enough already not having a subway connection and not being fully developed, so no need to spend billions of dollars just to make it worse.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

"Psycological barriers including walking into "wilderness" to catch a subway will likely reduce it's use."

Finch station is next to a hydro corridor but it's used over 90,000 times a day.