Transportation Issues

[SD2]

So then the people in North Toronto don't support transit, because they live in 4 bedroom houses with backyards?

Mike, large subdivisions and suburban layouts are not condusive to transit. GB is simply saying, if you want to live in the suburbs and enjoy the sprawl, you're going to have to accept that public transit isnt' going to be as efficient as it is in the downtown core.

 

[SD2]

Part of the problem with this forum -- and it is not unreasonable for this problem to emerge - is that there is a strong central 416 bias. There's some view that if you cannot afford to live downtown, you are somehow a morally and mentally inferior curiosity.

Any transit plan that suggests dealing with the GTA instead of only downtown, therefore, gets shot down.

Yes, that's a potential problem...but it's not the problem in this case. And I don't think anyone here has a problem with people who like the suburban lifestyle...I for one just don't happen to like it.

 

[miketoronto]

SD2 wrote:
"Mike, large subdivisions and suburban layouts are not condusive to transit. GB is simply saying, if you want to live in the suburbs and enjoy the sprawl, you're going to have to accept that public transit isnt' going to be as efficient as it is in the downtown core."

SD2. I am sorry, but that does not wash with me. If my area was built just like the Danforth lets say. I would still be facing the same transportation problems. My area is not some huge suburban mess. It has a high density due to apartment towers on the main roads. And the main street near my house supports higher transit frequancy's then many parts of inner city Toronto. So this thing that the suburbs can't support efficient transit, is not always true. Because my area has pretty good transit use for a suburban area.
The truth is, most of Toronto's 416 suburban areas, have transit use not that much lower then inner city Toronto. So our suburbs are supporting the buses.

And who says we are living in the suburbs and enjoying the sprawl. Do you think my parents decided on Scarborough because it was suburban? No. They ended up here just by chance, like most suburbanites. And being that we are not that far from downtown, there should be proper transit to downtown. Simple as that. We don't live in some far off bush suburb. Scarborough is only 15-20min from downtown, in most areas of Scarborough. It is far from a sprawl burb.

 

[SD2]

SD2 wrote:
"Mike, large subdivisions and suburban layouts are not condusive to transit. GB is simply saying, if you want to live in the suburbs and enjoy the sprawl, you're going to have to accept that public transit isnt' going to be as efficient as it is in the downtown core."

SD2. I am sorry, but that does not wash with me. If my area was built just like the Danforth lets say. I would still be facing the same transportation problems. My area is not some huge suburban mess. It has a high density due to apartment towers on the main roads. And the main street near my house supports higher transit frequancy's then many parts of inner city Toronto. So this thing that the suburbs can't support efficient transit, is not always true. Because my area has pretty good transit use for a suburban area.
The truth is, most of Toronto's 416 suburban areas, have transit use not that much lower then inner city Toronto. So our suburbs are supporting the buses.

And who says we are living in the suburbs and enjoying the sprawl. Do you think my parents decided on Scarborough because it was suburban? No. They ended up here just by chance, like most suburbanites. And being that we are not that far from downtown, there should be proper transit to downtown. Simple as that. We don't live in some far off bush suburb. Scarborough is only 15-20min from downtown, in most areas of Scarborough. It is far from a sprawl burb.

Okay...so your parents and most suburbanites ended up there "by chance"? But you frequently say suburbanites are ignorant and don't understand that they should be shopping downtown, etc.

What you don't seem to take into account is that not everyone in Scarborough lives where you do - Scarborough, for the most part is a sprawled out mess. Densities generally don't approach anything near what they do in the old city. It's simply not efficient to have the kind of transportation network and frequency you have serving downtown applied to an area like Scarborough.

If someone is going to live in a sprawled out area of North Scarborough, they're going to have to accept that transit simply won't be as fast as it is downtown (and on a lot of streets in Scarborough, transit is pretty good already).

It's not just an issue of disagreeing or agreeing with it - you have to factor in all the variables.

How exactly will you fund this elaborate transit network in a suburb like Scarborough?

 

[donmillsview]

How exactly will you fund this elaborate transit network in a suburb like Scarborough?

He won't. He just makes the point that it should be better, faster, more frequant (sic) and never bothers to consider the fact that the city is cash-strapped, the TTC is in big financial trouble and the Province and the Feds won't help.

If you dare to mention that little cash situation, you'll get the response that the City could find the money - his parents were poor when they came here and he knows tons of poor people who have stuff and then he'll say, "don't give me that."

But then again, I don't live in Scarborough (by choice or by chance), so what do I know...

 

[unimaginative2]

Mike. Let it go. You've made your point and you have some good ideas. Still, I think the point has been made and people have decided which side of the debate they are on. Both sides have valid points, and once everyone has decided like this, it is no longer worthwhile to keep trying to debate. It only creates hostility.