Toronto Union Station Revitalization | ?m | ?s | City of Toronto | NORR

[DSC]

Question about Union Station's exterior walls: Is this work complete in regards to restoring the walls? Does anyone know if they will still wash them later? They look good, don't get me wrong, but kind of dirty still at the same time. Not sure how they would be washed, but wondering if this is to come still.

The walls of the "centre block' and west wing are done; the walls of the east block are being done. They are 100 years old so will never look new (nor should they).

 

[mdrejhon]

Question about Union Station's exterior walls: Is this work complete in regards to restoring the walls? Does anyone know if they will still wash them later? They look good, don't get me wrong, but kind of dirty still at the same time. Not sure how they would be washed, but wondering if this is to come still.

The walls of the "centre block' and west wing are done; the walls of the east block are being done. They are 100 years old so will never look new (nor should they).

They cleaned and brightened the York side front facade, but they have not yet cleaned the Bay side front facade. I dont know what they used to make the York side look nearly as new as the 1920s, but it is possible to clean over 90 percent of 100 year old grime during a restorattion. Careful selection/use of a stone cleaner formula and an adjusted pressure washer can do wonders.

That is why the York end of the facade looks much brighter than the Bay end. Bay will be restored to match York.
They are not yet finished.

 

[TOareaFan]

That's not what the Toronto Life article says. It says:

"And that’s not all. With 165,000 square feet of new retail space planned at Union, “food and beverage will occupy approximately 65%” of that, according to Lawrence Zucker, President and CEO of Osmington Inc., the company responsible for leasing the city-owned retail spaces, most of them below-ground. Thirty thousand of those square feet—about the size of a floor of First Canadian Place—will consist of a St. Lawrence–type fresh market."

So 65% of 165,000 square feet (about 100,000 square feet) will be food and beverage, and 30,000 of those square feet will be a St. Lawrence style fresh market.

The people keep referring to Grand Central as inspiration, so I read this as suggesting Grand Central market, which is a St. Lawrence style fresh market with butchers, fishmongers, patisseries, green grocer, chocolate vendor, etc.

thanks....guess I don't read Toronto Life. I would caution that their ability to put in a 30k fresh market will be dependant on finding a tenant that, you know, wants to open a 30k fresh market....but, yes, it seems that is their intent.

 

[Grimace]

thanks....guess I don't read Toronto Life. I would caution that their ability to put in a 30k fresh market will be dependant on finding a tenant that, you know, wants to open a 30k fresh market....but, yes, it seems that is their intent.

The Toronto Life article was posted earlier in the thread and the original trigger to the discussion.

I hope they are not just looking for one tenant to open a 30,000 square foot fresh market, like some Longos thing. I don't know much about Osmington, but if they are in charge of the retail development they should be developing the format and style of the market themselves and leasing out stalls to various leading vendors in the City, just like SLM.

 

[TOareaFan]

The Toronto Life article was posted earlier in the thread and the original trigger to the discussion.

again, thanks...but I did not click on that link, then, was just responding to folks' comments with what I heard.

I hope they are not just looking for one tenant to open a 30,000 square foot fresh market, like some Longos thing. I don't know much about Osmington, but if they are in charge of the retail development they should be developing the format and style of the market themselves and leasing out stalls to various leading vendors in the City, just like SLM.

As a landlord, I would bet they would be more interested in the former than the latter.

 

[spaced]

St. Lawrence market is quite different than a supermarket; this has been the plan since it's inception. I remember David Miller saying something about attracting independent vendors, including approaching existing vendors at St. Lawrence.

 

[mdrejhon]

It's nice that it would be a world-class Grand Central Station style retail level.

I am pretty curious wondering what theme or styling they plan to use for the retail level. There's various concept diagrams here and there, but as we saw with the York teamways, reality can be very different from concept, especially when cheaping out. I hope they don't cheap out on styling. Will it be nouveux arts, or Urban Eatery style, or gaslight style, or?

It would be interesting to peer down the stairwell and see something refined, with a good eclectric mix of inexpensive and expensive establishments, in a setting that makes Union a destination for non-commuters.

Union will feel quite empty otherwise, with a sudden tripling of GO concourse space (look at how empty the newly opened York concourse is. It will be busy after Bay closes, but when Bay reopens with the new concourse copy of York, we'll have only 1/3rd passenger density in concourses without the shopping level, but with the addition of a completely separate 135,000 square foot shopping level, person density goes even lower, possibly 1/6th as busy in concourses in 2018 than today, if half of the people wait in the retail levels instead of the GO concourses. Enjoy the new retail levels instead when they have a longer wait. Union is really truly getting ready to swallow a doubling of passengers...

Hurry up, GO RER expansion -- Union might even feel temporarily empty-ish in 2018 momentarily pre-RER-expansion! So extremely attractive ecletric retail will be an attraction into itself, bringing non-transit visitors to Union, too.

 

[Grimace]

The combination of Presto and the 3 teamways have really reduced the need for the average commuter to actually go into the concourses. So I agree, it will need to make itself a bit of a destination to be busy. A 30k square foot grocery store will not do that.

 

[TOareaFan]

The combination of Presto and the 3 teamways have really reduced the need for the average commuter to actually go into the concourses. So I agree, it will need to make itself a bit of a destination to be busy. A 30k square foot grocery store will not do that.

Not when it is so close to a 47k s.f. grocery store

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

https://www.bisnow.com/toronto/news...ion-mill-street-pub-drake-general-store-45407

Mill Street Bar
Drake General Store
Balzac's Coffee
Union Chicken
Burger's Priest

set to open here. Maybe it is time to open a Union Station Retail thread in the Retail forum.

 

[mdrejhon]

Agreed. Retail is somewhat removed from transportation and there will be lots to say, especially as they open. 135,000 square feet of new downtown retail is nothing to sneeze at. I like hearing about it, but wonder if more than 50 percent of posts may become retail related as the work continues on gradually opening the lower level, section by section in a slow reveal.

 

[mdrejhon]

The combination of Presto and the 3 teamways have really reduced the need for the average commuter to actually go into the concourses. So I agree, it will need to make itself a bit of a destination to be busy. A 30k square foot grocery store will not do that.

Four teamways.
Bay east/west and York east/west. (York east is the new one)

 

[P23]

The combination of Presto and the 3 teamways have really reduced the need for the average commuter to actually go into the concourses. So I agree, it will need to make itself a bit of a destination to be busy. A 30k square foot grocery store will not do that.

I assume people living in the area will use it, since the only other grocery stores nearby are the Longo's near the ACC and Loblaws down Queen's Quay (I think)?

 

[88drums]

I assume people living in the area will use it, since the only other grocery stores nearby are the Longo's near the ACC and Loblaws down Queen's Quay (I think)?

Those are the big ones, but don't forget the mini Longo's under Brookfield Place, Sobey's at Queen's Quay and York, Rabba at Queen's Quay and Rees. Several options, though admittedly some are pretty small.

I love the idea of a fresh market in Union, but I think it will have to attract commuter/non-local customers in the face of all its nearby competition. I also expect that lugging a groceries through the country's busiest transit hub might not be for everyone...

 

[nfitz]

I also expect that lugging a groceries through the country's busiest transit hub might not be for everyone...

Not a huge grocery shop, but a steak, couple of potatoes, a veggie, and a bottle of wine isn't a tough load to bring home. And far faster than stopping at a huge suburban grocery store on the way home from the GO station.