Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

[anb]

I haven’t kept current on construction at Bramalea, but if the stub track and its platform are now complete and useable, they possibly could indeed do this - with very little additional demand on equipment and/or crewing.

- Paul

Actually almost 2 years ago when the London service was implemented, they went and “accidentally” added on 30 min service to Bramalea all day to the trip planner schedules. This wasn’t just any random error either, the schedules actually looked accurate and the added service ended at a certain time as well.

Considering this was around the time when Metrolinx added a lot of service starting with the West Harbour all day extension then the massive Sep 2021 improvements, then the London extension, it seemed like they genuinely wanted to go ahead and do the 30 min all day to Bramalea a couple weeks later but then the resurge of the pandemic basically ruined all those plans and we’re literally still in that slump to this day.

 

[christiesplits]

I was on the UPX for the first time in a few years, and noticed that their in-train magazine, On the UP Magazine, was discontinued. It was mostly ads and sponsored content, but it did seem consistent with the “premium” UPX brand.

 

[DSC]

I was on the UPX for the first time in a few years, and noticed that their in-train magazine, On the UP Magazine, was discontinued. It was mostly ads and sponsored content, but it did seem consistent with the “premium” UPX brand.

Not seen it since covid. I think UPX is now seen as another regular railway now - with higher prices than regular GO

 

[crs1026]

I was on the UPX for the first time in a few years, and noticed that their in-train magazine, On the UP Magazine, was discontinued. It was mostly ads and sponsored content, but it did seem consistent with the “premium” UPX brand.

UPX has shed its original brand. Things changed when the fares were adjusted after the initail price point was a fail. I don't see UPX as lacking appeal - the original "elite" branding was a boondoggle. The current service is just as marketable without it, maybe moreso. Most riders just look at their phones these days.

For that matter, I haven't seen one of those glossy airline magazine on an airplane in a long time. Similar issues - it's an expense that is wisely shed to achieve lower fares, which is what people seem to want. Any pretense of "elite" in air travel is illusory when your seat pitch is microscopic and you are battling for space in the overhead bins. And worrying about where your checked bags might be.

- Paul

 

[felix123]

UPX has shed its original brand. Things changed when the fares were adjusted after the initail price point was a fail. I don't see UPX as lacking appeal - the original "elite" branding was a boondoggle. The current service is just as marketable without it, maybe moreso. Most riders just look at their phones these days.

For that matter, I haven't seen one of those glossy airline magazine on an airplane in a long time. Similar issues - it's an expense that is wisely shed to achieve lower fares, which is what people seem to want. Any pretense of "elite" in air travel is illusory when your seat pitch is microscopic and you are battling for space in the overhead bins. And worrying about where your checked bags might be.

- Paul

Bamboo Airways still has them! A nice airline too.

 

[dowlingm]

How is more people using transit a huge problem for said transit??
If anything it will encourage more frequent trains

Did Union get a second UPX platform and the service get more DMUs and nobody announced it?

 

[Bordercollie]

Did Union get a second UPX platform and the service get more DMUs and nobody announced it?

I think that there was a plan to raise part of the platform for track 3? To allow trains to use that platform. I don't know what happened.

 

[ProjectEnd]

UPX has shed its original brand. Things changed when the fares were adjusted after the initail price point was a fail. I don't see UPX as lacking appeal - the original "elite" branding was a boondoggle. The current service is just as marketable without it, maybe moreso. Most riders just look at their phones these days.

For that matter, I haven't seen one of those glossy airline magazine on an airplane in a long time. Similar issues - it's an expense that is wisely shed to achieve lower fares, which is what people seem to want. Any pretense of "elite" in air travel is illusory when your seat pitch is microscopic and you are battling for space in the overhead bins. And worrying about where your checked bags might be.

- Paul

It's remarkable (and great) how many folks living at Bloor and Weston use it to commute into the core. I rode it earlier in the summer from Bloor to Pearson in the late afternoon / evening rush hour and it was jammed. In-city GO Stations (St. Clair, Mt. Dennis, Lansdowne, Liberty Village, etc.) can't come quick enough! While we're at it, why can't the Milton Line stop at Bloor or the Stouffville Line stop at Danforth and Scarborough again? Low hanging fruit here people.

 

[lenaitch]

Any pretense of "elite" in air travel is illusory when your seat pitch is microscopic and you are battling for space in the overhead bins. And worrying about where your checked bags might be.

Some of the long hauls still have it but just looking at the fare will give you the vapours. Our daughter and S-in-L just got back from Arizona and treated themselves to seat upgrade just for the space. It was only on the Detroit-Toronto leg and it was something like $5/seat.

To me, the seat pitch is only part of it. The whole process now treats you like cattle.

 

[vic]

It's remarkable (and great) how many folks living at Bloor and Weston use it to commute into the core. I rode it earlier in the summer from Bloor to Pearson in the late afternoon / evening rush hour and it was jammed. In-city GO Stations (St. Clair, Mt. Dennis, Lansdowne, Liberty Village, etc.) can't come quick enough! While we're at it, why can't the Milton Line stop at Bloor or the Stouffville Line stop at Danforth and Scarborough again? Low hanging fruit here people.

Our family has been taking the GO from Bloor lately instead of UP. Though frequency is less, the connection to the Lakeshore West trains to Hamilton, and coming back from Hamilton, are MUCH better. Quick platform change and only a few minutes of layover at Union. I hope that scheduling consistency stays.

 

[crs1026]

It's remarkable (and great) how many folks living at Bloor and Weston use it to commute into the core. I rode it earlier in the summer from Bloor to Pearson in the late afternoon / evening rush hour and it was jammed. In-city GO Stations (St. Clair, Mt. Dennis, Lansdowne, Liberty Village, etc.) can't come quick enough! While we're at it, why can't the Milton Line stop at Bloor or the Stouffville Line stop at Danforth and Scarborough again? Low hanging fruit here people.

My take on the Georgetown South Project is, it was a $1.5B investment that netted an airport shuttle (which the government of that day valued at $459M) but failed to achieve an effective commuter service (on which the balance ie $1.041B was arguably spent). Much of that commuter capacity was roughed in, but the full value of that investment has never been realised - if anything, there was always a need for another $1B to finish the job. Rather than push forward to the end result, which would have necessitated that added $1B in spending, Queens Park and ML have ragged the puck while making only baby steps towards a full buildout. In the interim, the notional scope has actually grown eg addition of Smarrtrack and ECLRT stations, Woodbine TOD, Kitchener 2WAD, and GO RER, but the pace has not picked up to absorb these new goals.

It never really made sense to complete the express airport shuttle ahead of the broader and more impactful commuter service which this line clearly can justify. And so we have the workaround solution of letting commuters fill empty seats on the airport trains.

Not very satisfactory, IMHO.

- Paul

 

[ProjectEnd]

My take on the Georgetown South Project is, it was a $1.5B investment that netted an airport shuttle (which the government of that day valued at $459M) but failed to achieve an effective commuter service (on which the balance ie $1.041B was arguably spent). Much of that commuter capacity was roughed in, but the full value of that investment has never been realised - if anything, there was always a need for another $1B to finish the job. Rather than push forward to the end result, which would have necessitated that added $1B in spending, Queens Park and ML have ragged the puck while making only baby steps towards a full buildout. In the interim, the notional scope has actually grown eg addition of Smarrtrack and ECLRT stations, Kitchener 2WAD, and GO RER, but the pace has not picked up to absorb these new goals.

It never really made sense to complete the express airport shuttle ahead of the broader and more impactful commuter service which this line clearly can justify. And so we have the workaround solution of letting commuters fill empty seats on the airport trains.

Not very satisfactory, IMHO.

- Paul

If it's Bloor to the core, having some Milton trains take additional riders there would help (but would necessitate the construction of an extra platform or a switch to the Weston to stop, then back to the Galt just north of Bloor Station). I haven't followed closely enough, but is Metrolinx considering 15 minute or half hour bi-directional service on the KW, at least to Malton (the last station on trackage that Metrolinx owns)?

@vic we use it in that way too. Though, to be fair, we'll generally just get on whichever train arrives first.

 

[voilan]

I haven't followed closely enough, but is Metrolinx considering 15 minute or half hour bi-directional service on the KW, at least to Malton (the last station on trackage that Metrolinx owns)?

They aren't announcing the full GO Expansion plans with the consortium until next year, but the currently announced plans are for 15min both ways all-day on Kitchener (with innuendo and social media speculation implying much higher, especially at peak) to Malton (EDIT: Bramalea).

 

[crs1026]

If it's Bloor to the core, having some Milton trains take additional riders there would help (but would necessitate the construction of an extra platform or a switch to the Weston to stop, then back to the Galt just north of Bloor Station). I haven't followed closely enough, but is Metrolinx considering 15 minute or half hour bi-directional service on the KW, at least to Malton (the last station on trackage that Metrolinx owns)?

@vic we use it in that way too. Though, to be fair, we'll generally just get on whichever train arrives first.

Having the Milton trains stop at Bloor clearly isn't in the cards at the moment. If we ever see a full 2WAD buildout to Milton it might be possible.

I do think that improvements to the Kitchener line may emerge faster than ML could design and build a platform on the Milton side of the tracks. Once those things happen, you won't care which line you are riding !

- Paul

 

[smallspy]

While we're at it, why can't the Milton Line stop at Bloor or the Stouffville Line stop at Danforth and Scarborough again? Low hanging fruit here people.

Milton @ Bloor - as of right now, there is no platform face on the Galt Sub track. This is thus a new platform that would have to be built. The bigger issue more-long term however is that the ROW is not wide enough for the second Galt Sub track (the second track ends immediately north of the station) AND a platform to service both of them. GO's long-term plans call for the double-track getting extended all the way south to Stratchan, but is it really going to be necessary in most of our lifetimes?

Stouffville @ Danforth & Scarborough - if you go back far enough (pre-1997, give or take), the few Stouffville trains serviced both of these stations. Then, GO declared that the ridership was such that Stouffville passengers were getting squeezed out of their trains by Lakeshore riders going to those stops, so they had the trains skip them. Fast-forward to 2015, and there were a number of trains rush hour that selectively stopped at either station, to give riders about a 15 minute service between Scarborough, Danforth and Union at the rush hours, but they never had the off-peak trains stop at either of those stations. And now, there seems to be no rush to have any of the Stouffville trains stop south of Kennedy anymore.

My take on the Georgetown South Project is, it was a $1.5B investment that netted an airport shuttle (which the government of that day valued at $459M) but failed to achieve an effective commuter service (on which the balance ie $1.041B was arguably spent). Much of that commuter capacity was roughed in, but the full value of that investment has never been realised - if anything, there was always a need for another $1B to finish the job. Rather than push forward to the end result, which would have necessitated that added $1B in spending, Queens Park and ML have ragged the puck while making only baby steps towards a full buildout. In the interim, the notional scope has actually grown eg addition of Smarrtrack and ECLRT stations, Woodbine TOD, Kitchener 2WAD, and GO RER, but the pace has not picked up to absorb these new goals.

It never really made sense to complete the express airport shuttle ahead of the broader and more impactful commuter service which this line clearly can justify. And so we have the workaround solution of letting commuters fill empty seats on the airport trains.

Not very satisfactory, IMHO.

- Paul

I don't know if I agree with the contention that "We spent all this money to not get a commuter service....". The project paid for a lot of track and signal improvements which were installed all the way up to Bramalea, and just because GO didn't start running bi-directional service right away wasn't due to the fixed plant not being ready - it was. For whatever reason, they were not. That shouldn't be on the project. That should be something that Metrolinx should have to answer for.

Dan