Toronto Ten York Street Condos | 224.02m | 65s | Tridel | Wallman Architects

steveve said:
Pretty much sums it up. Toronto: where quantity trumps quality every time.
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EVERY time? Let's keep things in perspective please. There are a bunch of average condos going up in recent years, but there are also great examples of all types of structures in this city.
 
Ryan_T said:
Nobody will look up at 300Front, the area has too much going on at street level.

TenYork will have the spotlight on it from all sides at the tower itself.
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That's not true at all. Every tourist who goes to the aquarium and CN Tower can't avoid seeing it. It dominates the view corridor from that public square beside Skydome. You can't avoid your eyes from going there because it's so prominent, so practically every tourist who visits this city gets to see our ugly spandrel mess. Thanks Tridel!
 
Torontovibe said:
That's not true at all. Every tourist who goes to the aquarium and CN Tower can't avoid seeing it. It dominates the view corridor from that public square beside Skydome. You can't avoid your eyes from going there because it's so prominent, so practically every tourist who visits this city gets to see our ugly spandrel mess. Thanks Tridel!
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Yeah, it makes little sense to me why Tridel would be comfortable building a piece of trash on Front st., but 'especially interested' in 'getting it right' on York st. The sign of a professional is doing everything to get everything right all the time.
 
It's a learning process.

They didn't think they were building a piece of trash on Front. Tridel are just getting out of the all-brick vernacular in the last while, and they are slowly getting used to the windowwall/spandrel/mullion thing. They honestly didn't get it when we started trashing 300 Front, they thought they were going to get something good looking, and were not aware just how pronounced those million mullions were going to be on the final product. Too bad they had to learn on such a large building in such a prominent location.

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Alright, fair enough. I didn't meant to be flippant--they certainly didn't know 300 would turn out like it did. I suppose what I'm disputing is whether they should have. Again, these are professionals dealing with massive, multi-million dollar projects. I just don't see those oversights as acceptable. Then again, I'm not an architect. But if I messed up a job that big, well, I wouldn't have a job.
 
You can't really lay this just at the architect's feet, I do think 300 Front is Tridel's fault. Wallman's original design is there for everyone to see in the renderings, and we were all pretty excited. To get that though, it would have had to have been curtain wall, etc., etc. Wallman has done good work for them on Reve of course, and all over town for a number of clients, so he knows how to create handsome stuff.

They are aware, all of them at Tridel, of the criticism of 300, although no-one involved wants to acknowledge that the building is a disappointment. They don't want a repeat at Ten York. Tridel does care about their reputation (which is sterling when it comes to customer satisfaction) and they want to extend it to architecture too. Apparently they are prepared to spend more on sleeker looking materials here. Wallman knows how to pull it off when the budget is there, so I am hopeful.

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wmedia said:
EVERY time? Let's keep things in perspective please. There are a bunch of average condos going up in recent years, but there are also great examples of all types of structures in this city.
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A truly iconic building that becomes a defining pinnacle of greatness. Yeah Right! they always said that everytime there's a new projects going on BUT in the END its very disappointing results. Just like what happened with L-Tower, Aura, Trump Tower, et al. ended cheaped out! esp. with L-Tower and Trump! Very disappointing product result!
 
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interchange42 said:
You can't really lay this just at the architect's feet, I do think 300 Front is Tridel's fault. Wallman's original design is there for everyone to see in the renderings, and we were all pretty excited. To get that though, it would have had to have been curtain wall, etc., etc. Wallman has done good work for them on Reve of course, and all over town for a number of clients, so he knows how to create handsome stuff.

They are aware, all of them at Tridel, of the criticism of 300, although no-one involved wants to acknowledge that the building is a disappointment. They don't want a repeat at Ten York. Tridel does care about their reputation (which is sterling when it comes to customer satisfaction) and they want to extend it to architecture too. Apparently they are prepared to spend more on sleeker looking materials here. Wallman knows how to pull it off when the budget is there, so I am hopeful.

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A question for you; When you say they didn't, at first, understand / expect the dissatisfaction with the final product at 300 Front ... are you referring solely this forum ? As I doubt too many others voiced their concerns about the project. Or did others (maybe in the industry) have a similar feeling toward the building ?

If it was mainly this forum, and they're aware of it, that is nothing short of amazing if you stop and think about it. You are saying that, our comments, matter to them ? Moreover, it may have influence over their future projects ?
 
I do know that many developers like to lurk the forums in some way.. Many read the criticism for their projects in some way I'm sure. This website isn't hidden among the development industry, they are well, well aware of it.
 
I know I'm living in a dream world for even thinking this, but wouldn't it be nice if in the not too distant future, Tridel, with their presumably vast wealth, were to revisit past mistakes (think 300 Front), and attempt to rectify them. It would certainly make me believe they had some civic pride.
 
Their biggest spandrel eyesore, imo, is Aristo. Be careful when driving west on the 401 west of Bayview, the sight of the building(s) may cause sudden screaming fits leading to inadvertent swerving at 110 kph. It's impossible to avoid seeing the hodge-podge spandrel "design", as the hundreds of thousands of drivers who pass by everyday can attest to. And you can't just blink and miss it. It's in your line of view for a good 20-30 seconds while going the speed limit, and a lot longer when it's rush-hour and you're stuck in stop-and-go traffic. I would take fifty 300 Front buildings over Aristo.

/rant
 
As for the spandrel mess at 300, it's really no different than the aluminum siding at the "crystal" at the ROM (and many other examples from our condo boom) - when the developer tells the architect to reduce the cost as much as possible - and you are in a city where you can get away with it - you get the economy model.

Cash trumps everything including the perception that developers might have "civic pride".
 
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