Toronto St Regis Toronto Hotel and Residences | 281.93m | 58s | JFC Capital | Zeidler

One Nut Kruk said:
It makes no sense as to why this hasn't been done yet. It would take no more than a few moments to line it up and install it into place. Truly a pathetic lack of pride and utter laziness.
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I assume that the trades who are waiting to be paid for work they've already done aren't about to do any more until they are.
 
interested said:
civdis, if this comment was in response to mine, please understand I was trying to make a point about this particular condo hotel.
Would you buy a residential condo in Trump today knowing the issues presently facing Trump condo hotel?
I don't know that it won't turn out to be a good investment or at least reasonable investment in the long run as your One King West has turned out. I believe you have acknowledged reasonable cash flow but less stellar capital appreciation.
My issue was more would I today buy a luxury residential condo in Trump or perhaps choose another building...for me personally, I would probably choose another building...who needs the uncertainty?
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Sorry, I'm just an overly sensitive One King owner that is tired of the broad brush of negativity that is applied to condo hotels. Truth is that if they are done right, they can be a good investment, or just a fun asset to own. I make much more in my commercial property business than anyone can hope to make in condos. I totally agree with your assessment of Trump. Stay very far away. A very rudimentary analysis of this "investment" would have rendered it a loser from the very beginning. Sorry to say that most investors in Trump likely had no business investing in this type of asset. If you have a very high net worth and wanted an urban cottage that spins off some cash while you're not using it, fine, but as an investment, there was no way this could work. I know because I looked at them when they were originally selling.
 
I understand that One King is fully booked some nights. They offer the lowest prices for a hotel in downtown Toronto.
 
civdis said:
Sorry, I'm just an overly sensitive One King owner that is tired of the broad brush of negativity that is applied to condo hotels. Truth is that if they are done right, they can be a good investment, or just a fun asset to own. I make much more in my commercial property business than anyone can hope to make in condos. I totally agree with your assessment of Trump. Stay very far away. A very rudimentary analysis of this "investment" would have rendered it a loser from the very beginning. Sorry to say that most investors in Trump likely had no business investing in this type of asset. If you have a very high net worth and wanted an urban cottage that spins off some cash while you're not using it, fine, but as an investment, there was no way this could work. I know because I looked at them when they were originally selling.
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No offence taken on my part.
I have to say that the experience with condo hotels in general in a lot of locations has not been good however.
I believe that part of the reason is that as you suggest some people view it as an investment and others as a place to use and an investment.
The problem is those viewing it as a place to use and an investment in my opinion make a decision which is not only a business decision and as such, applying a purely business model to it will mean that it will not "stack up".
If one does as you suggest...use the unit from time to time and use some additional income from when it is rented out, then it makes sense.
My concern when I looked at Trump originally was that I was worried what actually happened would happen...that a number of undercapitalized or borderline investors would be "relying" on the hotel rents to make ends meet. My concern was "what happens if occupancy or rents fall below expectation?" As you suggested I too felt the "investment" was too risky.

Interestingly, this has hurt I believe SL, 4S and the Ritz as well. While there are no hotel units, there is a shared model for expenses. However the hotel is independent and in the case of SL contributes 25% of the common element costs with 75% coming from the condo. The condos (floors 18 to 65) cannot be rented under 6 months and therefore the investors I thought would be better capitalized. None the less, I have heard that some lenders view all "condo/hotels" the same when it is clearly not the same model or risk...though I suppose if the 5 star hotel fails then it becomes another issue.

I have heard of some individuals having difficulty getting a conventional mortgage or being asked for higher down payments in SL. At least the taxes are at residential tax rates.
 
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If the contractors left a letter off to make a point and/or to try to encourage payment - it woulda been ironic if the sign said RUMP instead.
 
Seriously, what would it take to go up there and set the 'P' in place? It's so mind boggling that this hasn't been done, and probably won't happen for months, years?
 
One Nut Kruk said:
Seriously, what would it take to go up there and set the 'P' in place? It's so mind boggling that this hasn't been done, and probably won't happen for months, years?
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It would involve either A) setting up a scaffolding up there, which is in and of itself, a big task. or B) using the building maintenance stage (which I hear is still not operational) and setting up some sort of rig to hoist the "P". It's not a daunting task, but it isn't as simple as you suggest, either.
 
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