Toronto Rail Deck Development | 239.43m | 72s | Fengate | Sweeny &Co

[fanoftoronto]

Is it that much engineering marvel to pull off? Isn't CIBC square already doing this to connect the towers over the rail deck and build a park?

It's not a humongous engineering marvel to pull of building a park above an active rail corridor. But it is significantly more expensive than building a park on bare land.

CIBC has the benefit of have 2 massive office buildings to cover the cost of the decking and the park. And even still, it's only for maybe 60% of the total area of the rail corridor between Bay and Yonge streets.

Ultimately, as @Northern Light has alluded to, there are easier ways to bring park space to Toronto than decking over the rail corridor. We might get to that situation in the near to mid-future. And when we do get to that situation, we should be ensuring that at least 80% of the corridor between Bathurst and Spadina is parkland.

 

[Northern Light]

Is it that much engineering marvel to pull off? Isn't CIBC square already doing this to connect the towers over the rail deck and build a park?

@fanoftoronto 's response below is a good one..............

It's not a humongous engineering marvel to pull of building a park above an active rail corridor. But it is significantly more expensive than building a park on bare land.

CIBC has the benefit of have 2 massive office buildings to cover the cost of the decking and the park. And even still, it's only for maybe 60% of the total area of the rail corridor between Bay and Yonge streets.

Ultimately, as @Northern Light has alluded to, there are easier ways to bring park space to Toronto than decking over the rail corridor. We might get to that situation in the near to mid-future. And when we do get to that situation, we should be ensuring that at least 80% of the corridor between Bathurst and Spadina is parkland.

That said, a couple of points to add:

1) CIBC's space is a POPs, not a Park. The City is not the owner, and access to the space is restricted by the building management (it opens and closes each day)

2) The total space at CIBC is relatively small ~0.3ha or less than 1 acre. you're not putting a soccer pitch out there; its also structurally supported by/integrated to the adjacent buildings, which reduces the cost of construction substantially vs a stand-alone deck.

3) The USRC is smaller at CIBC, vs west of Spadina where you have a GO Rail yard present. The difference is an extra 40M or so to cover which is more than 50% greater.

4) CIBC Square Park isn't particularly easy to access, its multiple flights of escalators/stairs, 4 storeys into the air. For an accessible, easy to use park, you're going to need to have it meet surrounding streets, ideally with a very gentle grade into the park space before it then becomes level.

5) Any park on a deck will ultimately have to be scraped (removal of all vegetation and structure) every 25-40 years, in order to inspect structure, and refresh waterproofing membranes. This is expensive to maintain, and it minimizes the opportunity for long term tree canopy. Its one thing to do that for a < 1 acre space, its another entirely to do this at a large scale, as people would hope for with any 'Rail Deck' park.

 

[ProjectEnd]

There's this thing of having to stick the park thing over active rail tracks would likely be where most of said funds would be going to build this. To which should go without saying would require a massive amount of engineering feats to pull that off. Best to build parks where surfaces already exist, as opposed building it on thin air.

Same goes for buildings, if you want them to actually happen...

Is it that much engineering marvel to pull off? Isn't CIBC square already doing this to connect the towers over the rail deck and build a park?

It's a POPS, not a park. Also, Hines is paying for it so the City rightly ain't going to look that gift horse in the mouth.

 

[artemperederii]

If that is so impossible, why the guys (developers and city) talking about it and making any proposals? Are they stupid kids? I can’t get it…

 

[karledice]

Also Chicago did this 20 years ago

 

[Northern Light]

Also Chicago did this 20 years ago

View attachment 595777

Just so we're clear, Millennium Park, 20 years ago, cost 475M USD to deliver. Over 200M of that from private donors.

Adjust that for inflation, and the exchange rate and we get:

1.8 Billion CAD, conservatively.

A price of at least 83M per acre

Now, why do I say conservatively? Because the rail yard that was built over in Chicago was far less challenging than Toronto's.

Most of the Chicago site was former rail yard, and actually being used for surface parking. The park actually sits on the parking garage roof.

See site below:

Image Source: https://blogger.googleusercontent.c...ea3a8o3P/s1600/July+20%2C+2018+Blog+Photo.jpg

Given that difference conditions, I would factor in a difference in price of at least 100%

That would put the budget at over 166M per acre.

Simply put, we can do far better putting those kind of resources to work elsewhere.

 

[Skyhighzz]

This remains hot garbage.

The absolute nerve of them. All of them. So brutal.