Toronto Quayside | ?m | ?s | Dream

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I'm sure it's coming, but I expect Waterfront Toronto to probably distance themselves from David Adjaye. There are some serious sexual harassment allegations against him...and it doesn't look good that his victims' names were leaked to the media in Ghana. Quite a few institutions have already withdrawn.

Renowned architect Sir David Adjaye steps back from multiple projects amid sexual misconduct allegations​

https://www.cnn.com/style/david-adjaye-architect-misconduct-allegations/index.html

 

[ProjectEnd]

I do hope DREAM distance themselves from Adjaye here. Plenty of excellent architects out there and this project is still very preliminary. No sense in keeping him on through these *heinous* allegations (read The Financial Times' extensive investigation for some pretty damning quotes: https://www.ft.com/content/1a03a13c-a0b3-41c9-9a7b-702719ac6d58).

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

I saw that...

...and my faith in humanity took another gut punch. /bleh

 

[Northern Light]

I do hope DREAM distance themselves from Adjaye here. Plenty of excellent architects out there and this project is still very preliminary. No sense in keeping him on through these *heinous* allegations (read The Financial Times' extensive investigation for some pretty damning quotes: https://www.ft.com/content/1a03a13c-a0b3-41c9-9a7b-702719ac6d58).

I want them to keep this design, I quite like it.

But that's likely, mostly, in the hands of the local A of R now.

So, if Adjaye have their design fees, I don't necessarily see a big issue w/walking away, unless the requisite expertise is unique to them.

***

That said, I think we need to be careful w/big moves of this sort. I get that Adjaye the person is accused of some fairly poor, if not illegal conduct.

I don't condone that in the least, to the extent it is true. I read the FT piece and I find some merit in the case they've made. Though one would have to be blind not to see the challenge in 'proving' some of the allegations.

But, set that to one side for a moment, Adjaye the firm is a lot of people, people who will lose their jobs if Adjaye the firm goes under; I think there's a distinction there, and one that demands some caution.

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

But, set that to one side for a moment, Adjaye the firm is a lot of people, people who will lose their jobs if Adjaye the firm goes under; I think there's a distinction there, and one that demands some caution.

That would be the fault of the owner and not of clients who are bailing here. The consequences of having boundary issues when there's a lot at stake...the offender is the only one to blame for that.

 

[Northern Light]

That would be the fault of the owner and not of clients who are bailing here. The consequences of having boundary issues when there's a lot at stake...the offender is the only one to blame for that.

Sure, but does blame allow someone not at fault to keep their job?

To me, what you just said above amounts to, "as long as I feel I'm in the moral right, I don't care if your kids go hungry". I know you don't mean that, but that is the consequence of ruthlessly punishing hundreds for the actions of one.

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

Sure, but does blame allow someone not at fault to keep their job?

To me, what you just said above amounts to, "as long as I feel I'm in the moral right, I don't care if your kids go hungry". I know you don't mean that, but that is the consequence of ruthlessly punishing hundreds for the actions of one.

Which would be a straw man constructed of epic proportions if you actually believe that. As I said nothing about caring here...rather simply pointing out where the blame should least lie. But saying "you can't touch me or these people will lose their jobs" is likely the more problematic morality, IMO.

 

[Northern Light]

Which would be a straw man constructed of epic proportions if you actually believe that

I specifically said that I did not feel that you believed that. Please read my words as carefully as I choose them.

But saying "you can't touch me or these people will lose their jobs" is likely the more problematic morality, IMO.

I don't know where 'me' came into it; and I did not assert one could not touch Mr. Adjaye at all; I suggested that if evidence shows he is of guilty crossing lines (which certainly appears to be the case), it is he personally that should absorb a punishment, rather than his workers. He can lose equity in his firm, and money from his bank account etc.

But dropping the firm hurts others, not just him. Now it may be, that there is no other reasonable alternative, and to that extent, what I advised was a cautious approach.

Anything that gives off a reactionary vibe, to me, is to be treated with suspicion.

****

That said, perhaps we can return this thread to discussing this project, rather than one architect's alleged personal/business misdeeds.

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

I specifically said that I did not feel that you believed that. Please read my words as carefully as I choose them.



I don't know where 'me' came into it; and I did not assert one could not touch Mr. Adjaye at all; I suggested that if evidence shows he is of guilty crossing lines (which certainly appears to be the case), it is he personally that should absorb a punishment, rather than his workers. He can lose equity in his firm, and money from his bank account etc.

But dropping the firm hurts others, not just him. Now it may be, that there is no other reasonable alternative, and to that extent, what I advised was a cautious approach.

Anything that gives off a reactionary vibe, to me, is to be treated with suspicion.

****

That said, perhaps we can return this thread to discussing this project, rather than one architect's alleged personal/business misdeeds.

Either way, I suspect a way around the moral conundrum if the founder where to leave the firm in more capable hands and they in turn would rebrand themselves. That maybe messier, but less folks' jobs will likely be on the chopping block if that being the case.

....that said, I do believe this is still relevant to the topic because this growing elephant in the room may effect what is going to end up being built here. So it is something to still consider, IMO.

That also said, I am willing to agree to disagree on our points of contention here...and move on. Thanks for the debate on this though. /bows

 

[jxmyth_]

Has there been any similar cases where a projects plans get tossed due to an architects personal/criminal malfeasance? Just curious as to what stage in the process becomes “too late”. Also, is this one of those things where you’ve got one guy as the brand name, but the work is done by a pool of others under their guidance?

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

I would like to say St Regis from the *rump Tower...but in reality, that was changed entirely for different reasons than a sullied name. >.<

 

[Sunnyside]

Has there been any similar cases where a projects plans get tossed due to an architects personal/criminal malfeasance? Just curious as to what stage in the process becomes “too late”. Also, is this one of those things where you’ve got one guy as the brand name, but the work is done by a pool of others under their guidance?

Yeah, usually it’s an entire architectural firm behind the namesake architect which founded it. Zaha Hadid for instance still pumps out work AFAIK despite her having passed for many years now. This might be a bit messier considering Adjaye isn’t a name you’d want to keep if the situation turns for the worse, especially with the guy still kicking…

 

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[DSC]

The block on north side of QQE just west of Small Street does not appear to have a specific thread so, in the interim I post this here:

The whole block is fenced off with a Lions Demolition machine on site.

Application Detail​

Application:
Demolition Folder (DM)
Status:
Permit Issued
Location:
200 QUEENS QUAY E
TORONTO ON M5A 4K9
Ward 10: Spadina-Fort York
Application#:
23 177689 DEM 00 DM
Issued Date:
Sep 14, 2023
Project:
Office
Work:
Demolition
Description:
TOTAL DEMOLITION OF BUILDING

Inspection Process​

This is THIS block

 

[mburrrrr]

Hopefully this is the correct thread.
Only a few old low rise buildings left on QQ.

West end looking north