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We may have lots of examples here but there are hundreds, if not thousands of examples everywhere in the world. There is certainly nothing exclusive to Toronto about this 21st century modernism, as it's very much an 'international' style (pun intended?).

Green glass and precast: now that is unfortunately what we seen to have a monoply on. ;)
 
Local buildings, being produced by leading local architectural firms in the neo-Modernist style that continues our local architectural tradition, cannot be anything other than Toronto style buildings, regardless of what other people are doing elsewhere in the world.
 
"Local buildings, being produced by leading local architectural firms in the neo-Modernist style that continues our local architectural tradition, cannot be anything other than Toronto style buildings"

I'm not trying to be facetious, but what is distinctive about the neo-modernist style in Toronto? Are there distinct Toronto architectural traditions manifested in these newer buildings?
 
Well, Modernism came to Canada later than it did to Europe and the States for instance, and was less a force for social change associated with political polemic than a kinder, gentler stylistic thing. So our Modernism, which our local neo-Modernists are now building on, looked different and was situated in a different culture from foreign versions. Given our climate, those early buildings were also better built than the European ones! Our flirtation with PoMo was brief - apart from Missisauga City Hall I can't think of a Canadian example of much international significance - whereas it was stronger in the States - so the continuity with our Modernist tradition was smooth. None of the finalists in the Kitchener City Hall competition, for instance, which was held only a few years after Missisauga City Hall, were promoting PoMo designs.
 
OK- thanks. But don't most countries or regions have their own distinct take on Modernism in architecture? Surely that is the case with NM as well. I guess what I'm trying to ascertain is if there are certain common characteristics that are identifyable in NM in Toronto. For instance what architectural elements in say- 18 Yorkville, the Hudson, One Bedford- are present/absent that make them unique to Toronto? How would Cityplace fit into this?

Does Melbourne have it's own distinct 'Melbourne style' with regards to NM? :\
 
I would imagine that most cultural capitals worth their salt have always had distinctive takes on whatever the prevailing style is. Hence the absurdity of claiming that all neo-Modernism is interchangeable no matter where in the world it is situated. Our local neo-Modernists, working in a city with a unique cultural and design history, are building on and celebrating our own design traditions, using our own version of the Modernist lingua franca.
 
I think Babel's statements are for the most part, fair. I would not go so far as to call it a 'school' or 'movement' since as far as know Clewes and other Toronto architects are not teaching or pushing forward the movement in any significant way. But there is a unique style that is emmerging.

The best example of Toronto style architecture would be the 50's thru 70's, modernist and brutalist towers in the park. These were local takes on a style that had allready existed for 30 years or so in Europe, but the result is something that is unique to the city, and, it is worth noting, also influenced other cities across Canada. It is one of the traits of Canadian cities that makes them very easy to recognize, and this does constitute a style that is unique to Toronto. The same could be said for the influence that Vancouver has played over the past 20 years. Glass covered, point towers on podiums are now a common fixture in all Canadian cities, but it was Vancouver that started this trend.

And we have seen how Toronto has taken this form, in some cases transplanted it as is, in others attempting modifications and variations. Inevitabley it will mix with Toronto's own unique stylistic cues, become more refined, and the result will be something similair to what we are seeing taking place with a strong movement towards Neo-Modernist architecture that as each year passes does take on a more distinctive form.
 
Somewhere, in another thread, cdl42 recently remarked on how dreadful British architecture from the '60's and '70's was - I think he was talking about high rises. When I came to Toronto in 1970 I was amazed at all the "nice" new apartment buildings everywhere in this clean, tidy, optimistic and modernist city. Compared to tower blocks in the England I had just emigrated from they were attractive, spacious and well built - a good example of what you're talking about, Antiloop.
 
There is no unifying style between "18 Yorkville, the Hudson, One Bedford" and lets add the Festival Centre except "neo-modernism" which is a vague term and a much used international style. All these architects have their own take on neo-modernism, but it does not appear to be any unity in these 'takes' to warrent anything being called a 'style' or 'school.'
 
I'm not convinced yet of a Toronto style, but I consider myself genuinely open to the discussion. In some ways, I'd love it if I could with confidence state that I love the "Toronto style" of buildings. However, nothing in the thread has convinced me yet that such a style exists. To this end, I have written perhaps my longest post ever to propose a means by which we could arrive at such. For the style to exist, needs some criteria:

1) The idea and concept of the style must be a shared phenomen, that is, it must be accepted by a group of people as having a shared meaning. I could state that there is an "Eglinton East" style, and it could be very clear in my own mind what that is, but if no one else agrees with me it's of little interest, whether or not it makes sense to me. If three people agree that there is a Toronto style, but they all disagree about what it is, then the term itself is only valuable to the individual who uses it. I’d like to think that we’re all being invited to share in the Toronto style definition.

2) The style must be definable in language, it can’t exist only in the eye of the beholder without it being a Tweedledum phenomenon. Unfortunately, this is where I find the discussion most lacking. I've run through the posts and gathered some elements together:

- The style is developed by Toronto architects with identical creative hegemony / who design similar buildings / or is the dominant building style.
- neo-Modernist (sometimes timid and boxy, sometimes elegant and restrained). Subtle variations may give a nod to other styles.

In terms of an actual definition, this is all I can find. I find the first criteria, stated many times over in different ways, to be wanting in every way. It's not useful to indicate that the Toronto style is found mostly in Toronto. And it's hardly helpful to define the Toronto style as that of this or that particularly architectural firm that is based in Toronto. For such a definition to be useful, I would want it to help me make distinctions between "leading" or truly Toronto-style architects and the Burkas/Grazianas/EIRichmonds of the city. So, clearly it is going to have to do so without reference to the work of particular firms.

Also, I think the question of hegemony or dominance is highly debatable - given that so many postmodern buildings with historical references or absurd decorative elements continue to be built in the city. "Hegemony" might mean here that some buildings get a lot of attention and others do not, but we're also kind of a close to a self-fulfilling prophecy with that definition. The Toronto style seems unlikely to include the work of all Toronto architects or their buildings, or even the majority, and if not then I'd suggest dropping any “Toronto†references from the definition.

The second criteria is obviously where the meat will lie eventually – but so far all we have to work with is “neo-Modernistâ€. I think we can state that the style involves a modernist impulse somewhat updated, and that is excludes postmodern impulses (or does it? Babel and tudararms can work that out). I’d suggest that your definition should be useful to segregate not just Toronto buildings into categories of “Toronto Style†vs. “Could be anywhereâ€, but that it must also be sufficiently durable to distinguish Toronto neo-modernism from its counterparts in other cities.

3) Once the wording of a definition is proposed, we might choose some non-committal fellows to test it in the real world. If the definition can only exist rhetorically and can’t be applied to a good sample of buildings that actually exist in the city, it’s not much use.

Here we’d be doing two things. The first is identifying how useful the definition is in sorting out one Toronto building from another. We all know that 18 Yorkville is going to fall into the “Toronto style†rubric, and that “Princess Place†is not. If that’s all our definition can do, it’s not worth much. What I’d like to see is a written text that helps us to separate Infinity, the Met, Pond Road Residences, Zed, Equinox, and Waterparkcity into their respective boxes. And to do it without reference to the specific architectural firms involved.

The second thing would be to test run the definition against buildings from other cities, since the definition loses all meaning if it does not distinguish Toronto buildings from those in other cities. I’m sympathetic to Fuzzy’s attempt to do this through renderings – imperfect as it is – because this is really difficult to do without a travel budget. Ideally, we’d see the buildings first hand to really experience them.

I imagine the process would be iterative – the definition would enrich itself and grow as it is tested against real world phenomenon.

I wouldn’t expect perfection – all classifications tend to fuzz away at their edges and over time – but don’t those blurry and transitional areas often provide the most interest anyways?

Good luck.
 
Wow. Now that is a well written and thought out post.

You have provided an excellent foundation for furthering the discussion. I don't think I can disagree with anything stated.

And to be a complete and annoying broken record, I predict that we will find little that comes close to "hegemony or dominance" and almost nothing durable (or in my thought, unifying) to distinguish Toronto neo-modernism from its counterparts in other cities. At best, we will find some local architects with their own twist on neo-modernism, but nothing dominant (unifying) about those individual twists and/or distinquishable, in a 'Toronto' way, from the twists of non-local architects.
 
Wonderful post Archivist. You've laid out a good point of departure for us to narrow in on the issue, and in reading your post some ideas come to mind:

"1) The idea and concept of the style must be a shared phenomen, that is, it must be accepted by a group of people as having a shared meaning..."

- Historically speaking, a "style" or "school" is often not truly identified and/or recognized as such until after the fact, when a little wider perspective may be possible, so this lack of an existing consensus to which you refer may simply imply that it is a little premature for the notion of a "Toronto School" (I prefer this term), and how it may be defined, to have clearly entered our collective conscience. That said, I do think this discussion is timely as there definately seem to be rumblings, however sporadic, that this notion is slowly emerging. So, in this quest for a definition I think we must take some leap of faith in acknowledging that although not widespread there seem to be some signs that are compelling enough to at least warrant this idea.


"2) The style must be definable in language, it can’t exist only in the eye of the beholder without it being a Tweedledum phenomenon. Unfortunately, this is where I find the discussion most lacking. I've run through the posts and gathered some elements together..."

I prefer the notion of a "Toronto School" to that of a "Toronto Style" because I think that a school implies more of a socio-cultural and socio-historic phenomenon, rather than a purely aesthetic one. When talking of the Group of Seven for instance, or the 'Impressionists', it would be fairly easy to point out that there are more differences in the aesthetic of the different artists within the school than there may be similarities, though similarities exist nonetheless. So again, for the purposes of a definition I think we should be looking less for the strict characteristics of a pure aesthetic style as such, and more for defining aesthetic signifiers and signs, and the shared historic, social and cultural phenomenon that inform them.


"It's not useful to indicate that the Toronto style is found mostly in Toronto. And it's hardly helpful to define the Toronto style as that of this or that particularly architectural firm that is based in Toronto. For such a definition to be useful, I would want it to help me make distinctions between "leading" or truly Toronto-style architects and the Burkas/Grazianas/EIRichmonds of the city. So, clearly it is going to have to do so without reference to the work of particular firms."

- Further to my suggestions above, I would argue that the notion of a Toronto School should not be limited to local architects. In this age of "starchitects", globalism and international design competitions it would be nigh on impossible, and certainly futile, to seek to circumscribe a definition so tightly, and the fact that the work of a foreign architect may be common and popular elsewhere, even perhaps 'seminal' in other contexts, should not preclude it from being part of our definition of the Toronto School. As such, I would suggest it could be argued that works as seemingly disparate as the Diamond's FSC Opera House, Gehry's redesign of the AGO, Mies Van der Rohe's TD Centre, and Revell's NPS could be considered to be of the Toronto School, even though the architects themselves may not be.

"The Toronto style seems unlikely to include the work of all Toronto architects or their buildings, or even the majority, and if not then I'd suggest dropping any “Toronto†references from the definition."

- Indeed it would be impossible and futile to seek to represent all Toronto architects and all Toronto buildings in any definition. We must be careful to limit our notion of a school or style to a fairly specific timeframe, as clearly there are other pre-existing Toronto styles that were perhaps equally significant in their time and place; for instance, the predominance of the neo-gothic in early Toronto residential and civic building.

"I’d suggest that your definition should be useful to segregate not just Toronto buildings into categories of “Toronto Style†vs. “Could be anywhereâ€, but that it must also be sufficiently durable to distinguish Toronto neo-modernism from its counterparts in other cities."

AND:

"The second thing would be to test run the definition against buildings from other cities, since the definition loses all meaning if it does not distinguish Toronto buildings from those in other cities."

I think this is where we must be allowed the sin, or narcissism, of self-reference here: Whether the Toronto style or school is recognized or acknowledge beyond our civic border should be of little concern, as should whether buildings we might consider of the Toronto style existing elsewhere be. In other words, the fact that Second Empire buildings exist all around the world does not necessarily diminish the fact that Parisians may collectively view this as an essentially French style, school or movement.
 
That broadens the definition so much that it becomes meaningless.

If it can't be identified or recognized, if there are more differences than similarities, no "strict characteristics of a pure aesthetic style" and the style could be found anywhere and everywhere, the 'Toronto school' then becomes anything you want it to be....and thats the problem Archivist was (I think) trying to solve.
 
Second Empire was a French style, and Parisians have every right to describe it as their own, just as Torontonians now have a right to describe distinctive buildings produced by leading local architects with a unifying style described as neo-
Modernist as their own, or have a right to describe the variations of the Victorian 'bay and gable' style as ours. Bay and gable has proven to be "definable in language" despite variations between the works of individual architects who produced it.

The work of second rate talents should always be excluded from discussions of excellence: why on earth include the tawdry works of pippypoo and doodad-mongers in any definition of Toronto style, or use their exclusion from it as an excuse to take the word 'Toronto' out of the definition? Second rate talents form a hegemony of the irrelevant.

I don't see how you can bestow the honour of 'Toronto style' retroactively on Mies and Revell, or on Gehry either, because their individualistic styles have no sense of continuity with our local Modernist past - unlike the architects we're discussing.

The "Toronto style" vs. "Could be anywhere" issue is a great one though. The TD Centre could be anywhere ... but it is here! And it enhances our prestige as a city to have it here. But it isn't a distinctively locally designed building that helps set us apart with a unique sense of place. It is here ... but it could be anywhere.
 

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