UD2
Active Member
the problem with that area is that all the grocery stores are concentrated by Sheppard and NYCC, while there is nothing much at Yonge and Finch, which in all fairness is a more densely populated hub than Yonge and Empress.
Toronto Emerald Park Condos | 128.92m | 40s | Bazis | Rosario Varacalli
- Thread starter AlbertC
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Scudder
New Member
Yes Sobeys. I'm told it's a very small Urban store about the size of the one at Yonge and Davisville. They really struggle in Ontario and will have a minimal impact. Adonis also has an Urban format that has proved very successful in downtown Montreal and you can expect the same in this location. All about HMR in these formats and their offering will be completely different than the local competitors. Even from the Full size stores. They cater to the area. All about that. Metro knows their stuff and does their homework before launching anything. If it takes a little longer you know why. Well known for that and their earnings reflect it. The Metros people here see were the old A&P stores they bought and cleaned up while restructuring the provinces Banners. A&P was a disgrace and possibly the worst Managed Grocer. What is rolling out now is the Companies regular formats to fit today's needs thus the huge increase in HMR. Their Adonis banner is no different.
T&T is great but I certainly feel Adonis will be just as impressive but just in a different way but should be equally well received by most in the area.
I think they did a great job with Emerald Park. I thought the colours wouldn't be true or it would not fit in but seeing it finished I can honestly say I was wrong and now when completely done it should be the happening spot in the area. I agree with you on Whole Foods and a conventional Metro wouldn't have been much different.
Looking forward to the finished product!
11th
Senior Member
And if a new Adonis is to come to the area, Yonge/Finch would be a better location than Emerald Park - seeing how the Persian retail strip is to the north on Yonge St..
Although I recall there used to be a middle eastern grocer at Yonge/Churchill, which has since become an H mart.
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NorthYorkEd
Active Member
If it were me, I'd put Adonis in the current Metro location, or closer to Finch, and let the Emerald location be the new Metro "flagship". I also wish the Empress Loblaws would renovate to match the look of their Queen St West or Carlton locations. Maybe it's on their list, as I know they plan to revamp several stores.
This is certainly one of the perks to living in this area.
This is certainly one of the perks to living in this area.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
Where will the Sobeys be located?
Sobeys seems to only do well when they're the only grocery store around like in a cluster of condos and no other supermarkets within walking distance. As such Sobeys tend to do better downtown where fewer people drive and its a hassle carring grocery on a bike or on transit. Here in NYCC, more people drive and if they don't like your selection or price, they'll drive somewhere else,... but now, with all the grocery stores - they'll just walk to the next grocery store.
The condo and retails of EmeraldPark opens about 1 years after the condos and retails of HullmarkCentre,... the main reason for EmeraldPark delay was Bazis inability to get funding for EmeraldPark project after the 2008 financial crisis,.... but what if the financial crisis never happend or if Bazis was better connected on Bay Street,... what if Bazis was able to deliver on time in 2013,.. or better yet in 2011 as originally promised,.... what if Metro was able to open shop before WholeFoodsMarket,... or if Loblaws T&T had stayed as anchor,... bottom line, when buying into a building as residential tenant or commercial retail tenant - you better be sure the developer can deliver on time
I'm not surprised that WholeFoodsMarket store isn't usually busy (only their cafe is busy),... I'm surprised that the store seems dead at times! That's what probably scared the heck out of Metro! I notice some WholeFoodsMarket shoppers are locals from condos or houses,... no difference really,... but I notice quite a few seems to be from midtown,... and it'll be interesting to see what happens when the midtown WholeFoodsMarket (Bayview north of Eglinton) opens in the fall.
Personally, I would really like to see T&T have an urban format store about a quarter or even half the size of a conventional T&T. It's easier said then done,... with ethnic stores like Adonis and T&T, freshness and ready made food are primary and thats usually means having the facilities to make the fresh food on site which is very tough to do with a smaller footprint. IE Most of the bake goods at the Warden T&T are baked on site where as those at Promenade T&T and EmpressWalk Loblaws are done offsite at a warehouse and the quality is very differen
t!
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
But is there actually adequate supermarket retail space at decent price for Adonis to go in at Yonge & Finch area? A supermarket isn't going to acquire a big plot of land and then build their own supermarket store,... not around here,... they'll need to set up as the retail anchor of a condo/office development,...
That's like saying T&T should be in Dundas&Spadina Chinatown,... problem is T&T will never find adequate supermarket retail space at decent price in downtown Chinatown,... and even if they could, a clean decent paying T&T in Chinatown would NEVER be able to compete pricewise against the other established supermarket (generally dirty and very low wage) already in Chinatown. So T&T located their downtown store way out on Cherry Street in the Docks - Cherry Beach area,... literally in the middle of nowhere and expect customer to drive to that T&T store,.... and that T&T store is usually quite busy!
Why would Adonis set up shop next to the MiddleEastern stores on Yonge between Cummer & Steeles? Adonis would be next to some of their smaller competitors, why???? A supermarket like Adonis is a magnet,.... MiddleEastern people from all over will travel to Adonis,.... Adonis doesn't have to locate in an area with established MiddleEastern stores that they'll have to compete against,....
The thing about brand name ethnic stores like Adonis and T&T is that they can set up shop anywhere they'd like, not only would their customers would come to them,... but they'd also get complimentary businesses setting up nearby as well. T&T opened a store in Promenade Mall (in a non-Asian part of town) and next thing you know is other Chinese busineses (Chinese restaurant, Chinese herb store, Chinese travel agency, Chinese gift shop, etc,..) open near T&T in that part of the mall. And over time, more Chinese would buy condos or houses nearby because there's a T&T in the neighbourhood,.... thus, Adonis at EmeraldPark will also mean other MiddleEastern businesses will set up in EmeraldParka as well and we should see more MiddleEastern folks move into NYCC.
Metro - Adonis probably got a very good price for the EmeraldPark location because the anchor tenant Loblaws T&T bailed in 2013. The developer of EmeraldPark needed another anchor tenant,... much more than any anchor tenant grocery store needed this developer!
urbandreamer
recession proof
I know nothing about this Adonis but why can't they open some locations south of Dupont? Maybe in the Condo District?
11th
Senior Member
They (Metro-Adonis) probably do not want to waste any time in waiting for the decent sized retail space. There is still talk about the redevelopment of Newtonbrook plaza at Cummer/Finch, and I don't think the Food Basics will be included in whatever new be built at that location. That is the perfect location for Adonis in my opinion. The billboard at Yonge and Cummer (NE corner) literally screams "open here" at Adonis.
A note on the Promenade T&T location, that part of Thornhill wasn't as non-east-Asian as it seemed - even before T&T set up shop there - as evident by the plazas on Yonge north of Steeles - of course it cannot be compared to the likes of Richmond Hill and other area of Markham.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
That FoodBasics is another division of Metro, been there forever since Steinberg and likely various interation of Miracle-Dominion-FoodBasics,.... it has a strong history with the people in that neighbourhood,.... so it would be a shame if FoodBasics or at least another Metro company like Metro itself or Adonis were not part of that new development,....
Anyways that whole strip of Yonge north of Finch Hydro Corridor to Steeles including at Newtonbrook plaza is under the North Yonge Study,... city want to allow high density development there (40 storey at nodes) only after subway get extended north of Finch to Steeles,... you need the transit infrastructure to support high density development,.... that subway extention will happen in about 30 years,... according to the city,...
That's why the city is opposing the Newtonbrook development which the developer wants to happen ASAP.
Uncle Meat
New Member
From a recent article in Canadian Grocer:
"Adonis’s roots in Montreal are as a Middle Eastern grocer. But in Ontario it is targeting “most multicultural communities” including Chinese and South Asian shoppers..."
It indeed sounds like they have it all figured out with respect to the location at Emerald Park, esp. since Willowdale has a large Asian population. That, coupled with a location on the subway line and near the 401 should guarantee its success.
Anyone know when the store is opening ?
Link to full article on the Scarborough store opening:
http://www.canadiangrocer.com/top-s...s-opens-second-grocery-store-in-ontario-40277
"Adonis’s roots in Montreal are as a Middle Eastern grocer. But in Ontario it is targeting “most multicultural communities” including Chinese and South Asian shoppers..."
It indeed sounds like they have it all figured out with respect to the location at Emerald Park, esp. since Willowdale has a large Asian population. That, coupled with a location on the subway line and near the 401 should guarantee its success.
Anyone know when the store is opening ?
Link to full article on the Scarborough store opening:
http://www.canadiangrocer.com/top-s...s-opens-second-grocery-store-in-ontario-40277
someMidTowner
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
mkerian
Active Member
Wait you can fly drones over highways?
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
You just can't fly drone near airports,.... but then again with the way some folks drive like they're about to take-off on Highway 401,..... hmmmm,....
Anyways, Jack Landau did an UrbanToronto article on "Emerald Park Approching Completion In North York": http://urbantoronto.ca/news/2015/08/emerald-park-condos-approaching-completion-north-york
They're getting ready to pour cement for new pedestrian sidewalk on Yonge Street.
I'm hearing some of the commercial retails should be handed off to new owners on Sept 15,.... give them some time to do what they need to do and retail should start opening maybe in late Sept and early Oct,... hopefully.
Wished the same could be said about EmeraldPark TTC subway entrance (Sheppard-Yonge Station south entrance at Poyntz),.... was originally supposed to reopen "early 2015" then "July 2015" but now delayed til "Feb 2016",.... which probably really mean July or August of 2016
![IMG_9127[1].JPG](//cdn.skyrisecities.com/forum/attachments/img_9127-1-jpg.53397/ "IMG_9127[1].JPG")
Anyways, Jack Landau did an UrbanToronto article on "Emerald Park Approching Completion In North York": http://urbantoronto.ca/news/2015/08/emerald-park-condos-approaching-completion-north-york
They're getting ready to pour cement for new pedestrian sidewalk on Yonge Street.
I'm hearing some of the commercial retails should be handed off to new owners on Sept 15,.... give them some time to do what they need to do and retail should start opening maybe in late Sept and early Oct,... hopefully.
Wished the same could be said about EmeraldPark TTC subway entrance (Sheppard-Yonge Station south entrance at Poyntz),.... was originally supposed to reopen "early 2015" then "July 2015" but now delayed til "Feb 2016",.... which probably really mean July or August of 2016
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Marcanadian
Moderator
Toronto
Uncle Meat
New Member
I could not believe what I am reading and had to read it twice. It will take until February to put the tiles in ! China would build half a subway station in that time.